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Russian invasion of Ukraine

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David Libra

to wish impossible things


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea

PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2022 10:37 pm
Post subject: Russian invasion of UkraineReply with quote

Hard to say at the moment whether this is all sabre-rattling, but Russia has been steadily moving military forces to its Ukrainian border over recent weeks, while the US and allies are themselves sending huge weapons shipments to Ukraine. Hopefully a peaceful diplomatic solution can be found and this doesn't turn into a full-blown war.

This is a pretty good explainer, for people trying to work out WTF is going on:

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/1/25/five-things-to-know-about-russia-ukraine-tensions

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Last edited by David on Thu Feb 24, 2022 6:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
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think positive Libra

Side By Side


Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere

PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2022 12:20 am
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Die hard 77?

Scary shit

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roar 



Joined: 01 Sep 2004


PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2022 8:10 am
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Grossly incompetent (criminal?) US foreign policy causing political problems, yet again.
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pietillidie 



Joined: 07 Jan 2005


PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2022 4:15 am
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^Well, no one is going to disagree with that broadly and historically, but let's not play violins for the petrothug and his fossil fuels economy. He needs to blackmail the planet because he refuses to reform the economy, rewarding grifters and cons with sleazy backroom contracts rather than fostering competitive and productive business. Think of all that wasted science and technology in a country with so many smarts. Must get his economic policy from the Libs Wink
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Dave The Man Scorpio



Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia

PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 7:14 pm
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Guess just send someone over with Covid instead of Shooting with Guns
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David Libra

to wish impossible things


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea

PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 7:05 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

Even if one were in favour of biological warfare, there's hardly a country in the world (some Pacific islands aside) where COVID hasn't already been rampant over these past two years. Ukraine and Russia have already been devastated by it, on a much greater scale than we have here.
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#26 Sagittarius

#26


Joined: 15 Jan 2022


PostPosted: Tue Feb 08, 2022 6:35 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

This exchange between the spokesperson and the reporter is gold.

"AP reporter confronts Biden spokesperson over Russia allegations"

https://www.axios.com/russia-ukraine-ned-price-b5f16863-d495-46c1-ba3b-6bb43193fce6.html
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David Libra

to wish impossible things


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea

PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2022 9:23 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

I saw that a few days ago. Amazing how American public officials see themselves. Why do they think anyone would trust anything an American administration or intelligence agency says about stuff like this?

The video's also a great example in how to do proper journalism, by the way. It's not about taking sides or seeking to advance one narrative over another; it's about grilling the people in charge and trying to get proper answers from them. Something that's been lost in the US media's shift towards being a partisan cheerleader for one or the other side of politics (a loss that is, unfortunately, evident both in some of Price's responses and much of the discussion of this exchange that I've seen on social media " i.e. you're either with the Biden administration and treating what they say as gospel or you're doing the work of the Russians/Republicans).

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David Libra

to wish impossible things


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea

PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2022 9:58 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

On another note, the sabre-rattling from the US/UK (and their compliant journalists) continues:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/08/emmanuel-macron-remark-russia-set-alarm-bell-ringing-ukraine-crisis-talk-vladimir-putin

Quote:
Macron's ... particular view of Russia as a European nation, and lofty talk of a new security guarantees, will have set alarm bells ringing.


Incredible choice of words there. I'd say what sets alarm bells ringing is anyone who isn't trying to de-escalate this situation or reach a diplomatic resolution.

Quote:
That did not stop Macron hinting at shifts in Nato’s outlook that some members say should never be made in response to military intimidation.


This is such a profoundly idiotic position to take. What is the mass transport of arms to Ukraine and stationing of thousands of American soldiers in Eastern Europe if not "military intimidation"? What was NATO expansion in the first place, for that matter, if not that? Are these people so trapped in their Western propaganda bubble that they don't see that this stuff works both ways?

Catastrophic wars happen when major powers decide to take a hardline, belligerent stance and refuse to negotiate or give any credence to the other side's interests. It's long past time that we treated the people pushing those views as the extremists that they are, and ensure that they're sidelined from any position of responsibility.

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think positive Libra

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Joined: 30 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2022 1:48 pm
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I agree, I cannot believe this is happening, when will they learn? Greed, makes men do bad things!
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#26 Sagittarius

#26


Joined: 15 Jan 2022


PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2022 6:27 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

David wrote:
I saw that a few days ago. Amazing how American public officials see themselves. Why do they think anyone would trust anything an American administration or intelligence agency says about stuff like this?

The video's also a great example in how to do proper journalism, by the way. It's not about taking sides or seeking to advance one narrative over another; it's about grilling the people in charge and trying to get proper answers from them. Something that's been lost in the US media's shift towards being a partisan cheerleader for one or the other side of politics (a loss that is, unfortunately, evident both in some of Price's responses and much of the discussion of this exchange that I've seen on social media " i.e. you're either with the Biden administration and treating what they say as gospel or you're doing the work of the Russians/Republicans).


Yes. The partisans are like members of a cult. "Never question the party " I hear the Republicans are looking to purge anyone from the party who is not willing to publicly support Trump's claim that the 2020 election was stolen.
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pietillidie 



Joined: 07 Jan 2005


PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2022 11:10 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

^And the penalty for worse information is worse decisions, and worse decisions mean worse outcomes, and worse outcomes mean a death loop of extremism, especially in a country devoted to a rural evangelicalism from another century.

When vast tracts of a country have the emotional maturity, world knowledge and belief systems of children, you can't see things ending well.

Very easy pickings for Putin, of course.

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pietillidie 



Joined: 07 Jan 2005


PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2022 7:18 pm
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Does Ukraine get any say at all in this? The media is dominated by the US and Russia, and people lining up for or against those two powers as their politics dictates.
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pietillidie 



Joined: 07 Jan 2005


PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2022 6:10 am
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No one seems to know what the probability of invasion is, with uncertainty part of Putin's usual blackmail kit. If I have understood correctly, most in Eastern Ukraine don't hold great affection for Russia, in contrast to Crimea. Is this right or have I been misinformed??
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roar 



Joined: 01 Sep 2004


PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2022 8:49 am
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^^ Pretty simple really: Russians in Ukraine are generally for Putin/Russia; Ukranians are against Russia taking any more of their territory.
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