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Beginning of the End of Privacy on the Internet

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Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2017 3:29 pm
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^ TP, the thing about May and police numbers has been worked to death, with political claims and counter-claims. The truth would require a public inquiry, so soaked is it in politics. Firearms officers are certainly irrelevant, as they are only useful when murders have already taken place. The three borough market attackers were killed within eight minutes, which was about as good as could be expected. Intelligence officers are what is needed, and it is often claimed that these have risen in number.

In truth the U.K., for all its supposed austerity, runs a higher tax take than Australia and still has a 5% of GDP deficit each year. Public sector debt is around 85% of GDP, the level at which it starts to be dangerous according to the OECD. There is no real austerity, just continually loose fiscal policy, racking up debts for later generations to pay off.

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Last edited by Mugwump on Sat Jul 01, 2017 6:21 pm; edited 1 time in total
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think positive Libra

Side By Side


Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere

PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2017 3:43 pm
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Gee that's depressing
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HAL 

Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.


Joined: 17 Mar 2003


PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2017 3:44 pm
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Do you like talking to me?
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David Libra

I dare you to try


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:35 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

I usually don't bother reading spam email at work, but this one caught my eye – a fair bit more malicious than the classic Nigerian 411 scam. Obviously this is just a bluff and the spammer in question doesn't have access to such technology. But not everyone who receives this email will realise that, and given the percentage of people who watch porn – and the percentage within that who are from conservative or religious backgrounds, or who've seen less ethical or savoury stuff online – I'm guessing this is a pretty good get-rich-quick scheme. Takes the whole 'Ashley Madison' hack to another level.

Quote:
You as well as everybody have been warned many times. But, obviously you didnt use internet carefuly. Whats the problem?- U are thinking right now. So thats the thing that I set the virus on a web-site with videos for adults (site with pоrn content) (u know whats up). Victim was watching video for adults and device began functioning as rdp supplied with keylogger. So all cams and screen instantly started recording. After my virus got all ur contacts from messengers, e-mails and social networks. So what do we have now? I created a double screen video (1st part-screen rec.(you have a great interests lol), second- cam rec.) and all your contacts. Accordingly I suppose that three hundred fifteen usd is satis for this smallwee error. Here is My bitcoin wallet - 12FPFnFry1PtDJP7jM988iJQVdSwjsM8ij

Ask internet how to buy it. It isnt very hard. Just write "how to buy btc" Ill wait 1 day since reading this letter(I adjusted a special pixel in it, Ill know when you open it). If I don't recieve my btc Ill send video with you to all your contacts When I receive btc- the сompromising evidence will be erased.If u ask me to send evidence, reply yeah and Ill share video that I made with 3 contacts Ive collected from u.

Can go to cops, but finding me will take longer than one day, im from Kazahstan, so you will be shamed af.


The reason I'm posting this here is this: whether or not such technology is available for hackers at the moment (there's a Black Mirror episode in which this exact scenario occurs), there's no question that it will be possible one day. Which raises the question: has our society's obsession with privacy and shame led us to the point where most of us are potential victims of blackmail? And how can we get to a stage where, privacy or no privacy, we become immune to such threats?

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Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:00 am
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^ as an alternative, one could choose not to act shamefully, and accept the responsibility and risk when one has done so. I know it is unfashionably difficult. Wishing away shame from the human race is less likely to succeed than trying to change oneself.
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David Libra

I dare you to try


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:28 am
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Do you think the potential victims of such a scheme – i.e. anyone who's ever visited a porn site – deserve such a consequence, with all the humiliation it entails?
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Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 12:50 pm
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^ no, they do not deserve it. The punishment way outstrips the "crime". But most people do not "deserve" to get cancer, or car accidents, or the many interpersonal injustices that happen to them. Still, acting recklessly will always have consequences. If I could, I would stop these types of hackers, but we cannot. So the best response is simply not to use these sites, recognizing too that they are mostly an evil committed against love, sexuality and against women. We are all capable of avoiding them, and we will all fail occasionally because of our biology, but I don't think that wishing away shame is a better strategy than self-discipline. That is not the same as saying that people deserve excessive consequences for venial social sins ("sin" here being a metaphor, not meant literally).
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Tannin Capricorn

Can't remember


Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 1:31 pm
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^ That is one of the most blandly evil and judgmental posts I've seen here in quite a while.

David's spam scam is incredibly badly executed. You'd have to be an illiterate moron to fall for it. (Not that there is any great shortage of illiterate morons in this country.) And the sender's grasp of technology is very poor.

The most obvious lesson here (among many others) is that webcams should always be physically obscured except when you are actually using the device. (If you do ever use it - most people don't.) All it takes is 0.01 cents worth of sticky tape. (There are neater and more sophisticated methods, of course, but even with zero technical knowledge you can use sticky tape effectively.)

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David Libra

I dare you to try


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 2:39 pm
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Not electrical tape? Isn't sticky tape still transparent? Razz
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Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 3:38 pm
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Tannin wrote:
^ That is one of the most blandly evil and judgmental posts I've seen here in quite a while.


If you think that a post which points out that consumption of the kind of porn found on the internet is damaging, risky, probably inevitable for most of us, and best avoided is "evil", then your sense of evil is deranged. Libertarianism does that after a while.

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Tannin Capricorn

Can't remember


Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 3:49 pm
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David wrote:
Not electrical tape? Isn't sticky tape still transparent? Razz


No. It is translucent. Like a frosted window, it is sufficient to provide privacy. But by all means check and use an extra layer if required.

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Tannin Capricorn

Can't remember


Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 4:02 pm
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Mugwump wrote:
Tannin wrote:
^ That is one of the most blandly evil and judgmental posts I've seen here in quite a while.


If you think that a post which points out that consumption of the kind of porn found on the internet is damaging, risky, probably inevitable for most of us, and best avoided is "evil", then your sense of evil is deranged. Libertarianism does that after a while.


Very poor attempt at a logical answer. Go to the bottom of the class.

What you have tried to do here (consciously or unconsciously) is

(a) imply the worst possible interpretation (your phrase "of the kind of porn found on the internet") in order to pretend that the whole is equal to some selected (and quite likely imaginary) "worst" kind.

(b) preach your own outdated conservative mores as if there was something "right" or "moral" about them.

(c) pretend that a post (of mine) decrying your view that people who don't share your outmoded views deserve whatever evil befalls them was defending the likes and habits of those people, when in fact (of course) it was decrying your vengeful attitude to victims of crime.

What is your next trick? "She is a prostitute, she deserves to be raped?" That (unquestionably nasty) statement is based on exactly the same logic you applied in the post I objected to. Either you agree with both of them, or neither of them. No other possibility can exist. (Short of being content with wildly inconsistent logic between the two statements, of course, which does not strike me as your style.)

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Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 4:37 pm
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I am not going to bother defending myself against that disgusting attack. Nothing I wrote remotely resembles the attribution you have placed upon it, let alone the vile view you invented for me to hold. You should have the decency to read what I actually wrote and then apologise, but I recognise that its unlikely you will.
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Tannin Capricorn

Can't remember


Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 4:54 pm
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I read exactly what you wrote the first time. That's why I felt compelled to call you out on it. What a disgraceful blame-the-victim attitude it takes.
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David Libra

I dare you to try


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 6:47 pm
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Mugwump wrote:
^ no, they do not deserve it. The punishment way outstrips the "crime". But most people do not "deserve" to get cancer, or car accidents, or the many interpersonal injustices that happen to them. Still, acting recklessly will always have consequences. If I could, I would stop these types of hackers, but we cannot. So the best response is simply not to use these sites, recognizing too that they are mostly an evil committed against love, sexuality and against women. We are all capable of avoiding them, and we will all fail occasionally because of our biology, but I don't think that wishing away shame is a better strategy than self-discipline. That is not the same as saying that people deserve excessive consequences for venial social sins ("sin" here being a metaphor, not meant literally).


We can't stop hackers (well, not all of the time, at any rate), but we can try to stop one thing – a culture of sexual shaming. That's where we're diametrically opposed here: you see shame related to viewing pornography as a necessary and mostly warranted thing; I see it as mostly harmful and something worth fighting against.

This kind of blackmail attempt is working on two different levels: one is the pure humiliation of exposure; the concept of all of your friends and family members witnessing you (presumably) in a moment of sexual self-pleasuring, in a most private and vulnerable moment. Even though we've all done it, most of us do not want others to think of us as masturbators or people who watch videos of strangers screwing. For that alone, many people would be willing to pay the blackmail.

On some level, though, at least in our culture, we accept that we all have sex urges and that we all have had moments of self-pleasuring. The second fear is a darker and more complicated one, and something more or less uniquely tied to the uncensored vastness of the internet: the fact that not everything we've seen may be ethically produced or even legal (the latter category might include anything from consensual BDSM and golden showers to less clearly consensually sourced material, revenge porn and bestiality). We have a cultural view that people who consume such stuff are disgusting and worthy of condemnation and nobody wants to admit to having done so, but our society's dirtiest secret is that many of us have had encounters with such material. This is the sort of stuff that drives shame: a disconnect between who we are and how we present ourselves.

To test my hypothesis, at a family gathering last year – in the midst of a 'truth or dare' style game, after some alcohol had been consumed (and no, our parents were not in attendance!) – I asked my siblings if they had ever seen pornography involving people and animals. Of the six of us in attendance, five raised their hands. Now, it's conceivable that this is an entirely unrepresentative sample and that our peculiar upbringing has turned us all into especially objectionable perverts. But I suspect that the reason is rather more mundane: that some combination of natural curiosity and the kinkier recesses of the human sexual drive, combined with the unlimited, uncensored nature of the internet vastly increases the likelihood that ordinary people will encounter taboo material (there is also the possibility that people can chance upon such material unwillingly or through peer pressure).

That's not to give the viewer a free pass. I hope we can all agree that we should strive to be ethically engaged with what we view, and choose to avoid unethical material. But I really question whether shaming is an effective way to do that, and whether it tends to cause more harm than good.

That takes more than mere disapproval of the actions of hackers or a recognition that the punishment of public humiliation outstrips the crime. It means either vigorously reaffirming a right to privacy, or accepting its growing impossibility and adjusting our public reaction to privacy breaches accordingly. Most of all, because so many of these scenarios are about sex and the fear of sexual shaming, it entails a more sophisticated understanding of human sexuality and a greater acceptance of ourselves and others as sexual beings. As with any proposed cultural shift, it's far easier to conclude that it's needed than to devise practical ways of achieving it; but I hope that we can at least try harder.

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Last edited by David on Tue Aug 15, 2017 7:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
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