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AN_Inkling
Joined: 06 Oct 2007
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| K wrote: | | Eade said JdG is a worse kick than Dusty. I hope that's not true; Dusty's a terrible kick. JdG's first few I50's were good passes, but as the game progressed his kicking precision did get a lot worse. |
This is a bizarre statement. For one, Dusty's not a terrible kick. Even if he were why would it matter if JDG is of a similar quality? Dusty is easily in the top echelon of players. If he and in turn JDG can reach that echelon despite being a "terrible" kick, then being a "terrible" kick isn't exactly a problem, is it?
Other players that are supposedly terrible kicks: Treloar, Dangerfield, Fyfe. Being perceived as poor kicks hasn't held any of them back. And it is only perception, most of these, like Dusty and JDG sometimes look like poor kicks because of their acceleration and amount of contested ball. It's mostly a positive thing for the best players to have lower DE%, it means they're taking the game on and winning hard ball. Those with higher DE usually play too safe or soft and are not among the absolute elite players - other than freaks like Pendles who can stop time.
JDG kicks the ball well, as does Dusty.
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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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You seem to think that being a bad kick makes you supremely good at everything else. That's a very strange belief. Of course, a very small number of players are bad kicks and brilliant at many other things, but comparisons of two players' kicking does not mean they are identical in every other footballing characteristic. (Unfortunately, part of the Dusty-JdG comparisons is due to them being perceived by the media as bad boys.)
And I'm not sure Eade is right about the kicking either. It's just his opinion. (He was already gone when JdG arrived, right?)
The excuse about hard-ball gets for a low DE is incorrect in this specific case. We've discussed this before...
Last edited by K on Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:40 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| About what you would expect. |
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AN_Inkling
Joined: 06 Oct 2007
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I don't think any of these players are bad kicks. They do have low DE, just like a lot of the best players. This was only a small selection of the very best to show that having a low DE does not prevent a player from reaching the top. I'll add one more if you want, Ablett has a DE of 69%. This is considered poor, I don't think anyone considers Ablett a poor kick. DE is just a poor stat.
Dusty, Fyfe, Dangerfield are pretty much recognised as the best mids in the comp and Ablett one of the best of all time.
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Well done boys! |
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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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No one was looking up Dusty's or JdG's disposal efficiencies in the last couple of days. They expressed their opinions, right or wrong, based on what they saw. They saw him miss targets. That's it.
Neither GA's kicking nor his disposal efficiency have been questioned over his career. |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| That is a rather sweeping generalization about people. |
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RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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| K wrote: | No one was looking up Dusty's or JdG's disposal efficiencies in the last couple of days. They expressed their opinions, right or wrong, based on what they saw. They saw him miss targets. That's it.
Neither GA's kicking nor his disposal efficiency have been questioned over his career. |
I also saw him hit targets, or put the ball to the advantage of forwards. |
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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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| ^ You mean JdG? Yes, it was a mixed bag: some very good, some not so good. (I seem to recall an OOB on the full, too.) |
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Woods 
Joined: 21 Aug 2013
Location: Melbourne
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De Goey is rapidly becoming the most over-rated player on the Pies's list. People are being suckered in to the media hype that they so often critisice. The media are building him up in expectation of his next fall. Makes for sensational news making.
He's a good mid-fielder but is pretty lousy marking up forward, and his kicking to target is not up to the near $million price tag some people say he's worth.
He's also not indespensable to Collingwood, and Collingwood certainly don't want to go down the path of "building a team around him", or anyone else. Its not how Collingwood operate.
I would like to see him transit the bye without disgracing himself and ther club before re-signing him. |
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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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MatthewBoydFanClub
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: Elwood
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| Woods wrote: | De Goey is rapidly becoming the most over-rated player on the Pies's list. People are being suckered in to the media hype that they so often critisice. The media are building him up in expectation of his next fall. Makes for sensational news making.
He's a good mid-fielder but is pretty lousy marking up forward, and his kicking to target is not up to the near $million price tag some people say he's worth.
He's also not indespensable to Collingwood, and Collingwood certainly don't want to go down the path of "building a team around him", or anyone else. Its not how Collingwood operate.
I would like to see him transit the bye without disgracing himself and ther club before re-signing him. |
Over-rating or under-rating a player is purely in the eye of the beholder. Depends who you talk to. Even the experts and coaches disagree on the value of certain players. |
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lanstro
Joined: 04 Apr 2010
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JDG's recent performances have convinced me that we must keep him and persist. Don't overpay, but again I recognise that he's already quite valuable to our team balance and has potential to be the top few players at the club.
No doubt our high quality steady hands are more important to the team than him and if you're picking a team you mark down names like Pendles, Sidey, Grundy, Treloar, WHE, Dunn, Howe and Crisp ahead of him. You know what you're going to get with these guys, and we absolutely rely on these guys as our baseline.
We're lucky enough that we have a few players on the verge of joining this group like Shaz, Phillips, Thomas.
After these top liners you pick the developing players who you hope can join the group above (eg Cox, Langdon), and the flakey players who are potential game winners (Wells, Murray, Fas). JDG and Stevo are the players on the list who fit both these categories (maybe Moore too? may have missed a couple others), so I think they belong somewhere above the guys I just named and around the same level of the guys in the previous paragraph.
Yes JDG did absolutely nothing against the tigers and not a whole lot more the last couple of weeks, but he was also the gamewinner against the lions and the demons, and has also kicked another bag in the interim. If we want to mix it deep in September we do need a few gamewinners like him, and we'd be hoping that his worst games get better over time while he continues to be the gamewinner every few games. |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| Woods wrote: | De Goey is rapidly becoming the most over-rated player on the Pies's list. People are being suckered in to the media hype that they so often critisice. The media are building him up in expectation of his next fall. Makes for sensational news making.
He's a good mid-fielder but is pretty lousy marking up forward, and his kicking to target is not up to the near $million price tag some people say he's worth.
He's also not indespensable to Collingwood, and Collingwood certainly don't want to go down the path of "building a team around him", or anyone else. Its not how Collingwood operate.
I would like to see him transit the bye without disgracing himself and ther club before re-signing him. |
No way would you build a team around him, but he's a very valuable member of the team with a lot of scope for improvement.
His marking needs improvement but it's not lousy, he has serious speed off the mark, is strong and will only get stronger now he's apparently discovered the weights room, can play inside and outside mid as well as leading forward.......it's a pretty good package, if he can continue to develop.
$1.8M is a fir price for his age and potential. It's up to him then to be in a position in 2-3 years time to either command a payrise, or not.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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35forever
"I feel sick - dada dada dada da"
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Location: Physical=Sunshine Coast -- Mental=Vic Park
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Its not just up to us what Jordy gets from here on in. He's Just the sort of player the middle to bottom sides are drooling over: Young, big, strong, exceptionally talented, and with his best footy ahead. Someone to build a side around in a couple of years. Grab him now while its still possible, develop him for a year or two, then make him Captain etc. Exactly as Brizzo were hoping to do with Beamer.
If these clubs offer 800-900 & we only wanna pay 500, say bye-bye. He'd be an idiot to chuck a million bucks over 3 yrs, I very seldom do that... you?
If he achieves the level of consistency of Pendles/Sidey he'll be among the game's elite, the top ten, & therefore getting 1-1.2 mn. At least we don't hand kids 50-100 million like the US & Europe. That’s just fu*ked up! It ruins lives & turns young men into assholes & criminals.
These days, with the competition so tight, the AFL seems to be little more than a hunt for the next big star. Any club that HAS big stars & lets them go is suicidal.
... Oh, crap! Bye Jordy!
Last edited by 35forever on Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:48 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Dave The Man 
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia
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| RudeBoy wrote: | | K wrote: | No one was looking up Dusty's or JdG's disposal efficiencies in the last couple of days. They expressed their opinions, right or wrong, based on what they saw. They saw him miss targets. That's it.
Neither GA's kicking nor his disposal efficiency have been questioned over his career. |
I also saw him hit targets, or put the ball to the advantage of forwards. |
We don't have many Players that can do that
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I am Da Man |
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