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inxs88 



Joined: 17 Aug 2014


PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:17 pm
Post subject: List Profile Age DemographicReply with quote

Well we are a club in crisis but I don't think the abyss extends to a player roster that is a decade away from contending. The silver lining that I personally cling to is that the rebuild did start some two years ago with not just 7 debutants this year but also 8 existing players during 2019-20

2019-2020 debutants:

* Mark Keane
* Trey Ruscoe
* Tyler Brown
* Max Lynch
* Will Kelly
* Isaac Quaynor
* Nathan Murphy
* John Noble

2021:

* Jay Rantall
* Trent Bianco
* Beau McCreery
* Tom Wilson
* Finlay Macrae
* Oliver Henry
* Caleb Poulter

Notwithstanding that with 10 matches to go, there may still be time to see:

* Jack Ginnivan
* Isaac Chugg
* Reef McInnes
* Liam McMahon
* Ash Johnson

Statistically speaking, they're all not going to make it however the small sample size of most of the above is encouraging. With the likely player cull of:

* Mayne: retirement likely (33 years old)
* Greenwood: retirement likely (32 years old)
* Thomas: delisted (30 years old)
* Madgen: delisted (28 years old)
* Lynch: 50:50 delisted
* Cox: traded (30 years old)
* Tohill: surely the experiment is over
* Sier: traded

It means we are going to be extra young in our list profile next year. Hopefully a Swans type bounce in 2023 is forthcoming.

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Pies2016 



Joined: 12 Sep 2014


PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:03 pm
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It’s a very good post and something everyone should have a good handle on with what lies ahead. There’s a lot to like but it won’t come without some more short term pain.

Some points I would like to add -

- We will enter 2022 with a list that likely comprises 20 players who will have played less than 20 senior games. That’s half the list and you won’t see that list profile very often.
- As is my ongoing interest, I have kept a close eye on all the 2020 Vic draftees in the AFL. Other than Nick Cox, who has been an absolute standout, all of the midfielders inside the top 20 have struggled to have any real impact during senior games this season. I have said all along by taking away their last year of development as U18s ( the most important ) our Vic draftees were always were always going to struggle. My expectation is that kids like Henry, MacRae, McInnes and maybe McMahon ( tall ) will show all significant development next year.
- At some point soon, with so many young players, we will find ourselves in a position to be active in the free agency market once again. Whoever we acquire will need to be a very calculated and measured decision. We will need to find a way to add further leadership into this group.
- Nick Daicos. I try to temper my enthusiasm when this kid comes up in the conversation but the hype is real. I’ve seen him for 6 quarters this year and he’s ridiculously good. They will build a team around him as he matures and hopefully embraces the responsibility that comes with it.
- Finally, while I understand the focus on our new senior coach, in our case, the appointment of our new assistant / development coaches will be of equal importance. They are the ones who work closely with the kids and mould their careers in the AFL.

There’s plenty of work still to be done but make no doubt, the foundations have at least been laid.
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neil Sagittarius



Joined: 08 Sep 2005
Location: Queensland

PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:32 pm
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Plus Aiden Begg
And at the ens of this year Daicos and whoever gets drafted

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Said by Zed 



Joined: 21 Mar 2021


PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:36 pm
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Pies2016 wrote:
It’s a very good post and something everyone should have a good handle on with what lies ahead. There’s a lot to like but it won’t come without some more short term pain.

Some points I would like to add -

- We will enter 2022 with a list that likely comprises 20 players who will have played less than 20 senior games. That’s half the list and you won’t see that list profile very often.
- As is my ongoing interest, I have kept a close eye on all the 2020 Vic draftees in the AFL. Other than Nick Cox, who has been an absolute standout, all of the midfielders inside the top 20 have struggled to have any real impact during senior games this season. I have said all along by taking away their last year of development as U18s ( the most important ) our Vic draftees were always were always going to struggle. My expectation is that kids like Henry, MacRae, McInnes and maybe McMahon ( tall ) will show all significant development next year.
- At some point soon, with so many young players, we will find ourselves in a position to be active in the free agency market once again. Whoever we acquire will need to be a very calculated and measured decision. We will need to find a way to add further leadership into this group.
- Nick Daicos. I try to temper my enthusiasm when this kid comes up in the conversation but the hype is real. I’ve seen him for 6 quarters this year and he’s ridiculously good. They will build a team around him as he matures and hopefully embraces the responsibility that comes with it.
- Finally, while I understand the focus on our new senior coach, in our case, the appointment of our new assistant / development coaches will be of equal importance. They are the ones who work closely with the kids and mould their careers in the AFL.

There’s plenty of work still to be done but make no doubt, the foundations have at least been laid.

Good rational post - agree with all your points. Will be interesting to witness semblance of an effective strategy regarding FA and draft/trades/recruiting to complement our young list moving forward.

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Piesnchess 

piesnchess


Joined: 09 Jun 2008


PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 6:24 pm
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Be just bout the youngest list in the comp next season, but im pleased, youth is great, youthful enthusiasm, i can see another big Collingwood era coming, and it will come, when old sides like Cats, Tigers, eagles r in decline, we will be on the rise.
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inxs88 



Joined: 17 Aug 2014


PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 7:05 pm
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I didn't add Begg to the post as it seems he is out for the year with a shoulder operation. Travis Cloke was the one who pushed his case having worked with him at Eastern Ranges and Yarra Valley Anglican School. Hopefully his spotting is sound!!!
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inxs88 



Joined: 17 Aug 2014


PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 11:33 pm
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Hopefully Ash Johnson can be a surprise packet that gives fans joy in the last half of the year.
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Rd10.1998_11.1#36 

rd10.1998_11.1#36


Joined: 18 Jul 2018
Location: Sevilla, Spain

PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2021 11:43 pm
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Piesnchess wrote:
Be just bout the youngest list in the comp next season, but im pleased, youth is great, youthful enthusiasm, i can see another big Collingwood era coming, and it will come, when old sides like Cats, Tigers, eagles r in decline, we will be on the rise.


Thought you had taken your bat & ball and gone home

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gurugeoff 



Joined: 09 Oct 2013


PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 2:04 pm
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You have listed 8 players to be culled, but once we take nick daicos, we do not have any more draft picks, so those other spots would need to be multiple picks at the end of the draft, ie, pick 81, 82 etc, or free agents no one else wants or some more basketballers, Irishmen etc. for example, if you are going to delist Magden, who are you going to replace him with?
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RudeBoy 



Joined: 28 Nov 2005


PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 2:10 pm
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gurugeoff wrote:
You have listed 8 players to be culled, but once we take nick daicos, we do not have any more draft picks, so those other spots would need to be multiple picks at the end of the draft, ie, pick 81, 82 etc, or free agents no one else wants or some more basketballers, Irishmen etc. for example, if you are going to delist Magden, who are you going to replace him with?


Good point. By the way, isn't there a minimum number of draftees a club must recruit each year? I had a feeling all clubs are required to add 5 players through the draft.
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npalm 



Joined: 01 May 2005


PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 5:10 pm
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I can't share the OP's enthusiasm. Of the 20 young players he lists as our future, there is not a single top 10 draft selection amongst them.

We desperately need some top end young talent to lift the quality of that list. Nick Daicos will only go so far. We will need another top 10 midfielder and a top 10 key forward.

Have a look at the top teams. Typically they have at least 2 top 10 midfielders and one top 10 Key forward.

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inxs88 



Joined: 17 Aug 2014


PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 5:39 pm
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gurugeoff wrote:
You have listed 8 players to be culled, but once we take nick daicos, we do not have any more draft picks, so those other spots would need to be multiple picks at the end of the draft, ie, pick 81, 82 etc, or free agents no one else wants or some more basketballers, Irishmen etc. for example, if you are going to delist Madgen, who are you going to replace him with?


A lot of this shall make sense once the end of year ladder positions are made up, combined with trade week, free agency and rookie list spot deductions etc... however in short:

* Pies have added Johnson and Begg so we have 2 extra on the overall list
* Madgen is a rookie not a primary listed player

Makes 3 spots on the overall list available

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Pies2016 



Joined: 12 Sep 2014


PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 6:06 pm
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RudeBoy wrote:
gurugeoff wrote:
You have listed 8 players to be culled, but once we take nick daicos, we do not have any more draft picks, so those other spots would need to be multiple picks at the end of the draft, ie, pick 81, 82 etc, or free agents no one else wants or some more basketballers, Irishmen etc. for example, if you are going to delist Magden, who are you going to replace him with?


Good point. By the way, isn't there a minimum number of draftees a club must recruit each year? I had a feeling all clubs are required to add 5 players through the draft.


Pretty sure it’s a minimum of three onto the Primary list ( but they change aspects of the draft rules every bloody year )
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Rd10.1998_11.1#36 

rd10.1998_11.1#36


Joined: 18 Jul 2018
Location: Sevilla, Spain

PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 6:07 pm
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RudeBoy wrote:
isn't there a minimum number of draftees a club must recruit each year? I had a feeling all clubs are required to add 5 players through the draft.


There were only 59 picks selected in the 2020 draft. GCS only had 3 picks going in and I think they only used 1 or 2

Clubs are required to maintain a certain number of players on their list, so drafting depends on availability of spots

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Born to Pie 

Born to Pie


Joined: 20 Sep 2011
Location: Tolga FNQ

PostPosted: Sun Jun 13, 2021 6:46 pm
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The mandatory number of picks a club must use in the AFL draft is three.

However this was waived, and reduced to one, for the 2020 draft due to the reduction in list sizes and salary cap (as a result of COVID).

No indication has yet been given as to a waiver for minimum draft numbers for the 2021 national draft

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