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King Monkey
Joined: 15 Apr 2009 Location: On a journey to seek the scriptures of enlightenment....
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There is definitely some merit in having a discussion.
Too many dismiss these sort of things because of the disdain they have for the person saying them.
My youngest is in grade 1 and has some learning and attention issues. He wouldn't have progressed as well as he has over the first 18 months of his school life if it weren't for the aides provided in the classroom to help him and a few others in his class, on top of the extraordinary efforts of his teachers who go well out of their way to assist him.
I can see the potential for other kids to not be given the attention they deserve under a less-well-run program in a different school with a different set-up.
Ultimately, I think it's best to make assessments on a case-by-case basis by liaising with teachers, parents, pediatricians,etc, rather than coming up with some sort of blanket policy.
There will be certain cases where everyone involved can benefit from a kid being pulled from "normal" class, including the kid. Where as there will be times when it's not necessary like my example above. Just as there will be times when pulling a kid would be wrong. _________________ "I am a great sage, equal of heaven.
Grow stick, grow.
Fly cloud, fly.
Oh you are a dee-mon, I love to fiiight." |
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watt price tully
Joined: 15 May 2007
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King Monkey wrote: | There is definitely some merit in having a discussion.
Too many dismiss these sort of things because of the disdain they have for the person saying them.
My youngest is in grade 1 and has some learning and attention issues. He wouldn't have progressed as well as he has over the first 18 months of his school life if it weren't for the aides provided in the classroom to help him and a few others in his class, on top of the extraordinary efforts of his teachers who go well out of their way to assist him.
I can see the potential for other kids to not be given the attention they deserve under a less-well-run program in a different school with a different set-up.
Ultimately, I think it's best to make assessments on a case-by-case basis by liaising with teachers, parents, pediatricians,etc, rather than coming up with some sort of blanket policy.
There will be certain cases where everyone involved can benefit from a kid being pulled from "normal" class, including the kid. Where as there will be times when it's not necessary like my example above. Just as there will be times when pulling a kid would be wrong. |
Absolutely KM, a case by case basis. It's just that Pauline wanted to politicise the issue unfortunately & used clumsy language to do so - it as also an effort on her behalf to deflect attention from scrutiny on other pressing matters regarding one nation.
I have a nephew who has autism (my wife would be his great aunt - I'm then the great uncle (shit that makes me feel old). The parents sent and send their kids to a Rudolph Steiner School in the outer suburbs and between the family, the extended family & the teachers the young fella is the most sociable autistic kid I know, really sweet kid. (I used to work with some ASD kids & services many moons ago). Adolescence is here so I'm sure there's going to be lots of fun.
A great article in the Age on Sunday:
"Senator Pauline Hanson certainly put the cat among the experts and the holier than thou brigade with her statement suggesting children with autism should be removed from mainstream classrooms so that other students are not held back. Sure, Senator Hanson's comments constituted a catch-all statement that missed the mark by failing to acknowledge that integration and inclusion can work. But and it is a significant but was she entirely wide of the mark in her inference that non-mainstream education is best for some children with special needs?......"
http://www.theage.com.au/comment/fallout-from-pauline-hanson-autism-remarks-teaches-us-plenty-20170627-gwzfn9.html _________________ âI even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didnât keep âem under long enoughâ Kinky Friedman |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007 Location: Between London and Melbourne
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^ There is probably violent agreement that (a) Hanson is not too smart ; and (b) case by case is the right framework, here. But I did pause at "senator Hanson wanted to politicize the issue..."
It's not really unreasonable for a politician to politicise a point about education practice and resourcing in a debate on schools funding.
She was typically blunt and clumsy in her thinking, but it was a reasonable point for a politician to make in parliament. I thought that what she she said was far more valid than the debate-shutting phony outrage howled by alternately lachrymose and bullying Labour politicians and the creepy Greens leader.
Imagine a world where people said, in parliament, "Senator, you raise a point that could be valid, but I think we have educational assessors who try to balance a complex system by assessing the needs of individual children. If you have evidence from your constituents that this is not working, then please discuss this with the secretary of education in your state, and I will review the implications in light of the SOS's report back. The education funding bill before us today will permit allocation of the right resources if the issue warrants it"
How much more productive might that be, compared to the hysterical and puerile "oohh ahh...she said a swear word" nonsense that actually ensued. _________________ Two more flags before I die!
Last edited by Mugwump on Tue Jul 04, 2017 11:13 am; edited 1 time in total |
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watt price tully
Joined: 15 May 2007
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Mugwump wrote: | ^ There is probably violent agreement that (a) Hanson is not too smart ; and (b) case by case is the right framework, here. But I did pause at "senator Hanson wanted to politicize the issue..."
It's not really unreasonable for a politician to politicise a point about education practice and resourcing in a debate on schools funding.
She was typically blunt and clumsy in her thinking, but it was a reasonable point for a politician to make in parliament. I thought that what she she said was far more valid than the debate-shutting phony outrage howled by alternately lachrymose and bullying Labour politicians and the creepy Greens leader. |
My comment about politicising the issue was linked to the fact One Nation needed to deflect attention from scrutiny on a host of issues including: their funding, potential breaches of the AEC rules, exploiting & alienating their traditional base, the role of the new Svengali, corrupt practices stemming from but not exclusive to the 4 Corners report. _________________ âI even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didnât keep âem under long enoughâ Kinky Friedman |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007 Location: Between London and Melbourne
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watt price tully wrote: | Mugwump wrote: | ^ There is probably violent agreement that (a) Hanson is not too smart ; and (b) case by case is the right framework, here. But I did pause at "senator Hanson wanted to politicize the issue..."
It's not really unreasonable for a politician to politicise a point about education practice and resourcing in a debate on schools funding.
She was typically blunt and clumsy in her thinking, but it was a reasonable point for a politician to make in parliament. I thought that what she she said was far more valid than the debate-shutting phony outrage howled by alternately lachrymose and bullying Labour politicians and the creepy Greens leader. |
My comment about politicising the issue was linked to the fact One Nation needed to deflect attention from scrutiny on a host of issues including: their funding, potential breaches of the AEC rules, exploiting & alienating their traditional base, the role of the new Svengali, corrupt practices stemming from but not exclusive to the 4 Corners report. |
If that was her intention, and I don't know how you'd prove it either way, the hyperventilators certainly hit the mark for her. _________________ Two more flags before I die! |
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watt price tully
Joined: 15 May 2007
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Mugwump wrote: | watt price tully wrote: | Mugwump wrote: | ^ There is probably violent agreement that (a) Hanson is not too smart ; and (b) case by case is the right framework, here. But I did pause at "senator Hanson wanted to politicize the issue..."
It's not really unreasonable for a politician to politicise a point about education practice and resourcing in a debate on schools funding.
She was typically blunt and clumsy in her thinking, but it was a reasonable point for a politician to make in parliament. I thought that what she she said was far more valid than the debate-shutting phony outrage howled by alternately lachrymose and bullying Labour politicians and the creepy Greens leader. |
My comment about politicising the issue was linked to the fact One Nation needed to deflect attention from scrutiny on a host of issues including: their funding, potential breaches of the AEC rules, exploiting & alienating their traditional base, the role of the new Svengali, corrupt practices stemming from but not exclusive to the 4 Corners report. |
If that was her intention, and I don't know how you'd prove it either way,..... |
You should try a wider narrative than your obsession obsession with the 1960's. Indeed following the political discourse (which admittedly is hard if you live in the UK - despite some sojourn back to Melbourne) often helps.
Put it this way: if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and goes well with hoisin sauce then voilŕ _________________ âI even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didnât keep âem under long enoughâ Kinky Friedman |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007 Location: Between London and Melbourne
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^ sorry, but eye-rolling and intellectually patronizing me about the need for a "wider narrative" amid my "obsession" is pretty obnoxious. In the interests of civility I have just written then deleted the scathing reply that deserved.
Meanwhile, on topic, you still have a narrative that may be true, but probably isn't. I was here when the Hanson thing broke. It was a preposterous overreaction. The lack-brained Shorten called her comments "disgusting", which suggests a remarkably low disgust threshold for someone who has spent so long in Labour factional politics. If she was trying to divert attention, they certainly helped her do so. _________________ Two more flags before I die! |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Location: somewhere
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005 Location: In flagrante delicto
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that's actually a really nice story. good on them _________________ Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005 Location: somewhere
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Yeah it is. Cheers _________________ You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007 Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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One of the autistic kids at the school Kelly works at stabbed a teacher with a pair of scissors today. The same kid has previously assaulted another teacher, dislocating her thumb.
He's 6 years old. _________________ Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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