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Damien 
Me Noah & Flynn @ the G
Joined: 21 Jan 1999
Location: Croydon Vic
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The succession plan hasn’t worked. Nobody with half a brain disputes that. But raking up the details doesn’t help anyone. Bucks and Ed ain’t going anywhere for now. You don’t reappoint a guy for two years and then sack him after round 1. It ain’t gunna happen. Accept that now and give yourself some peace. If we get to the halfway mark and there hasn’t been a dramatic improvement from what we saw Saturday night; then it’s time to start the bloodletting. It won’t happen before then and not should it.
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'Collingwood are the Bradmans of Football'
The Herald - 1930 |
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Dave The Man 
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia
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| Damien wrote: | | The succession plan hasn’t worked. Nobody with half a brain disputes that. But raking up the details doesn’t help anyone. Bucks and Ed ain’t going anywhere for now. You don’t reappoint a guy for two years and then sack him after round 1. It ain’t gunna happen. Accept that now and give yourself some peace. If we get to the halfway mark and there hasn’t been a dramatic improvement from what we saw Saturday night; then it’s time to start the bloodletting. It won’t happen before then and not should it. |
So we just have to Accept we will Suck and Probably get worse while Ed and Bucks are in Charge Then
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I am Da Man |
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Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
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| Cam wrote: | No, i never said it was due to the succession plan. I said the succession plan had failed. I didn't list any of the myriad of reasons why. Just that it had. Am I wrong? It could have worked, but it didn't and hasn't.
And no, we don't need to see a replacement that is demonstrably better, in fact, it was a gamble when Ed first got the job. [Mind you, I did hear a story about that once, but I won't elaborate] We just need a clean sweep, that's my opinion on how these things normally play out after someone has been at the top so long. Normally 10 years is enough.
Given Walsh, Balme, Swann, Pert, Allan etc etc there are many reasons that I am not going to list. There has been many great achievements, but you can go on one or two terms too many.
The Ws and Ls are what history records. |
Cam my only out for Bucks, post the takeover, is that for at least six seasons, he was blighted by mass injuries time and again to the team, year after year, to vital players, too I recall one night game,we had so many injuries we had to recall a guy who had played in the VFL, that same afternoon, I order to field a team.! So, Bucks has had a shit run with injuries, all sides get them, yes, but ours were never ending. BUT, this is a new season, and I was bitterly upset re the loss to the dawks, whom are no longer a power team. Granted we had three top foreards out, de goey, fas, and Elliott, and I guess Wells too. But it did expect us to win, not just turn up our toes like that ! Bottom line is, if we go 1-5 after six rounds, then I think its all over red rover, and Bucks must go, and Godk knows, I have been a big fan of Bucks thru this, but now even my patience has run out, I'm done, just done at present. And if Bucks goes, eddie must go too, hes past his best, been there too long, its time for him to go. We cannot amble along the way we are, if we go 1-5, Bucks and Eddie can be shown the door, and we can start to get something out of this season, some spark, some flair, some excitement, cos deep down, I still think we have a very good list, we just need a fresh start, a s a p. 
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Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
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Damien
Me Noah & Flynn @ the G
Joined: 21 Jan 1999
Location: Croydon Vic
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| Dave The Man wrote: | | Damien wrote: | | The succession plan hasn’t worked. Nobody with half a brain disputes that. But raking up the details doesn’t help anyone. Bucks and Ed ain’t going anywhere for now. You don’t reappoint a guy for two years and then sack him after round 1. It ain’t gunna happen. Accept that now and give yourself some peace. If we get to the halfway mark and there hasn’t been a dramatic improvement from what we saw Saturday night; then it’s time to start the bloodletting. It won’t happen before then and not should it. |
So we just have to Accept we will Suck and Probably get worse while Ed and Bucks are in Charge Then |
Dave I’m still optimistic it can turn but I’m saying that if it doesn’t nothing should happen til halfway. I think on the back of a review which resulted in a 2 year extension Bucks deserves a chance to at least get his best 22 on the park and settled. Regardless of which camp you were in at the end of last season.
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'Collingwood are the Bradmans of Football'
The Herald - 1930 |
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Cam 
Nick's BB Member #166
Joined: 10 May 2002
Location: Springvale
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Look, it can turn. Of course it can, we can have three meritorious wins or even two, out of the next six, get on a roll, who knows? It's possible we could turn at say 5-7 or who knows, 7-5? And be 3 or 4 games outside the eight at the end.
But would that be an improvement?
Or is the plan to finish down the ladder, so we can secure Sloane and Lynch easily, then give NCB the firepower to make finals in 2019?
Is that what we are aiming for? If we are then expect to hear alot of 'Nathan has a two year contract that we will be honoring'.
The worst bit about last year... the WORST bit... was our abject failure to get more games into kids. That's in part why Essendon are doing so well.
If we are not good enough, we are not good enough. I've been positive and reasoned for 3-4 years. But cmon, its feeling like '86, and '96, years when well, it was frustrating to be a pies fan. I tuned out when the likes of Hider, Sharkey, Liddell and Wild were on our list.
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Get back on top. |
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swoop42 
Whatcha gonna do when he comes for you?
Joined: 02 Aug 2008
Location: The 18
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Actually Cam a good rubbing wipes away the tension after a loss and can leave a white stain.
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He's mad. He's bad. He's MaynHARD! |
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Cam
Nick's BB Member #166
Joined: 10 May 2002
Location: Springvale
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In 'My Brother Jack' they used salt to get rid of such stains swoop.
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Get back on top. |
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Damien
Me Noah & Flynn @ the G
Joined: 21 Jan 1999
Location: Croydon Vic
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| Cam wrote: | Look, it can turn. Of course it can, we can have three meritorious wins or even two, out of the next six, get on a roll, who knows? It's possible we could turn at say 5-7 or who knows, 7-5? And be 3 or 4 games outside the eight at the end.
But would that be an improvement?
Or is the plan to finish down the ladder, so we can secure Sloane and Lynch easily, then give NCB the firepower to make finals in 2019?
Is that what we are aiming for? If we are then expect to hear alot of 'Nathan has a two year contract that we will be honoring'.
The worst bit about last year... the WORST bit... was our abject failure to get more games into kids. That's in part why Essendon are doing so well.
If we are not good enough, we are not good enough. I've been positive and reasoned for 3-4 years. But cmon, its feeling like '86, and '96, years when well, it was frustrating to be a pies fan. I tuned out when the likes of Hider, Sharkey, Liddell and Wild were on our list. |
I very much doubt that’s the plan Cam. The 2 years was just to take some of the speculation away. There will be no second year if marked improvement hasn’t happened and Eddie won’t be there next year either. The situation will be a lot clearer in eight weeks.
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'Collingwood are the Bradmans of Football'
The Herald - 1930 |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| Ah. When? |
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die4pies
Homeward bound
Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Location: Trenerry Cres.
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| Piesnchess wrote: | | Cam wrote: | No, i never said it was due to the succession plan. I said the succession plan had failed. I didn't list any of the myriad of reasons why. Just that it had. Am I wrong? It could have worked, but it didn't and hasn't.
And no, we don't need to see a replacement that is demonstrably better, in fact, it was a gamble when Ed first got the job. [Mind you, I did hear a story about that once, but I won't elaborate] We just need a clean sweep, that's my opinion on how these things normally play out after someone has been at the top so long. Normally 10 years is enough.
Given Walsh, Balme, Swann, Pert, Allan etc etc there are many reasons that I am not going to list. There has been many great achievements, but you can go on one or two terms too many.
The Ws and Ls are what history records. |
Cam my only out for Bucks, post the takeover, is that for at least six seasons, he was blighted by mass injuries time and again to the team, year after year, to vital players, too I recall one night game,we had so many injuries we had to recall a guy who had played in the VFL, that same afternoon, I order to field a team.! So, Bucks has had a shit run with injuries, all sides get them, yes, but ours were never ending. BUT, this is a new season, and I was bitterly upset re the loss to the dawks, whom are no longer a power team. Granted we had three top foreards out, de goey, fas, and Elliott, and I guess Wells too. But it did expect us to win, not just turn up our toes like that ! Bottom line is, if we go 1-5 after six rounds, then I think its all over red rover, and Bucks must go, and Godk knows, I have been a big fan of Bucks thru this, but now even my patience has run out, I'm done, just done at present. And if Bucks goes, eddie must go too, hes past his best, been there too long, its time for him to go. We cannot amble along the way we are, if we go 1-5, Bucks and Eddie can be shown the door, and we can start to get something out of this season, some spark, some flair, some excitement, cos deep down, I still think we have a very good list, we just need a fresh start, a s a p. |
In 2010 we blooded a swag youngsters and even rookies to cover "mass injuries"
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"MAKE COLLINGWOOD GRATE AGAIN" |
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MagpieBat
Joined: 27 Nov 2010
Location: Brooding in a cave... somewhere... maybe...
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| swoop42 wrote: | Caro on the ABC was alluding to the fact Buckley might have a clause in his contract he must reach to trigger that second year.
If he doesn't then just pay him out and pay the tax if required.
I know I was fairly confident of the club parting ways with him last season also, hell Buckley expected it to if we failed to play finals but at present I sense a real change in mood on the boards and people who rarely post are doing just that and expressing there anger or those who have tried to remain hopeful have reached the point they just want to see positive results flow and are prepared for life after Buckley now. |
The exchange in question, from Sunday's Offsiders...
| Quote: | Wilson: "Clearly, if it doesn't work this year, he'll go, he won't survive into next year".
Hinds: "Do you think there's a clause in that contract? That he's got a two year deal, he's got two more years, do you think there's a performance clause?"
Wilson: "I have my suspicions."
Hinds: "Okay."
Wilson: "I have my suspicions." |
Yeah... colour me unconvinced.
But, I concur. Hang the tax, hang the payout, just do him already...
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I am vengeance. I am the night. I am MagpieBat. |
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The Boy Who Cried Wolf
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Location: We prefer free speech - you know it's right
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It'll all be over by round 6-7 but regardless another wasted year.
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All Aboard!! Choo Choo!!! |
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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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| Jezza wrote: | ...
It is true that Malthouse did not adhere to his end of the deal by staying on as 'director of coach' for the 2012, 2013 and 2014 seasons and this didn't help Buckley's development as a coach.
I think the biggest mistake made with the benefit of hindsight was that Buckley was thrown into a job that he wasn't ready for. He had barely undergone a proper coaching apprenticeship like most coaches do, so he was essentially learning on the job from the beginning. It's inevitable that has he's attained more experience, he's becoming better equipped with what the role has entailed, but unfortunately I don't think that will be enough for him to survive beyond this two year period.
What also hasn't helped Buckley is he started coaching the club when it was still one of the best sides in the competitions, which isn't something most coaches experience. ...
Buckley is not to be solely blamed for the club's decline in recent years, but he's played a pivotal role in our decline unfortunately. |
Yes, parachuting someone into the senior coaching job is flirting with disaster in the modern era. The board really should have known better, but the same mistake was made with Voss and Hird. Amazing. After the Tim Watson debacle, everyone said this would never happen again. You could blame short memories, but I guess it's more a case of invoking some sort of exceptionalism, according to which your plan or your man are simply too special for history to apply. The beginning of exceptionalism is the end of professionalism. |
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MatthewBoydFanClub
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: Elwood
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| K wrote: | | Jezza wrote: | ...
It is true that Malthouse did not adhere to his end of the deal by staying on as 'director of coach' for the 2012, 2013 and 2014 seasons and this didn't help Buckley's development as a coach.
I think the biggest mistake made with the benefit of hindsight was that Buckley was thrown into a job that he wasn't ready for. He had barely undergone a proper coaching apprenticeship like most coaches do, so he was essentially learning on the job from the beginning. It's inevitable that has he's attained more experience, he's becoming better equipped with what the role has entailed, but unfortunately I don't think that will be enough for him to survive beyond this two year period.
What also hasn't helped Buckley is he started coaching the club when it was still one of the best sides in the competitions, which isn't something most coaches experience. ...
Buckley is not to be solely blamed for the club's decline in recent years, but he's played a pivotal role in our decline unfortunately. |
Yes, parachuting someone into the senior coaching job is flirting with disaster in the modern era. The board really should have known better, but the same mistake was made with Voss and Hird. Amazing. After the Tim Watson debacle, everyone said this would never happen again. You could blame short memories, but I guess it's more a case of invoking some sort of exceptionalism, according to which your plan or your man are simply too special for history to apply. The beginning of exceptionalism is the end of professionalism. |
I'm opposite to everybody else then. We already have a coach in waiting employed at the club to take over the senior job in case Buckley falls on his sword. The problem is that it's his first year out as an assistant coach. It's rubbish imo that Buckley was thrown into the job without sufficient preparation. I've worked with many CEO's in industry. My experience is you either have it, or you don't have it. All managers learn on the job. Buckley is an infinitely better coach now than he was when he first started and my guess is he feels he's the best to takes the club forward. That's fair enough in my book and everybody is too harsh in criticising him for wanting him to keep going. The problem is that within the human race some people just aren't up to it performing certain jobs and it makes no difference how hard they try. I would question anyway why anybody would want to be an AFL coach. I wouldn't do the job for a million dollars. |
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MatthewBoydFanClub
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: Elwood
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| I should add that Leigh Matthews was thrown into the senior coaching job in his first year of assistant coaching by one of the wisest men you would ever have the pleasure of knowing, in Bobby Rose and it didn't hurt Matthew's career. |
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