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David 
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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I don't think continuing this war indefinitely is in Putin's interests, and I think at this stage Russia would be happy to back out as long as they can spin it as a victory. Keep in mind that any kind of workable treaty will likely mean that chunks of the annexed provinces remain under Russian control, which he would likely see as a win, as it's certainly more territory than they held when this started.
I guess it depends what his endgame is at this point: obviously regime change and/or slicing the country in half (presumably the initial goals) are off the table, so my assumption is that annexing the four eastern provinces in September 2022 was an attempt to stake a flag in the sand and make that the new goal. Having said that, fully holding those is probably about as unrealistic as Ukraine fully winning them back, so I suspect that any way forward will have to be some kind of compromise. That would be an unjust outcome, but I think everyone involved (including Zelenskyy and Biden) has to make a calculated decision here, given how much damage the war has done and is continuing to do to the country.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Magpietothemax 
magpietothemax
Joined: 28 Apr 2013
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| David wrote: | | I don't think continuing this war indefinitely is in Putin's interests, and I think at this stage Russia would be happy to back out as long as they can spin it as a victory |
Absolutely. The claim that Russia wants to conquer the rest of Europe is absurd, and is being used to justify the continuation and escalation of the war by NATO and the US. Russia's invasion in the first place was a defensive action against NATO's continued expansion and militarisation of its borders with Russia, as well as ongoing provocations by the pro-US government in Kiev. In much the same way, US imperialism is attempting to provoke China into a conflict with Taiwan in order to justify dragging China into a war backed and armed by the US. Russia has attempted to achieve a negotiated end to the war on several occasions, but each time the US has sabotaged the possibility of a cease fire. The strategic aim of the Biden administration is to weaken the Putin regime, and if possible instigate its overthrow by forces within russia itself in order to carve up Russia and access critical resources by forming deals with comprador capitalist regimes forming from the wreckage of Russia. The Biden administration's number one priority is to ensure the war with Russia drags on "as long as it takes" (that is, to the last Ukrainian). While the Biden administration remains in power, there will be no end to the war in Ukraine. This is deepening the crisis of the Biden administration itself, because the war in Ukraine (and in Gaza) is costing billions of dollars, which will be paid for by slashing public spending. One can see on the placards carried by pro-Palestine demonstrators in the US that millions are making the connection. Slogans such as: "Money for hospitals, not for bombs on Gaza" are common. Biden's popularity has plunged to the lowest levels ever - hence the belated efforts of the Democrats to try to get Trump banned from standing in the election. They have had 3 years to prosecute Trump for his crimes against the Constitution- instead, they prioritised keeping the two party system stable, and winning bipartisan support for the war against Russia. Only now, with Biden's popularity collapsing, have they finally made some kind of attempt to take some legal action against Trump's impending candidature.
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Free Julian Assange!!
Ice in the veins |
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pietillidie
Joined: 07 Jan 2005
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pietillidie
Joined: 07 Jan 2005
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pietillidie
Joined: 07 Jan 2005
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Culprit 
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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ISIS Terrorist attack in Russia. Who had Cheering on ISIS in 2024 on their Bingo Card?  |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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Who on earth would be cheering on the deaths of civilians?
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Culprit
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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| David wrote: | | Who on earth would be cheering on the deaths of civilians? |
Russians are killing civilians daily, I don't give a toss about Russian Civilians and there should be a lot more, then maybe they will get rid of their leader. |
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Jezza
2023 PREMIERS!
Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End
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^ Two wrongs don't make a right.
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Woods Of Ypres
Joined: 27 May 2003
Location: Yugoslavia
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| Culprit wrote: | | David wrote: | | Who on earth would be cheering on the deaths of civilians? |
Russians are killing civilians daily, I don't give a toss about Russian Civilians and there should be a lot more, then maybe they will get rid of their leader. |
most Russian civilians want no part of the war.
disgraceful thing to say |
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Magpietothemax
magpietothemax
Joined: 28 Apr 2013
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Glad to see all the posts here condemning the appalling conception that we should be happy about ISIS-K carrying out terrorist attacks in Russia.
ISIS-K most likely is a creature of the CIA, and there is no doubt that this act of terrorism is connected to the continued attempts by US imperialism to create chaos in Afghanistan, creating further pressure on Russia's southern flank, while the US and its NATO "allies" continue to escalate the war in Ukraine.
_________________
Free Julian Assange!!
Ice in the veins |
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Culprit
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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| Russians love Putin., Germans loved Hitler at the start until bombs started landing on their homes and the war and its impact became real. |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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^
A lot of the older ones probably do love him. with the state controlled media spinning 24/7 propaganda they don't know any different.
There's plenty who don't love him, but they're largely powerless to do anything. Elections are rigged, opposition die in gaol and and protestors are either shot or arrested and disappear.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Culprit
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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| ^^Same with Germany back in the late 30s. That is why the deaths need to be on their doorstep. It's a pity Ukraine doesn't have the long-range missiles that Russia has. Russian Civilians need to feel the pain and see the same death and distruction the Ukrainian Civilians see and maybe things may change. No matter what until that happens nothing will change. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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^
As far as I know, could be wrong, they actually have internet access in Russia, unlike China's great firewall, so those who want to know what's actually going on can find out, and plenty do and have.
If the Ukraine could land a few ICBM's on Moscow, I'm not sure if that would suddenly wake people up or just galvanise them in support of Putin, but having mangy terrorist groups killing civilians isn't supporting Ukraine, it's just terrorism for it's own sake.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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