Bucks 2018 success already better than Hafey's of 1977

[RudeBoy]

I read an article in the little paper today (by Mike Gleason I think?) arguing that what Bucks has achieved this year, taking us from 13th last year to the Prelim, especially considering us having the worst injury rate in the whole of the AFL, is already a better achievement than that of Hafey's rise from 12th to the GF in 1977.

I'm not interested in opening up old wounds about Bucks coaching in recent years (let's just agree to disagree on all of that), but in 2018, he is already coach of the year, and has certainly achieved the equal, if not more, than Hafey did back in the old VFL days with a smaller competition.

[David]

It makes sense if you look at this year in isolation, but let's not forget that that was Hafey's first year as coach and he was cleaning up someone else's mess; whereas Bucks, if we're apportioning credit based on results, was also the architect of our fall from premiership contention to cellar-dweller status over the course of 2012�2017.

Personally I don't think coaches deserve much of either the blame or praise as they get for win-loss ratios and finishing ladder positions (and have always suspected that any good coach who is in charge for a long period of time will oversee periodic rises and falls). For me,�it's enough to feel confident that he knows what he's doing and that he's doing a good job, and that perhaps some of the mistakes of past years have been learnt from.

[RudeBoy]

[stui magpie]

The Age is now the little paper?

I think it's hard to compare. We've gone from 13th to a prelim in an 18 team comp, in 76 we finished last in a 12 team comp.

Back then you could buy players, all you needed was the cash of which there was a lot less of than there is now, but no salary cap or draft.

I think Bucks deserves credit for being able to make the changes to himself he needed to, but there's a lot of pieces that have combined here, not just Bucks.

[RudeBoy]

[5 from the wing on debut]

[Harrysz]

Not to detract from Bucks, who's done a might job this year, but Hafey got Collingwood to the Grand Final in 1977 and would've won that flag if Carmen hadn't had a brain fade.

Let Bucks get us to the Grand Final and then we'll talk.

[Pies4shaw]

[Pies2016]

As Stui said, it�s just not apples for apples ( paraphrasing )
Both great achievements in their own right because they both entered that � successful � year without much belief behind them.

It all reminds me of one of the great calendar quotes � success has many fathers but failure is an orphan �. Not even sure why I wrote that 😳

[stui magpie]

In Hine we trust

[BazBoy]

Comparison,s are odious

[uncanny]

I beg to differ. The comparison is not odious but good to reflect upon.
Both rises up the ladder were significant and unexpected.
In both cases the playing groups didn't change much apart from the influx of a first year player that had a great impact. In 77 it was Ricky Barham and this year it has been Jayden Stephenson.
in Hafey's case the improvement was due to getting fair dinkum about training for fitness and toughness as well as a breath of fresh air. The past was stifling the club and Tom was the first non Collingwood person to coach them. The symbolism was there. Shape up or ship out. The players bought in and nearly got the flag as a result.
The comparison to this year is interesting. The head coach is the same but it was interesting to read Brayden Maynard last week in interview heaping praise on Justin Longmuir, new to the club this year, for being the driver of implementing a defensive plan. In Brayden's mind this was a "shambles" in previous years. This, together with Buddah Hocking and the system review has led to a coaching change which I believe is equivalent to Hafey coming in. The "breath of fresh air" this year hasn't been the decobwebing of tradition and photos on the walls but a renewed "where in it together, "nothing else matters mantra". Nathan has lost the "Harry high shorts" head prefect noble soldier persona and instead is walking side by side with his players as a big brother, father figure. it's on a par I reckon with the climb of 77 but it promises to be even better. Exciting times ahead.,,,

[watt price tully]

[K]

Here is Gleeson's article:

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/4-points-best-comeback-since-tom-hafey-was-a-pie-20180916-p5044d.html


When I read it a couple of days ago, my gut reaction was that it was absurd. Gleeson seems to be ignoring the huge fluctutations up and down the ladder that happen nowadays. In the 80s, for a whole decade, Hawthorn were stuck near the top of the ladder and St. Kilda stuck at the bottom of the ladder. There was no social mobility.

Gleeson claimed today is arguably a greater achievement because there are 18 teams. No! That makes it a lesser achievement. It's not how many equally mediocre teams there are that makes things difficult; it's how big the gap is between teams. 18 teams just dilutes the talent pool, so every team is mediocre or worse.

Of course, maybe there were also helpful circumstances for Hafey's achievement that we've glossed over for four decades.

[MagpiesTheGreat]

The conclusion will be very obvious in two weeks time: Pies win the premiership!!!