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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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^ or, umm, how about we don’t change it at all ? Most people are happy enough celebrating it right where it is. And if you still have a chip on your shoulder about the relatively few years out of the last 230 that we were a prison colony (though of course it was always about more than that), I’d suggest you worry about the flag, which is far more symbolic of that other country than Australia Day.
It is revealing that this started off being about aboriginal feelings, but now it has become shame about our actual colonial history - a colony which grew, through the sweat and enterprise of her people, and through beneficent trading and other links with Britain, into one of the wealthiest countries in the world - a country with formidably stable and incorruptible institutions that came to underpin an independent, tolerant and free society with some of the best worker’s rights and highest standards of living in the world. That happened as it did because of what took place in 1788. It was not all charity and pleasantry, because no nation that survives ever is. But it was a bloody great achievement and the parentage was a large part of why.
When the terms of the grievance keep changing, there is usually something strange at play.
_________________
Two more flags before I die!
Last edited by Mugwump on Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:12 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| sixpoints wrote: | | Mugwump wrote: | ^ yes, those same people were desperate to change Anzac Day in the 1970s and 1980s because it supposedly “glorified war”... they are, I suppose, just not bright enough to understand that a day of significance can bear many levels of meaning, interpretation and reflection as Anzac Day does.
I can see every reason to use 26th January as a day of sober reflection on what was lost by the Aboriginal people, while also celebrating that the Spanish didn’t colonise the country, given their long history of savage exploitation of native people, political corruption and military coups. The SJW and small interest groups can only cope with one meaning, it seems - the one meaning that rewrites our nation’s history as a chapter of shame (and theirs, by extension, a glorious struggle for niceness) so that they can claim rights on the present. |
The 26/01 is certainly one of those days of significance that have always borne different levels of meaning and interpretation. I think we all need to be "bright enough" to understand that.
Since the 26/01 was chosen as the National Day in the 1930's (chosen by a committee mind you and not officially ratified by all states until 1994), it has generated alternative views. The first Day of Mourning occurred back in 1938, it is not something new. For as long as we have had the committee chosen 26/01, we have had opposing responses to that decision. |
Sure, and I’m completely in accord with some people mourning on 26 Jan if they choose to. It is a free country and if that is how they wish to see it, that is their right. I think that is too mono-dimensional, but in their shoes I might feel the same, though I hope I’d see history with more subtlety.
The proposition that the date needs to be changed because there are some sorrows and regrets associated with it is the daft bit. Anzac Day certainly has many sorrows associated with it. If 26 Jan is “invasion day”, do we start calling Anzac Day “defeat day” and banish it as a day of prime significance in our history ?
For the avoidance of doubt I was not suggesting that you were “not bright enough” on this point. I was whacking the intellect of those people on the left who used to abuse Anzac Day and now abuse Australia Day. There is something very dopey about people who are unable to see that things can have mingled sadness and greatness within them all at once, and that a nation is actually better for acknowledging and embracing that duality. Anzac Day is a prime example, as is Easter, of course. I think we have become culturally more shallow about this, as we have about many things. A culture can lose its intellectual rigour and emotional depth just as people can.
_________________
Two more flags before I die! |
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think positive 
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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on A Current affair the bogans all want it changed to the "'real" Aussie day!
May8te!!
at least hubby might remember our anniversary!!
_________________
You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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^ oh yes, propaganda works, all right. ACA watchers probably think the first fleet carried the first Pommy cricket team for the first ashes test in, oh, 1958 or thereabouts.
I think it’s almost certain that Jan 26 will die, because years of cheap nationalism and historical amnesia dissolve the capacity of ordinary people to resist emotional slogans about complicated things.
_________________
Two more flags before I die! |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| Mugwump wrote: | ^ oh yes, propaganda works, all right. ACA watchers probably think the first fleet carried the first Pommy cricket team for the first ashes test in, oh, 1958 or thereabouts.
I think it’s almost certain that Jan 26 will die, because years of cheap nationalism and historical amnesia dissolve the capacity of ordinary people to resist emotional slogans about complicated things. |
nah, i got 100% on the citizen test, and the answer to that question was: the ashes came from the boat Fletcher Christian burnt down!
not so sure im wanted here by the way, i still dont have a date for the ceremony!!
_________________
You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| Is Fletcher Christian that all-rounder who plays for the Hobart Hurricanes or is he that bloke who played CHB for the ‘Pies in the old days? |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| think positive wrote: | | Mugwump wrote: | ^ oh yes, propaganda works, all right. ACA watchers probably think the first fleet carried the first Pommy cricket team for the first ashes test in, oh, 1958 or thereabouts.
I think it’s almost certain that Jan 26 will die, because years of cheap nationalism and historical amnesia dissolve the capacity of ordinary people to resist emotional slogans about complicated things. |
nah, i got 100% on the citizen test, and the answer to that question was: the ashes came from the boat Fletcher Christian burnt down!
not so sure im wanted here by the way, i still dont have a date for the ceremony!! |
Rubbish. The Ashes came from my Aunt Merryl. Poor love asked to be scattered at Lourdes, but these things are hard to follow over the phone.
_________________
Two more flags before I die! |
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Skids 
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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An aboriginal mates post on facebook....
"U won't see me protesting n an caring on Australian day il be busting my $@#$%& working to put food on the table"
The bleeding hearts brigade need to **** off back to another sob story that tugs at their heart strings and just leave this one alone... but they won't.
They whinge and whine until they get their way and feel better about themselves. There is no end to this nonsense, it's a plague over the planet.
_________________
Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| Pies4shaw wrote: | | Is Fletcher Christian that all-rounder who plays for the Hobart Hurricanes or is he that bloke who played CHB for the ‘Pies in the old days? |
nah, that was Marlon Brando and Mugwumps Aunt.
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| Skids wrote: | An aboriginal mates post on facebook....
"U won't see me protesting n an caring on Australian day il be busting my $@#$%& working to put food on the table"
The bleeding hearts brigade need to **** off back to another sob story that tugs at their heart strings and just leave this one alone... but they won't.
They whinge and whine until they get their way and feel better about themselves. There is no end to this nonsense, it's a plague over the planet. |
Seems like you're doing a lot of whinging about it.
_________________
All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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When someone repeatedly finds reasons to park their tanks on your lawn, David, it’s not whingeing to ask/ tell them to find something better to do.
_________________
Two more flags before I die! |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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An interesting metaphor, Mugwump, in the context!
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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Interesting article I thought by another Indigenous person.
| Quote: | It is high time we rejected the myth that all we blackfellas think and feel the same. Peddling that myth silences the majority of us who hold different views from the enshrined “Aboriginal viewpoint”.
People such as Lynda Burney and Jackie Huggins have told you that the celebration of Australia Day causes us all great pain. Well, I have lived and worked all of my life in the far north, in Darwin and Alice Springs and in remote communities. I have never heard anybody talk of the pain of Australia Day.
Maybe there are some people, but everybody I know celebrates the day with enjoyment and pride. Perhaps all of this agony only happens in southern cities.
Let’s be honest about where the argument to change the date comes from: a place of resentment, anger and now hate. The vitriol that has been directed at me, as an Aboriginal woman, for voicing my opinion and for encouraging a healthier way of thinking, has been far, far worse then any alleged racist sentiment claimed to come from the celebration of Australia Day.
Is changing the date some kind of quick fix to obscure the failure to solve our real problems? Symbolic acts have no meaningful impact on Australia’s most marginalised, so why then are so many so happy to invest vast amounts of energy into a meaningless symbolic act?
It is a pathetic attempt at appeasing resentment, anger and white guilt.. |
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/opinion/australia-day-holiday-2018-attacks-on-day-reject-our-history-writes-jacinta-nampijinpa-price/news-story/62ed0801529f468aa3ffcd76db5c8456
Interesting historical point that I hadn't heard raised previously.
| Quote: | | On January 26, 1949, we all became Australian citizens — including Aboriginal Australians — when the Nationality and Citizenship Act came into force. Neither my white or my black grandparents were citizens before that. Aboriginal Australians, including my grandparents, were still denied some citizenship rights after that through state legislation, but that had all gone before I was born. |
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| David wrote: | | An interesting metaphor, Mugwump, in the context! |
Not especially. The post in question was about “the bleeding hearts brigade”, who fly from issue to issue demanding change to something that is settled, familiar and time-honoured. They are the tank-parkers. If you wish to use the metaphor out of context, in relation to white settlement, be my guest. But it was not how I used it.
_________________
Two more flags before I die! |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| stui magpie wrote: | Interesting article I thought by another Indigenous person.
| Quote: | It is high time we rejected the myth that all we blackfellas think and feel the same. Peddling that myth silences the majority of us who hold different views from the enshrined “Aboriginal viewpoint”.
People such as Lynda Burney and Jackie Huggins have told you that the celebration of Australia Day causes us all great pain. Well, I have lived and worked all of my life in the far north, in Darwin and Alice Springs and in remote communities. I have never heard anybody talk of the pain of Australia Day.
Maybe there are some people, but everybody I know celebrates the day with enjoyment and pride. Perhaps all of this agony only happens in southern cities.
Let’s be honest about where the argument to change the date comes from: a place of resentment, anger and now hate. The vitriol that has been directed at me, as an Aboriginal woman, for voicing my opinion and for encouraging a healthier way of thinking, has been far, far worse then any alleged racist sentiment claimed to come from the celebration of Australia Day.
Is changing the date some kind of quick fix to obscure the failure to solve our real problems? Symbolic acts have no meaningful impact on Australia’s most marginalised, so why then are so many so happy to invest vast amounts of energy into a meaningless symbolic act?
It is a pathetic attempt at appeasing resentment, anger and white guilt.. |
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/opinion/australia-day-holiday-2018-attacks-on-day-reject-our-history-writes-jacinta-nampijinpa-price/news-story/62ed0801529f468aa3ffcd76db5c8456
Interesting historical point that I hadn't heard raised previously.
| Quote: | | On January 26, 1949, we all became Australian citizens — including Aboriginal Australians — when the Nationality and Citizenship Act came into force. Neither my white or my black grandparents were citizens before that. Aboriginal Australians, including my grandparents, were still denied some citizenship rights after that through state legislation, but that had all gone before I was born. |
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Very interesting that second quote, and the first, sensible and brave lady going against the flow.
_________________
You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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