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Lazza
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Bendigo, Victoria, Australia
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| Pies4shaw wrote: | | As for Lynch, it has been widely and consistently reported that he was very interested in coming to Collingwood - until he spoke to Buckley. |
Unless you have undisputed evidence, I call this a load of absolute nonsensical crap. Bullshit at its finest on display here. A load of rubbish.
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Presti35 
Dick Lee for Legend Status
Joined: 05 Oct 2001
Location: London, England
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Money cost us Lynch. He'll have no regrets with 2 flags.
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A Goal Saved Is 2 Goals Earned! |
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eddiesmith 
Lets get ready to Rumble
Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Location: Lexus Centre
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| Sicks Bux wrote: | | ^How many other teams in the comp have two permanent KPFs and a third tall as the relieving ruckman? It seems like the three talls are out of fashion because of the emphasis of having smaller forwards who can apply defensive pressure. |
But the last 3 premierships have been won by teams with two permanent kpfs, Collingwood has none...
I don’t watch their games to k ow where their ruckman go for a rest |
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eddiesmith
Lets get ready to Rumble
Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Location: Lexus Centre
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| Pebbles Rocks wrote: | | eddiesmith wrote: | Which is exactly the same issues Collingwood is facing today and people still say it's not Buckley's fault?
But for some reason a key forward has never been a necessary requirement in Buckley's game plan.
It's no wonder Tom Lynch and Jeremy Cameron never considered Collingwood as a destination, what forward would? |
Cloke was a key forward for Buckley for several years
Moore played there
Cox is there
Lynch was very close to choosing collingwood.
Dont let the facts get in the way of your drivel |
Buckley inherited an AA CHF and he drove him from the game
Moore went to the backline and Cox was constantly in and out of the team and plays as a second ruck.
We do no have a permanent kpf and haven’t since 2016. |
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Big T
Joined: 18 Oct 2003
Location: Torino, Italy
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Cloke was finished. His time at the dogs proved that. And the club was sick of his dad.
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eddiesmith
Lets get ready to Rumble
Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Location: Lexus Centre
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They both have something Buckley never will, a premiership medal!
Hopefully Trav can lead the Ranges to the title next year and achieve something else Buckley never will, coaching success |
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| Sicks Bux wrote: | | ^How many other teams in the comp have two permanent KPFs and a third tall as the relieving ruckman? It seems like the three talls are out of fashion because of the emphasis of having smaller forwards who can apply defensive pressure. |
I think you’ve misunderstood my point. Competent teams typically have two permanent KPFs, not one and a second who relieves in the ruck. I merely mentioned that he dismantled Malthouse’s three-tall structure. |
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Ronnie McKeowns boots
Ronnie Mckeowns boots
Joined: 27 Jul 2020
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| Pies4shaw wrote: | | Sicks Bux wrote: | | ^How many other teams in the comp have two permanent KPFs and a third tall as the relieving ruckman? It seems like the three talls are out of fashion because of the emphasis of having smaller forwards who can apply defensive pressure. |
I think you’ve misunderstood my point. Competent teams typically have two permanent KPFs, not one and a second who relieves in the ruck. I merely mentioned that he dismantled Malthouse’s three-tall structure. |
Yep, and the Tigers got a second KPF in Lynch, even after jagging one with a mosquito fleet.
I was appalled by the way Dawes was treated at the time, and it hasn't aged well over the years....but what really shocked me was how quickly supporters threw him under the bus as well |
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Sicks Bux 
Hal 2003-2019
Joined: 30 Jun 2020
Location: Me Island Ome
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| eddiesmith wrote: | | Sicks Bux wrote: | | ^How many other teams in the comp have two permanent KPFs and a third tall as the relieving ruckman? It seems like the three talls are out of fashion because of the emphasis of having smaller forwards who can apply defensive pressure. |
But the last 3 premierships have been won by teams with two permanent kpfs, Collingwood has none...
I don’t watch their games to k ow where their ruckman go for a rest |
Darling and Riewoldt are mid sized forwards who play tall like Brodie Mihocek. Would you put them in the same category as gorillas like Kennedy, Hawkins & Dixon?
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The beatings will continue until moral improves. |
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Presti35
Dick Lee for Legend Status
Joined: 05 Oct 2001
Location: London, England
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If only David had a 4th son; Hope Cloke.
19 years old, 199cm, FF, fantastic contested mark, very accurate in front of goal, very athletic, very fast. Future AA, Coleman, etc. Favourite drink; Coke Float.
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A Goal Saved Is 2 Goals Earned! |
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MatthewBoydFanClub
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: Elwood
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| Pies4shaw wrote: | ^ In any event, the problem with Buckley's forward lines is that he has always considered it necessary to play one permanent KPF and a second KPF who is the relieving ruckman. He dismantled the forward line that contained two permanent KPFs and a third tall/relieving ruck and then looked, successively, to find a second KPF who could ruck. You'd think that after a decade he'd realize that's stupid beyond belief - but it appears not.
From 2008 to 2011, Collingwood (in the home and away 22 matches only) kicked 331, 313, 335 and 381 goals, respectively. The decision to ruck Dawes was instituted immediately - and hopelessly - in Buckley's first year. And Collingwood's goals in the home and away matches dropped to 305 and 310 in his first two years. That was with Travis contributing 75 goals per year (59 goals and 16 goal assists in 2012; and 68 goals and 7 goal assists in 2013).
As Travis buckled under the weight of trying to carry the team with that stupid gameplan, Collingwood managed just 252, 287 and 276 goals in the next three home and away seasons. In the most recent 3 full home and away seasons, Collingwood managed just 278, 300 (in the Grand Final year) and 274 goals. It's putrid - and largely attributable to a deliberate decision by the Coach not to play three talls in the forward line, accompanied by another deliberate decision not to "waste" high draft picks on tall forwards. Have a look at the average or worse footballers that have been brought in to "replace" Cloke and Dawes - (the other) Lynch, White, Cox and Mihocek. Not one of them was or is capable of playing as a genuine key forward in a top team.
As for Lynch, it has been widely and consistently reported that he was very interested in coming to Collingwood - until he spoke to Buckley. |
Well when Chris Dawes moved across to Melbourne Paul Roos played him in exactly the same role that Buckley had played him in and it didn't work out there either. And when Dawes retired and was awarded life membership at Collingwood he didn't appear to harbour any bad feeling towards the coaching staff when he picked up his award. |
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The Boy Who Cried Wolf
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Location: We prefer free speech - you know it's right
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Buckley destroyed Dawes career to be frank, I'm not saying he was a great player but he was solid enough for the role he was actually good at which was a key forward and not as some pretend ruckman.
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All Aboard!! Choo Choo!!! |
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dalyc 
Joined: 02 Mar 2005
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| The Boy Who Cried Wolf wrote: | | Buckley destroyed Dawes career to be frank, I'm not saying he was a great player but he was solid enough for the role he was actually good at which was a key forward and not as some pretend ruckman. |
So why was he shit at Melbourne?
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Four legged animals good, two legged animals better |
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inxs88
Joined: 17 Aug 2014
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| eddiesmith wrote: | They both have something Buckley never will, a premiership medal!
Hopefully Trav can lead the Ranges to the title next year and achieve something else Buckley never will, coaching success |
with fans like you who needs enemies
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I love the Pies, hate Carlscum |
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Cruisinwithdids
Joined: 21 Sep 2016
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| Pies4shaw wrote: | ^ In any event, the problem with Buckley's forward lines is that he has always considered it necessary to play one permanent KPF and a second KPF who is the relieving ruckman. He dismantled the forward line that contained two permanent KPFs and a third tall/relieving ruck and then looked, successively, to find a second KPF who could ruck. You'd think that after a decade he'd realize that's stupid beyond belief - but it appears not.
From 2008 to 2011, Collingwood (in the home and away 22 matches only) kicked 331, 313, 335 and 381 goals, respectively. The decision to ruck Dawes was instituted immediately - and hopelessly - in Buckley's first year. And Collingwood's goals in the home and away matches dropped to 305 and 310 in his first two years. That was with Travis contributing 75 goals per year (59 goals and 16 goal assists in 2012; and 68 goals and 7 goal assists in 2013).
As Travis buckled under the weight of trying to carry the team with that stupid gameplan, Collingwood managed just 252, 287 and 276 goals in the next three home and away seasons. In the most recent 3 full home and away seasons, Collingwood managed just 278, 300 (in the Grand Final year) and 274 goals. It's putrid - and largely attributable to a deliberate decision by the Coach not to play three talls in the forward line, accompanied by another deliberate decision not to "waste" high draft picks on tall forwards. Have a look at the average or worse footballers that have been brought in to "replace" Cloke and Dawes - (the other) Lynch, White, Cox and Mihocek. Not one of them was or is capable of playing as a genuine key forward in a top team.
As for Lynch, it has been widely and consistently reported that he was very interested in coming to Collingwood - until he spoke to Buckley. |
P4S that is a very good, statistically supported summary of how things unravelled when Buckley became coach. He shipped premiership players on with an almost, arrogant lack of care. It was reckless. It hurt the club |
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