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Rebuild or reset ?

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Ronnie McKeowns boots 

Ronnie Mckeowns boots


Joined: 27 Jul 2020


PostPosted: Sun May 30, 2021 12:10 pm
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2006 we beat both eventual grand finalists and bombed out of top 4 because of baffling losses to inferior teams (I believe the Blues was one).

Lost a 5 vs 8 elim against the rising Dogs...but really should have made top 4, and who knows what then?

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Geek 

geek


Joined: 06 Apr 2006
Location: Jacana

PostPosted: Sun May 30, 2021 11:50 pm
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Cruisinwithdids wrote:
We hit Rock bottom around 2005-6 after the GF’s of 2002-3 . We got Cloke pendles Thomas etc. around that time and went about building a good team with success in 2010. But we couldn’t sustain it due mainly to an internal implosion around the handover. Now it’s 2021, so after a 10 year downward spiral we are further away than ever. The key to a re build is fessing up to where you are at. The club has dedicated a decade to saving Buckley at the expense of the club, and still are. Unless that changes straight away it could be anything up to another 7 years.


We bottomed out twice on our way to the 2010 flag.

We first hit the bottom in 1999 (Leon, Johnno) and 2000 (Didak). We made 2 grand finals within 3 years and were outclassed in both, even with Buckley, Burns, Tarrant and so on.

Now yes, the Lions were a confected super team designed to grow the game in the northern states and that should be taken into account. We weren't supposed to win. But the reality was that we still rose with a team that wasn't complete enough to do the job. Anyone who haunted these sites back in the day will recall the plod squads, lard arsed wombats and so on of the day. We were a team with too many honest toilers and too few stars.

2001 - Swan
2002 - Maxwell
2003 - Heater
2004 - Trav, O'Brien
2005 - Daisy, Pendles, Tooves

We then started ascending the ladder again, making finals in '06.

So we had already acquired 11 of the premiership 22, including critical players in our CHF, Brownlow medalist and inspirational captain, by the time we started to rise. But here's where our squad differed from pretty much every other premiership team before or since.

We drafted 6 premiership players in the one draft in '06, despite playing in an elimination final (Reid, Brown, Dawes, Goldsack, Wellingham, McCaffer), bringing our number of future premiership players on the list to 17.

That's not normal.

And I think it's what really skews peoples' thinking when they look at our '04/'05 reset. There's a reason why our team was one of the youngest ever premiership teams. That 2006 draft gave us nearly 1/3 of our next premiership team in one fell swoop, accelerating the process by as much as 2 or 3 years and giving us a chance at striking for a premiership while Johnno, Leaon and Didak were still on the list. By the time that draft was done, we just had 5 more players to get: Sidey, Beams and Leroy in '08 and Jolly and Ball in '09.

But it was 10 years from '09/'00 bottom out and 7-9 from acquiring Swan, Heater and Maxy before we saluted. The decision to rebuild was made after the '03 debacle and that short reset, even with the '06 draft getting us 3 drafts worth of premiership talent in one hit, still took 7 years to bear fruit.
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PyreneesPie Pisces

PyreneesPie


Joined: 22 Aug 2014


PostPosted: Mon May 31, 2021 1:49 am
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^Wow. Very impressive analysis of what's involved in getting together a premiership list together. Thanks Geek.
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RudeBoy 



Joined: 28 Nov 2005


PostPosted: Mon May 31, 2021 2:28 pm
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Great analysis Geek. Much appreciated.
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thesoretoothsayer 



Joined: 26 Apr 2017


PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 10:34 am
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Well, the new narrative from the club is that we are, in fact, embarked upon a rebuild and the decision to rebuild was taken at the end of last year (the decision being helped along by salary cap issues).

https://www.afl.com.au/news/628045/the-rebuild-ladder-where-does-your-club-sit-

I wonder whether, if we had won a few more games and were still contending for finals, the club would be calling it a rebuild?

My feeling is that those in charge have thought:
"Shit, trading out a group of senior players (combined with injuries) has really hurt us. Time to say it's a rebuild so that fans accept the losses as part of the process rather than being due to monumental stuff ups caused by us".
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thesoretoothsayer 



Joined: 26 Apr 2017


PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 3:54 pm
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CFC November 2020
"We didn't get rid of players because of the salary cap squeeze and we are not rebuilding".
Reference: https://www.afl.com.au/news/628372/nine-months-of-hell-where-did-it-all-go-wrong-for-the-pies-

CFC June 2020
"Of course we got rid of players because of the salary cap squeeze and we are definitely rebuilding".
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The Boy Who Cried Wolf 



Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Location: We prefer free speech - you know it's right

PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 4:04 pm
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So im going to throw it out there - we will sign Mark Williams as next coach, he ticks every box inc being an ex pie. Alternatively it'll be Lyon.
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masoncox 

masoncox


Joined: 31 Aug 2015


PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2021 4:06 pm
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don't mind lyon
Bit worried about defence first with him.
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BazBoy 



Joined: 11 Sep 2014


PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:21 pm
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We are in the market for coach. Don’t need to send our boys out to search for one

Their lining up —media says so a la Peter Sumich

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SteveH67 



Joined: 18 Jul 2004
Location: Canberra, Australia

PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 3:45 pm
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We are rebuilding.

Pendles, Sidey, Howe, Mayne etc all gone over the next 12-24 mths.

More pain before we start moving up the ladder again.

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Jezza Taurus

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Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End

PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 4:01 pm
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^ Last week, the club indicated this would be a 3-5 year rebuild, hence the reason to move Buckley on as he couldn't commit that far down the track.
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Presti35 Virgo

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Joined: 05 Oct 2001
Location: London, England

PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2021 4:43 pm
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Well it's obviously a rebuild now.

Just dont let it be one of those 20-30 year rebuilds.

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Pies4shaw Leo

pies4shaw


Joined: 08 Oct 2007


PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:24 am
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https://www.afl.com.au/news/631444/contract-crunch-time-cox-among-15-pies-in-race-to-save-career

The 15 referred to are are Cox, Thomas, Madgen, Mayne, Greenwood, Pendlebury (call the 15 14), Noble (said to be in line for a "multi-year" extension), Bianco, Rantall, Ruscoe, Sier, Lynch, Ginnivan, Chugg and Tohill.
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MatthewBoydFanClub 



Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: Elwood

PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:48 am
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Some of those players are definitely going, but if you look at our list with Nick Daicos joining it next year and compare it to our 2010 premiership year list, our current list appears healthier to me, which is a credit to the hard work that Derek Hine has done. Can’t find anything holding us back from pushing back into the final 8 next year. The most overrated person in the AFL club is the senior coach so I don’t think it matters much who we get as senior coach. Let’s first see what sort of a job Robert Harvey does.
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David Libra

I dare you to try


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda

PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:48 am
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Interesting. Feel like the only certainties to stick around there are Pendlebury (for at least one more year), Noble, Bianco and Rantall. Greenwood and Mayne will both retire, you would think, but the rest of those – particularly Cox, Thomas, Sier, Lynch and Madgen – really do have big question marks over them. Of that lot, I'd like to see us hang on to Thomas (unless a decent trade option presents itself) and Madgen at least. No idea where Ginnivan, Chugg and Tohill are at.
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