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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003 Location: Andromeda
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Post subject: What's the right age for starting school? | |
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I came across this op-ed in The Age today suggesting that parents shouldn't be permitted to hold their children back from starting school for a year – though I must admit that I'm still not exactly sure what her argument is:
https://www.theage.com.au/national/nsw/take-away-the-choice-when-it-comes-to-starting-school-20210207-p570bg.html
We kept Ingmar back a year at the recommendation of his Kindergarten teacher in late 2019, as he was still reluctant to get involved in group activities and also progressing a little more slowly than other kids with his speech (a pretty common situation with bilingual children). While I was reluctant at first, it turned out to be a pretty fortuitous decision, as it ensured he didn't have his first year of school disrupted by COVID-19-related dramas – and, more importantly, he progressed a great deal over the last year in terms of his social skills, confidence and vocabulary, meaning that I quickly felt we'd made the right decision (and I was comforted to know that in places like Finland and Norway, where they seem to handle education better than us in most respects, children don't actually start school until 7).
I won't deny that it seems a little weird that he's starting school as a 6-year-old (his birthday is in November) in the same grade as one of his friends from kindergarten who is still yet to turn 5, but we all know children develop at different rates anyway, and I would presume primary teachers have the capacity to navigate that age range. And at any rate, whether or not he could have started school last year and been fine, there's no question that some children will be aided by having that flexibility at their disposal. So the article's argument – which boils down to worrying about parents having anxiety about making the right choice and the prospect of *gasp* older kids getting better grades! – seems to be trying to fix something that really isn't, as far as I can tell, a problem.
Maybe that's just me, though. Would be interested to hear others' thoughts: is there any merit in a greater standardisation of school entry ages? _________________ All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Tannin
Can't remember
Joined: 06 Aug 2006 Location: Huon Valley Tasmania
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There are issues with widely varying start ages. Younger children struggle with academic achievement, bullying, self-esteem, and forming friendships when other children are older and bigger.
Older children struggle with self-esteem when others question why they were "kept down".
Nevertheless, for the reasons you have outlined, some flexibility is essential. The current arrangements are about as least-worst as possible. _________________ �Let's eat Grandma.� Commas save lives! |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005 Location: In flagrante delicto
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My Grandson turned 5 last month, his dad made the decision last year to hold him back for a year because although he's intelligent and on par or above academically, he has the concentration span of a fruitfly and a general dislike of following rules.
He's decided to put him in a proper kindergarten this year rather than the day care he'd been in as that will provide better structure and preparation for school.
I think it's important to be sure that the kid is ready for it, not just that they've reached an arbitrary age where you're supposed to send them _________________ Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003 Location: Andromeda
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That sounds like a really good idea, Stui. I know kindergarten did wonders for Ingmar, certainly (he also did a mix of both daycare and kinder).
Does anyone else think it's interesting that they don't start until 7 in Finland and Sweden? I was quite surprised to learn that. Otherwise, it seems to me that Australia (presumably following the British system, where they also start at 5) has a relatively early start compared with most countries. It's interesting because this is one of those things where there's no obvious reason why we should have a different starting age to another country; these are all advanced Western democracies. The only difference is that Finnish educational outcomes seem much, much better compared to ours – which suggests that maybe they have something closer to the right approach.
You can see starting ages per country here:
https://expatchild.com/school-starting-ages-around-world/
(note that some of the data here may be incorrect – I was surprised enough by France apparently starting school at age 3 to look it up, and it turns out that this is the age they start preschool; primary school doesn't begin until age 6 there. I also appreciate that concepts like "preschool"/"kindergarten", "prep" and "primary school", and what is actually taught and expected at those levels, may vary significantly in practice from country to country.) _________________ All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Tannin
Can't remember
Joined: 06 Aug 2006 Location: Huon Valley Tasmania
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Correct weight, David. We start them early because Australian school authorities have this lunatic belief* that Australian parents are, on average, so effing terrible that even our broken excuse of an education system couldn't screw the little blighters up worse than their parents are already doing, and might just be slightly better.
(* The fact that this lunatic belief just happens to be true does not make it any less of a crazy thing to believe in. Don't believe me? As witnesses the Crown calls the aisles of any Big W on a Tuesday afternoon, and the suburb of Glenroy.) _________________ �Let's eat Grandma.� Commas save lives! |
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ronrat
Joined: 22 May 2006 Location: Thailand
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In Thailand it is about 3. But most have left by 14 or 15 in the villages because yje Mum and Dad want the money or a girl is now a mother. _________________ Annoying opposition supporters since 1967. |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Location: somewhere
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my eldest daughter is a feb baby, she was also quite immature, but very smart, i regret sending her because she was pushed around by several kids who were held back. it took a long while for her to out grow the bullies but she got through it. I completely skipped grade 3, as an oct baby i was a whole year younger, i was also immature, but obviously streets ahead education wise. I was bullied, partly because i was different, i had an english accent, had st vitus dance syndrome and because i was younger smaller but smarter, and i never played dumb!! but i was also bullied at home, so maybe i was ripe for picking.
so in my mind you did the right thing. just watch his behaviour, the held back bullies tended to think they were brighter, and when it came to sport, better, but they were just older. _________________ You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005 Location: In flagrante delicto
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^
I was a May kid. I started at kinder when I was 2 turning 3 and wanted to start school the year I turned 5 but wasn't allowed to. I remember doing a tour with mum and the teacher but government rules said no. I was so pissed off.
When I did start the next year we had a combined prep/grade 1 class so I ignored the prep work, did the grade 1 class work then helped some of the grade 1 kids do theirs. The teacher would write the problems on the blackboard and kids would take turns getting me to meet them at the bin up the front where we'd sharpen our pencils while I explained the answers to them until the teacher, with a grin, told me my pencil was sharp enough. I never got bullied in Primary school, high school was a different argument.
My daughter was 13 weeks prem and started school at regulation time and repeated Prep at teachers recommendation. She was pissed off but she just couldn't get her head around stuff. The penny dropped for her in around grade 3 and she took off from there. She said it was like one day, shit suddenly made sense. She got it. _________________ Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Location: somewhere
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stui magpie wrote: | ^
I was a May kid. I started at kinder when I was 2 turning 3 and wanted to start school the year I turned 5 but wasn't allowed to. I remember doing a tour with mum and the teacher but government rules said no. I was so pissed off.
When I did start the next year we had a combined prep/grade 1 class so I ignored the prep work, did the grade 1 class work then helped some of the grade 1 kids do theirs. The teacher would write the problems on the blackboard and kids would take turns getting me to meet them at the bin up the front where we'd sharpen our pencils while I explained the answers to them until the teacher, with a grin, told me my pencil was sharp enough. I never got bullied in Primary school, high school was a different argument.
My daughter was 13 weeks prem and started school at regulation time and repeated Prep at teachers recommendation. She was pissed off but she just couldn't get her head around stuff. The penny dropped for her in around grade 3 and she took off from there. She said it was like one day, shit suddenly made sense. She got it. |
junior was like that, she struggled til she got a really good teacher in grade 5, and away she went. she struggled with maths as their primary school had a shit programme, i taught the eldest her times tables in primary school, but she not fluent, junior was struggling before year 8, i spent summer teaching her her tables, she went from 'dummy maths(which mainly consisted of kids from her primary school) to the top class in 3 months!!
maths is my thing, hubby asked me something this morning i rattled it off and he questioned me, hes still living, just!! i dont take kindly to that!!! _________________ You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005 Location: In flagrante delicto
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^
man down, Aisle 3. _________________ Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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eddiesmith
Lets get ready to Rumble
Joined: 23 Nov 2004 Location: Lexus Centre
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Maths was always my strong suit, I always got told off for not showing my working as I could look at a problem and give the answer without going through the process they wanted followed. Was always a year ahead in maths at primary school. But I never worked hard enough in high school to do well at methods, I just kept cruising through school as most of it came naturally. If I worked harder I could have done so much better!
As for the original topic, my nephew is December and was prem and has autism, but they started him at 5 in Prep and he ended up doing two years of Prep, mostly as the first half of the first year was a waste cos the school he went to was hopeless, they waited till after census and they got their funding and suddenly heaps of problems occurred and he was out. New school isn’t much use for him learning things but they can cope with him.
But it’s because everyone is at different levels of development, a lot of it due to problems beyond anyone’s control that they shouldn’t be changing any rules to insist everyone goes at the same age. Some will be advanced and others will need more time. |
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Pies4shaw
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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That first paragraph reminds me just a little of Lady Catherine de Bourgh's immortal words in "Pride and Prejudice" upon hearing Elizabeth Bennett play the piano:
Quote: | There are few people in England I suppose, who have more true enjoyment of music than myself, or a better natural taste. If I had ever learnt, I should have been a great proficient. And so would Anne, if her health would have allowed her to apply. I am confident that she would have performed delightfully. |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003 Location: Andromeda
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Sounds like my career as a novelist. _________________ All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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watt price tully
Joined: 15 May 2007
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5 and over I reckon but horses for courses. Each child is individual and depends on their individual needs.
Because our kids went to a very small community run primary school it didn’t really matter. Both were 5 post July babies 31/7 and 25/8 then they were 5.5 when they started.
However, like dealing with baby reflux: get 1 Valium tablet, split it in half and give a piece to Lola and a piece to you and all will be swell 😉 _________________ “I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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