Are we forgetting Bucks?

[Legga]

After reading many posts on the BB, I find it hard to believe some of the statements about being patient, and "in 2-3 years", suggesting that there are people out there with crystal balls.

Firstly, we have the best footballer on our list that we have had in decades, and he is approaching retirement age. The youth policy is great, but when it succeeds (if it does), Bucks will be 32-33 years old, and looking for life after football. We have not capitalised on the ability of just about the best footballer in the league, because our recruiting staff, both pre-and present Judkins have shown an inability to recruit both established, quality players, as well as a some youth to bolster our future lists.

Here is my attempt at a crystal ball vision.
Leon Davis comes out of contract and goes home.
Chris Tarrant comes out of contract and is offered $1.5 million over 2 years by Carlton, and takes the contract.
Nick Davis accepts a contract with Sydney, thus snaring their 3rd B&F winner from Collingwood.
Rupert goes home, and Scotland walks out after another year playing at Williamstown.

Now, this is possibly "pie in the sky stuff", but after the player changes we have seen in the past 2 years, who is to say that the group that we are banking on taking us to the flag in 3 years will actually be playing together in 3 years.

My point to all of this is it is great to recruit and trade and draft for the future, but we are here and now, and we must also not forget that success is a tangible thing. We can gauge our success on what we have done, both past and present. We can not judge future success in the present as there are so many variables that will alter our course to perceived success.

My heart goes out to Bucks, because if we are realistic, and take emotion out of the equation, we have a very mediocre list, with a sprinkling of talent, but some major deficencies that we have not really strengthened for the NOW part of our football club. I would hate to see bucks miss out on another finals campaign in 2002, and log on to this site to read the well meaning supporters accept failure for another year, and hide behind the "in 2 years time" argument.

I don't accept that 7 years out of finals is a load we should have to bare with pleasure. I don't accept that we need to rebuild every year when every other club, and don't forget that we have performed worse than every other club in the league over the last 7 years (except Freo) seems to be able to improve within 2-3 years, and other clubs, Essendon and Carlton, maintain a successful club year in year out. I don't accept that the people we have working at our club are the best in their field, and I don't accept that as a shareholder or investor, my return on that investment (as a member) has been a dismal failure, yet I am told to be patient every year, and re-invest.

Ask our board, who are all captains of industry, would they expect to continue to put in money into a business that consistantly under performs every year, and makes terrible business decisions year in year out?

This is what they are asking of YOU as a member.

[junkboy75]

Legga, being a great buckley fan I do agree that I feel for the guy when he continually misses out on playing in the finals. had circumstances been different, that is, if he had stayed with Brisbane or gone to port power, he may well have won a few premiership medals or even a brownlow medal. But I for one am glad that he came to c’wood. He has provided much entertainment to a lot of people. He has shown loyalty and commitment to the club, and he has rode the waves of derision coming from the media and opposition fans after his less-than- prophetic remarks about coming to c’wood in order to play finals. He is an absolute champion who doesn’t need finals, brownlow medals or top 3 media rankings to vindicate his qualities. And, in all honesty, I think he will lead c’wood into the finals in 2002. bucks is a very fit player, who has hardly missed a game with c’wood, with the exception of when he broke his jaw, and I don’t see why he cannot do a Tuck, Bradley or Blakey and play well into his 30s.

my point of reference is different to yours. I see 1999 as the year when c’wood rose from the ashes, so to speak. This means that the five-year horizon for success has not been reached. I would rather wait 5 years than see the team overachieve in one year, then fall away. I’m not saying that the mistakes of the past should be entirely discounted, but even in their darkest moments, the pre-McGuire era did achieve a few significant things. They’ve ensured the very survival of the club, they secured the MCG tenancy deal which is now reaping the rewards for the club, they recruited Nathan Buckley. I disagree that freo were the only team to under perform in the last 7 years – how many finals did Richmond play in during the last 20 years? And, since 1999, I disagree that buckley has played with a mediocre list. This is the shite the media continually peddle, and is certainly not something I would expect c’wood fans to be spouting. Tarrant, lockyer, davis, fraser – these are not names to be sneezed at. To me, a mediocre list may play above themselves then get found out at the crucial times (read: Richmond). In the great c’wood victories this year – carlton, port, crows – and losses to Essendon, I did not think that c’wood played above themselves. I think it was a case of the quality of the team coming through that allowed them to take it right up against supposedly superior opposition.

Finally, your investment analogy is flawed. When investing in business, you rightfully expect financial dividends. I buy a c’wood membership to be entertained. I do not expect anything back from them except that they put out a team week in week out and I go to a ground to watch them. A poorly performing c’wood is better than no c’wood and, even during the dark times, I must say that there are games where I have been very entertained.

I do not expect to reap anything from the club except for the opportunity to watch the greatest team in the world.





"consectatio excellentiae"

[Magpie_Dan]

Legga not saying this to be smart but in all fairness get your hand off it!

You have yourown balls man, dont worry about a Crystal Ball!

Go Pies!

Dan

Go The Richo!

UNLEASH THE TURBO!

[MarkT]

Carlton have the attitude that they try and win the premiership ever year. They recruit what they need to make the jump from where they are to where they want to go. We don't have to follow Carlton by any means and I do agree with a general youth policy and sustainable improvement, but they have more premierships and have been far more successful in the last 40 years.

Who knows who will be left in 3 years time. Hopefully everyone (at least the ones we want) but would you rather win next year or have a chance to win 2 in 3 years? I'll take sucess next year and then work on the following year thanks.

[JiMc]

Legga I can sympathise with your frustration but the club has only got back on its feet in the last two years. I think there is only a handful of players that were there 3-4 years ago that are still there. These things take time and there is no point sacrificing your core group of players to satisfy the needs of supporters for one seasons taste of finals football.

The aim is to play finals year in year out and if it means one more year of missing out then be it. Personally I think we will play finals next year but obviously some of you dont.

[the prez]

Legga I've got 2 words for ya:TONY SHAW.
History shows that he was one of our finest players and captains but for most of his career had to endure defeat & failure.But like Bucks he was patient and forged on and when it came no one was more deserving of it.Same applies to Bucks.In many ways Bucks career is mirroring Shaw's in some ways.Which means the rewards are only just starting to come.

GO WOODS

[Brown26]

Legga: If we recruited older players (established) Buckley might win a premiership in two years. MIGHT. But having recruited OBree, Didak, Johnson, L. Davis, etc. Buckley is not pressured to play on the ball week in week out, so he can by 35 years old and play forward pocket ala Jarman. NIce though, 3 premierships within 6 years, him STILL playing. But you're right, let's trade for Misiti and Everit, get rid of Didak, any chance we had of taking advantage of this deep draft, trade the young guys, make Bucks retire at 32 fro ware and tear....

Pies for Premiers 2002, 3, 4, 5, 6....

[Legga]

Brown26, fair point, but when has Bucks not played on the ball?
Wasn't this why half of this board was screaming last season, that we were getting beaten out of the middle, and the footy dept. was telling us that the young guys were tired, yet we made very little chabge in selection, to rotate players in, and left Bucks to carry most of the weight.

As for trading Didak, I have never said to trade a player like him, but my point was that we did NOTHING. We will struggle to take advantage of a deep draft when our 1st two picks are 11 & 27. Should we have traded to get into the top 10? Look at our performances when we had high draft choices. They are probably 50/50. Tarrant at 7, Fraser at 1, Roach at 7, and trading no.3 in 98 for Licuria and Orchard. Some good some bad. Our best returns have been later in the draft, with Davis (both N & L), although Nick was Father-son, Johnno, Lonie, Rupert, Tarkyn etc.
For all the questionable things Judkins has done, his selections later in the draft have been quite good.

For that reason, is No.11 so valuable that we needed to hold on to it, when in past years we have traded higher selections. I think there we avenues to explore, and although I suspect we did explore some, it worries me to think that after 7 days of trading, we needed 15 more minutes which weren't allowed to secure Misiti and McAllister. The whole process this year has mistfyied me.

[CQ]

its bullshit that we finished 9th and get pick 11. why should freo get 2 picks, we can see theyre dickos and no matter what they get they always manage to %$^£$%^&%% it up, eg giving peter bell the arse and stuff like that. yeah they get croad (poor him) but they lose black. its ridiculous.

249

[Brown26]

You will have to trade quality (ie. Didak, OBree) to get quality.

Number 11 is a good draft pick in this draft - and while later numbers can get good returns, remember we had about 16 picks outside the top 10, and four inside the top ten, in the last 4 years, so we should've got a few players from those later picks.


We NOW don't need to play Buckley on the ball if we don't want too, even though he can still handle it quite well. Bucks can play for 5 -6 years more if he wants on the forward line, even if he loses pace or something like that. Didak goes on the ball, not a bad replacement.

Situation: Essendon have Misiti, they want Buckley for him, we say no, obviously. the next day, they come back ans say, ok, not Buckley, Tarrant. we say no. This continues for days as Essendon looks to see what other clubs will offer, and tries to get the best deal. 15 minutes before 2pm on tuesday, the dumbers ring up and say something totally different, like number 11 and 27 draft picks for him. Wow, out of left field, a reasonable, maybe, offer. Noel has to think about it, finalise it, luckily already had spoken to Misiti about playing for Collingwood, talk to MM, then try to get everyones signatures. Easily Essendon could've stuffed up, not us. they obviously would've shopped him around for as much as they could've got, trying to get us to up our offer.

we didn't want him that bad, so they came down, but without enough time to fill out the details.

Personally I don't want him anyway, he's only a HFF now, too slow for anywaere else, and he's not as good as Davis, and he's not taking a fit Adkins spot. so sorry Misiti, shows signs of a strong Pies' midfield for years to come.



Pies for Premiers 2002, 3, 4, 5, 6....