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#26 
#26
Joined: 15 Jan 2022
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| @David & Stui: makes me wonder if they share fundamental similarities because they're both reflecting the fundamental values of Autralian Society. |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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You need NomadJack to comment here properly, I'd say rather than reflecting any values, they're both positioning to appeal to who they need to to get elected while trying to manage stakeholders and factions expectations .
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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#26
#26
Joined: 15 Jan 2022
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| David wrote: | | #26 wrote: | | What do you folks think the fundamental differences between the ALP and Libs are? |
I very much expect that welfare will remain as stingy as ever, and that big mining will have little to fear. We can also probably forget any serious attempts to address the housing bubble and get rid of all the dodgy benefits that have led to skyrocketing prices. The rich will keep getting richer, the national security state will keep expanding, we'll still be at America's beck and call (including for foreign wars),
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As I alluded to in my previous post, aren't the things you mention here just a reflection of Australian Society?
Stingy welfare: I'd say the majority of Australians don't want to increase tax or cut spending elsewhere to increase welfare payments.
Skyrocketing House prices This is really only a problem for first home buyers and renters. Home owners would be loving it because the value of their houses are going up.
Being America's deputy in return for their protection: I feel like the majority of Australians are in favour of this too, because our defence budget would increase if we had to become self sufficient and stop relying on America.
So maybe the many similarities between the Libs and the ALP are the result of them knowing that the majority of Australians are on board with those similarities despite the fact that so many people bemoan them being "no different" |
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think positive 
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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Stingy welfare, I can easily name 3 families who take take take more than their share, one families sole income (well taxable known income) is all welfare and they disgust me in their entitlement. You have to hear it to believe it. They go overseas more than me!
The welfare system needs a complete overhaul and it needs proper policing.
As for housing it’s ridiculous. I think a lot stems from covid. The family that bought our rental could afford to buy rather than rent because they can work from home, so they moved 25klm further from the city, rates are cheap where we are because of the refineries paying so much. And they paid a good $100,000 more than it was worth 12 months previously. Easily. We took advantage of the timing. We had 3 people outbidding each other, 2 weeks before the auction! We have been looking around the Bellarine for a lifestyle property. We passed on one as our money was tied up in a project and I didn’t want to borrow in these times. However the last few weeks the numbers at open houses has dropped significantly. This morning there were 3 couples at a really nice reasonably priced place in a great location. I’m not sure what advantages David thinks buyers are getting! You do have options, it may mean compromising on the area you live in, it may mean sacrificing big holidays for little ones, second hand furniture for new. All the things we did when we got our first homes! If your prepared to go out into the outer suburbs or maybe a unit in an inner one, it’s a good place to start. My daughter bought a house in march, it’s not perfect, shitty cheap kitchen, had no gardens, luckily it’s a nice quiet street but it’s not where she wanted to live, but now she’s in the market and it beats paying rent. Plus having a basic home is giving her perspective. Doing it on her own has given her a really big boost in responsibility and the value of the dollar! She’s still pretty messy though!!! Or maybe I’m just fussy!
The rental market is wide open, so many places for rent now, the prices are dropping. I’m done with residential rentals!
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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Lazza
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Bendigo, Victoria, Australia
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History shows that the polls will get incredibly close nearer to the election. My experience tells me that if Australia is still battling the danger of Covid and the Coalition plays this up, they will romp home through the “teddy bear principle”, the one where voters decide that it is not time for change because under the current Covid stresses, they prefer to hug the current teddy bear that they are familiar and comfortable with. This is the most likely outcome.
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Don't confuse your current path with your final destination. Just because it's dark and stormy now doesn't meant that you aren't headed for glorious sunshine! |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| #26 wrote: | | David wrote: | | #26 wrote: | | What do you folks think the fundamental differences between the ALP and Libs are? |
I very much expect that welfare will remain as stingy as ever, and that big mining will have little to fear. We can also probably forget any serious attempts to address the housing bubble and get rid of all the dodgy benefits that have led to skyrocketing prices. The rich will keep getting richer, the national security state will keep expanding, we'll still be at America's beck and call (including for foreign wars),
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As I alluded to in my previous post, aren't the things you mention here just a reflection of Australian Society?
Stingy welfare: I'd say the majority of Australians don't want to increase tax or cut spending elsewhere to increase welfare payments.
Skyrocketing House prices This is really only a problem for first home buyers and renters. Home owners would be loving it because the value of their houses are going up.
Being America's deputy in return for their protection: I feel like the majority of Australians are in favour of this too, because our defence budget would increase if we had to become self sufficient and stop relying on America.
So maybe the many similarities between the Libs and the ALP are the result of them knowing that the majority of Australians are on board with those similarities despite the fact that so many people bemoan them being "no different" |
I’d dispute that. I think it’s what the donors want. Skyrocketing house prices are great news for the big banks, all of whom donate generously to both major parties; think how much more they make from mortgages and other loans. But I don’t think most people are happy with the housing situation – renters and first-home buyers make up a significant (and growing) proportion of Australians (29% of us rent, and 37% are paying back a mortgage). People with investment properties, on the other hand, make up a small minority of the population (8%, according to one link). I’m not sure what the polls say, but a lot of people certainly don’t seem to think all is good in the hood:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-06-14/survey-home-ownership-not-an-option-for-most-young-australians/100205244
I have no idea what most Australians think of our relationship with America. My guess is that most are happy with the idea that they’d defend us in case of attack, but unhappy about the idea that our sovereignty is in any way compromised in the process (as of course it is). In contrast, I don’t expect that most Australians have the faintest idea of what our defence budget is, or have much opinion on whether it’s too high or too low. The reality is that it doesn’t really matter what voters think; the two major parties have very close ties to the American government behind closed doors and are hardly going to do anything to upset the bosses.
None of this is to say that the majority of Australians are secret leftists who would elect Jeremy Corbyn tomorrow if they had the chance. On the contrary, I think the country does lean socially conservative in certain respects and likely holds some views that are even to the right of the current duopoly (on capital punishment, for instance). Other popular views are further "left" than Labor (say, on instituting an ICAC). But I do think it’s a misreading to suggest that public sentiment drives our politics.
Ordinarily, major parties might offer a clear choice between two distinct agglomeration of popular and unpopular stances, as accords with their ideology (e.g. pro-business vs pro-worker). But I think what’s happened is that one of the two parties has become very weak and scared of offering any kind of coherent agenda, for fear that any divergence from the status quo will be seized on and exploited by the other side. Which leaves the other party more or less free to do whatever they (or, to be more specific, their corporate donors) want with little functional opposition.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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eddiesmith 
Lets get ready to Rumble
Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Location: Lexus Centre
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Think Positive- Don’t want to quote on my phone just to reply to one sentence, but the rental situation is definitely not like that ib regional Victoria. Prices are going up and up as demand far exceeds supply. There were places I went to that had dozens of people through one open for inspection and it was an absolute dump. One agent said she had 100 people interested in some properties.
It’s near on impossible to get a decent priced rental in regional Victoria with undersized 2 bedroom units with a lounge/dining area smaller than a normal sized bedroom going for 350 a week. |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| eddiesmith wrote: | Think Positive- Don’t want to quote on my phone just to reply to one sentence, but the rental situation is definitely not like that ib regional Victoria. Prices are going up and up as demand far exceeds supply. There were places I went to that had dozens of people through one open for inspection and it was an absolute dump. One agent said she had 100 people interested in some properties.
It’s near on impossible to get a decent priced rental in regional Victoria with undersized 2 bedroom units with a lounge/dining area smaller than a normal sized bedroom going for 350 a week. |
tree changers who cant afford to buy. Less houses around the country areas tore t
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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And these are towns with steeply declining populations that actually desperately need people to move there in order for local businesses to survive. Clearly something isn't working.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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#26
#26
Joined: 15 Jan 2022
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| David wrote: |
I’d dispute that. I think it’s what the donors want. Skyrocketing house prices are great news for the big banks, all of whom donate generously to both major parties; think how much more they make from mortgages and other loans. But I don’t think most people are happy with the housing situation – renters and first-home buyers make up a significant (and growing) proportion of Australians (29% of us rent, and 37% are paying back a mortgage). People with investment properties, on the other hand, make up a small minority of the population (8%, according to one link). I’m not sure what the polls say, but a lot of people certainly don’t seem to think all is good in the hood:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-06-14/survey-home-ownership-not-an-option-for-most-young-australians/100205244
I have no idea what most Australians think of our relationship with America. My guess is that most are happy with the idea that they’d defend us in case of attack, but unhappy about the idea that our sovereignty is in any way compromised in the process (as of course it is). In contrast, I don’t expect that most Australians have the faintest idea of what our defence budget is, or have much opinion on whether it’s too high or too low. The reality is that it doesn’t really matter what voters think; the two major parties have very close ties to the American government behind closed doors and are hardly going to do anything to upset the bosses.
None of this is to say that the majority of Australians are secret leftists who would elect Jeremy Corbyn tomorrow if they had the chance. On the contrary, I think the country does lean socially conservative in certain respects and likely holds some views that are even to the right of the current duopoly (on capital punishment, for instance). Other popular views are further "left" than Labor (say, on instituting an ICAC). But I do think it’s a misreading to suggest that public sentiment drives our politics.
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Wouldn't the 37% with a mortgage be happy to see the value of their property going up? Again, I'm pretty sure the people most aggrieved about the cost of housing would be first home buyers. So I don't think it's an issue the majority of the country would prioritise when thinking about who to vote for. Not so sure about the renters. I would've thought rents would be going up as house prices went up but that seems to be a bone of contention on this thread.
So the relationship with America is something most Australians aren't passionately opposed to and certainly don't base their voting intentions on it.
I'd say the majority of Australians are economically conservative and the policies of the two major parties reflect that. Australians don't want to pay more tax, or redirect government spending, to increase welfare or build more public housing to solve the housing crisis. That's why it isn't an election issue. Not yet anyway. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| David wrote: | | And these are towns with steeply declining populations that actually desperately need people to move there in order for local businesses to survive. Clearly something isn't working. |
I'd say that's a gross generalisation, the rural towns the tree changers are moving to are frequently tourist destinations with stable or growing populations.
The problem is the Treechangers coming in chew up supply and increase prices, like in Tocumwal. Sell the modest 3 bedroom house in Glen Iris for $2.5M, buy a brand new 4 bedroom place in Toc for $450k and pocket the change.
There's plenty of building and development happening in rural and regional. Shepparton has got new houses popping up in the fringes everywhere, Toc has a new development growing on the eastern fringe.
Where it does become a problem in Toc is that retail and hospitality are short staffed and people who are willing to move there and take up work in those fields, can't get a place to live. The places that have steeply declining populations have them because no one is moving there and young people leave.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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eddiesmith
Lets get ready to Rumble
Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Location: Lexus Centre
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| think positive wrote: | | eddiesmith wrote: | Think Positive- Don’t want to quote on my phone just to reply to one sentence, but the rental situation is definitely not like that ib regional Victoria. Prices are going up and up as demand far exceeds supply. There were places I went to that had dozens of people through one open for inspection and it was an absolute dump. One agent said she had 100 people interested in some properties.
It’s near on impossible to get a decent priced rental in regional Victoria with undersized 2 bedroom units with a lounge/dining area smaller than a normal sized bedroom going for 350 a week. |
tree changers who cant afford to buy. Less houses around the country areas tore t |
Also got competition from Uni students who only want it for 9 months of the year.
But as someone who owned a rental, curious how did your agent do it if you used one? One agents rejection emails said they leave it up the owner to decide and don’t bother asking them why you weren’t successful. Yet the one I did get they seemed to make the decision then put me to the owner who said yes. That agent had even called my emergency contacts to check up on me. |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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I had a sit down with agents, went through expectations etc, mine and also in relation to which ever property it was, for example, no pets in the units we had, of course the tenant ignored that and her dog did so much damage in 4 months, bond did not cover it. Thing is agents lie to each other and owners, that’s how We ended up with our old house completely destroyed from end to end. I knew he was trouble the moment I met him, got a really good insurance policy, 4 years later, after too many unsatisfactory checks, I waited til their next kid was born and evicted them to sell it. I should not have been so thoughtful. 5 broken windows, holes punched in the walls, filth everywhere, graffiti on the walls and the kitchen bench collapsed when I pulled a drawer out, we had to put new plaster in it was that bad. They did us a favour, almost $30k from insurance, did the place up and made an extra $160k than expected! But I still tracked them down and dobbed them into the next agent, she confirmed my agent said they were great tenants. I sent her photos! Every now and then I snoop his page, he beat his missus up, cheated on her, went overseas and left 4 toddles with an unstable mother. Dumped that one and came back for another. Thankfully the original Mum is in good shape now.
I had one agent who wanted to out a family of 6 in a three bedroom house! The agent is meant to follow guidelines, but the owner gets the final say. I hopped a few agencies before I found a decent one. Over the 20 odd years we had 4 different properties, including 2 units together, I’d say tenant ratio was 75 good 25 bad. Not great odds! People think it’s a cruise, but if your a decent landlord it ain’t!
If I was the owner and I knew your references were not checked I’d be pissed, especially since there is fierce completion for tenants.
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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eddiesmith
Lets get ready to Rumble
Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Location: Lexus Centre
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Thanks for that, it's like everything in life there are also bad landlords who never lift a finger as well, horror stories all around, although I suspect bad tenant stories outnumber them just because of the general type of people who mostly rely on rentals. But it's good to see you ensure others know of someone that bad, not someone who should be getting rentals ahead of far more deserving tenants.
But my experiences definitely show that not many agents are willing to do much either, so not shocked by your experiences either.
Btw I said they had checked my references, even both emergency contacts. |
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