| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Toppi 
Joined: 24 Mar 2005
Location: Melbourne, Victoria
|
| Post subject: |  |
|
I don't think on current stocks we should get excited. However, if we can get Tom Lynch and draft the best KPF next draft then we might be looking great. I'm torn on the best for pick 6. Brander, D. Fogarty or Balta. I think we should punt on Balta as a running tall defender who can kick. Then IF we get Lynch and a key forward suddenly Moore becomes our 3rd tall and second ruck. I know. Dreams but i hope this is the plan.
_________________
When it's all said and done, and the Premierships won. It's Collingwood forerver more. |
|
|
|
 |
MatthewBoydFanClub
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: Elwood
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| They had a special on Fox footy on the draft candidates and both Brander and Fogarty looked great to me. Either would be a fantastic pick at pick 6 and there were others as well who I would be happy to pick up at pick 6. I just wish we had a pick in the twenties because I feel a good player will drop back to the twenties. I'm not sure at pick 38 there are any viable choices to pick up a long term KPP with this pick. |
|
|
|
|
5 from the wing on debut
Joined: 27 May 2016
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| Adam Treloar 3 Votes wrote: | | [quote="5 from the wing on debut" |
I love your blind optimism but what is your definition of rosy? To me things will be rosy when we have a team that is a serious flag contender, not just for one flash in the pan year, but for multiple years.[/quote]
How many times over the last 40 years has Collingwood or any other team for that matter had a team that was a serious flag contender for multiple consecutive years? I would suggest less than 10 sides in total and only once with the pies. So you go back to your half empty glass whilst waiting for a once in a generation event to occur while the rest of us enjoy the 2018 season 🙂[/quote]
I am a realist. You may see that as looking at the glass half full but I just call it for what it is. If you think that things are rosy, perhaps you have many empty glasses.
Over the last 40 years serious flag contenders for multiple years were:-
1. Collingwood from 77 to 81
2. North from 77 to 79
3. Carlton from 78 to early 80's
4. Hawthorn from 77 to 79
5. Hawthorn from 82 for the next decade
6. Essendon in the mid 80's
7. West Coast 91 to 94
8. Geelong 92 to 95
9. North from 96 to 99
10. Adelaide 97 and 98
11. Brisbane 2001 to 2004
12. Collingwood 2002 and 2003
13. Sydney 2005 and 2006
14. West Coast 2005 and 2006
15. Geelong 2007 to 2011
16. Collingwood 2010 and 2011
17. St Kilda 2009 and 2010
18. Hawthorn 2012 to 2015
19. Sydney 2014 to 2016.
There may be some that I have forgotten about, but each of those teams were serious flag contenders for at least 2 years. On my assessment, there were 19 such teams in 40 years, an average of once every 2.1 years. I wouldn't call 2.1 years a generation.
I am hopeful that we do enjoy 2018. I have found little joy watching the team in the last 6 years so that would make a nice change. I just don't see the point each year saying how good things will be next year, without any real basis to be making that assertion.
In my previous post I set out some reasons about why I was cautious about the prospects for next year. You chose not to respond to those comments, other than to refer to a glass half full. Comments such as that are a waste of time.
I don't care if you disagree with my opinions. That's what this board is about. All you seem to be relying on is hope. Why will the team play finals in 2018? Where will the improvement come from? What is being done to remedy the obvious deficiencies? Care to comment upon that? |
|
|
|
|
HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| The opposite of not being done to remedy the obvious deficiencies. |
|
|
|
|
droversdog65
Joined: 27 Nov 2014
|
| Post subject: | |
|
We have forward issues but they don't mainly stem from structure.
Going through the middle and forward entries are our problems and it's not that we don't have at least most of the cattle.
We are either slow and indirect or recklessly fast and direct, there seems to be little middle ground.
I know it sounds silly saying middle of the ground transitions can effect a forward line adversely but it's very true nevertheless because it means forwards can't be decisive with their leads if the ball is zigzagging all over the place - and even going backwards FFS.
The end effect is that the opposition has oodles of time to get back and not only cover but to set up for the rebound by the time we finish fiddling around with it.
In the end better forwards will help but still be hamstrung by poor upfield transitions. Conversely better transitions will create better forwards. |
|
|
|
|
Adam Treloar 3 Votes
Joined: 09 May 2017
|
| Post subject: | |
|
^ 5 from the wing
You jumped on me because I dared to post that with the continued growth of Grundy, Cox and Moore along with the acquisition of a number 6 pick this year and hopefully Tom Lynch next year then things would be looking rosy. Tom Lynch is no guarantee but would be huge. Most fair minded people would look upon the future of our young talented list with Tom Lynch in the goal square as being rosy. But not you and no doubt not masoncox and a couple of the others posters on here that cry themselves to sleep every night.
You didn't challenge any of the other 7 or 8 posters ahead of me including the OP of the thread who were all similarly positive of where we are heading, good for you.
You then come out with a grandiose statement about a flash in a pan season not being acceptable but only a continued sustained seasons would be rosy.
Having realised the rarity of the event you have backed the truck up to now include teams that didn't even win a premiership lol. I'll take a single premiership year like the bulldogs last year over 4 years of finals but no premiership any day of the week. The Collingwood Board will be happy that you are so easily satisfied.
Anyone that bothered to take interest and watch Nathan Buckley press conferences would know that he is aspiring to win not just a single premiership but multiple. Putting the team together to do that doesn't happen overnight.
I have posted on this site previously with all the items where we are better placed going into next season then we were this season so not going to waste my time doing it again.
I am 43 years old, we have won two premierships in my lifetime and there have certainly been times where I had lost hope (Tony Shaw coaching years come to mind), heading into 2018 with a young talented list is not one of those. I have no issue with posters whom mean well and support the club and team but are not so positive on where we are at. What I do dislike are those posters who disappear after a win and only pop up on this site after a loss to throw rocks (masoncox and others).
Your right I don't agree with your assessment and I don't care that you don't agree with mine but just remember you jumped on my post as you presumably not like supporters being optimistic about where their team is heading, it wasn't the other way around.
_________________
People forget that our last premiership was only 2010 and rebuilds take some time. 2018 we play finals again. |
|
|
|
|
masoncox
masoncox
Joined: 31 Aug 2015
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| Adam Treloar 3 Votes wrote: | ^ 5 from the wing
You jumped on me because I dared to post that with the continued growth of Grundy, Cox and Moore along with the acquisition of a number 6 pick this year and hopefully Tom Lynch next year then things would be looking rosy. Tom Lynch is no guarantee but would be huge. Most fair minded people would look upon the future of our young talented list with Tom Lynch in the goal square as being rosy. But not you and no doubt not masoncox and a couple of the others posters on here that cry themselves to sleep every night.
You didn't challenge any of the other 7 or 8 posters ahead of me including the OP of the thread who were all similarly positive of where we are heading, good for you.
You then come out with a grandiose statement about a flash in a pan season not being acceptable but only a continued sustained seasons would be rosy.
Having realised the rarity of the event you have backed the truck up to now include teams that didn't even win a premiership lol. I'll take a single premiership year like the bulldogs last year over 4 years of finals but no premiership any day of the week. The Collingwood Board will be happy that you are so easily satisfied.
Anyone that bothered to take interest and watch Nathan Buckley press conferences would know that he is aspiring to win not just a single premiership but multiple. Putting the team together to do that doesn't happen overnight.
I have posted on this site previously with all the items where we are better placed going into next season then we were this season so not going to waste my time doing it again.
I am 43 years old, we have won two premierships in my lifetime and there have certainly been times where I had lost hope (Tony Shaw coaching years come to mind), heading into 2018 with a young talented list is not one of those. I have no issue with posters whom mean well and support the club and team but are not so positive on where we are at. What I do dislike are those posters who disappear after a win and only pop up on this site after a loss to throw rocks (masoncox and others).
Your right I don't agree with your assessment and I don't care that you don't agree with mine but just remember you jumped on my post as you presumably not like supporters being optimistic about where their team is heading, it wasn't the other way around. |
Buckley inherited a two time grand final team and now he has been 6 years in rebuilding. Last year we recruited Mayne and this year we wanted to give him back to Freo for our second round pick. Last year we signed up Blair again for 2 years when no one and I mean no one in the footy world thought it was a good idea. This year we traded a second round pick for an untried rookie. Buckley was given a two year extension when again no professional club would have considered it. We have traded out 8 grand final players and we still finished 13th with a soft draw. Our game plan and game day strategy has not been admired by any footy scribe. Every year we play ring around the rosie with our assistant coaches. More changes than a revolving door at Myers. Last year Buckley came back from his fact finding tour of the USA and stated that he won't micro manage anymore. This is what a lot of people had told him for years. The fight a few years back between Walsh and Pert was ugly and the club did nothing about it. The player development has been poor since Buckley arrived. The signing of 18 AFL players or so since 2011 has produced very little of value given what we traded for or payed out in salaries. The list is reasonable but we lack the required number of A graders to take us to the premiership window. The problem with the blind mice posters is that they truly don't take a realistic point of view. Finally, I am a great supporter of Melbourne Storm. I actually go to their games more than to Collingwood. I find the Storm to be absolutely fantastic in all facets of the Club. From player development to the way they appreciate the fans. Everything is magnificent in the way they approach their job. I have a problem with the way collingwood is run but not with the Storm. Now AT3V who do you think is the better run Club. |
|
|
|
|
5 from the wing on debut
Joined: 27 May 2016
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| Adam Treloar 3 Votes wrote: | ^ 5 from the wing
You jumped on me because I dared to post that with the continued growth of Grundy, Cox and Moore along with the acquisition of a number 6 pick this year and hopefully Tom Lynch next year then things would be looking rosy. Tom Lynch is no guarantee but would be huge. Most fair minded people would look upon the future of our young talented list with Tom Lynch in the goal square as being rosy. But not you and no doubt not masoncox and a couple of the others posters on here that cry themselves to sleep every night.
You didn't challenge any of the other 7 or 8 posters ahead of me including the OP of the thread who were all similarly positive of where we are heading, good for you.
You then come out with a grandiose statement about a flash in a pan season not being acceptable but only a continued sustained seasons would be rosy.
Having realised the rarity of the event you have backed the truck up to now include teams that didn't even win a premiership lol. I'll take a single premiership year like the bulldogs last year over 4 years of finals but no premiership any day of the week. The Collingwood Board will be happy that you are so easily satisfied.
Anyone that bothered to take interest and watch Nathan Buckley press conferences would know that he is aspiring to win not just a single premiership but multiple. Putting the team together to do that doesn't happen overnight.
I have posted on this site previously with all the items where we are better placed going into next season then we were this season so not going to waste my time doing it again.
I am 43 years old, we have won two premierships in my lifetime and there have certainly been times where I had lost hope (Tony Shaw coaching years come to mind), heading into 2018 with a young talented list is not one of those. I have no issue with posters whom mean well and support the club and team but are not so positive on where we are at. What I do dislike are those posters who disappear after a win and only pop up on this site after a loss to throw rocks (masoncox and others).
Your right I don't agree with your assessment and I don't care that you don't agree with mine but just remember you jumped on my post as you presumably not like supporters being optimistic about where their team is heading, it wasn't the other way around. |
I haven't backed up on anything. It appears that you don't understand what the word "contend" means.
As for "jumping on you", all I did was disagree with your rosy comment. I said why in my post. Don't take that as a personal attack. My view of the club is not related to anything that you say. If everyone on this site had the same opinion it would be quite boring.
I didn't comment about Moore. I didn't comment about the growth of Grundy and Cox. I did raise the issue of whether Grundy and Cox could coexist in the same team. I would love to see that develop, but the jury is still out on that issue. That's not the way that the game is moving.
I have no issue with supporters being optimistic, but I am interested in why, given our recent history. |
|
|
|
|
The Boy Who Cried Wolf
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Location: We prefer free speech - you know it's right
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| 5 from the wing on debut wrote: |
16. Collingwood 2010 and 2011
|
I'd include 2009
_________________
All Aboard!! Choo Choo!!! |
|
|
|
|
K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| The Boy Who Cried Wolf wrote: | | 5 from the wing on debut wrote: |
16. Collingwood 2010 and 2011
|
I'd include 2009 |
Perhaps Collingwood 1990-1992 is worthy of inclusion.
The '92 team was unlucky. |
|
|
|
|
Adam Treloar 3 Votes
Joined: 09 May 2017
|
| Post subject: | |
|
^ masoncox
Whilst you appear to have gone into great detail of every Collingwood issue of recent memory you forgot to mention your beloved Melbourne Storm getting caught red handed blatently cheating the salary cap. Yeah wonderful club management (not).
It's one thing to have a few lean years but it's another to be forever remembered as a club that cheated. Carlton will never live it down either and rightly so.
_________________
People forget that our last premiership was only 2010 and rebuilds take some time. 2018 we play finals again. |
|
|
|
|
masoncox
masoncox
Joined: 31 Aug 2015
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| Adam Treloar 3 Votes wrote: | ^ masoncox
Whilst you appear to have gone into great detail of every Collingwood issue of recent memory you forgot to mention your beloved Melbourne Storm getting caught red handed blatently cheating the salary cap. Yeah wonderful club management (not).
It's one thing to have a few lean years but it's another to be forever remembered as a club that cheated. Carlton will never live it down either and rightly so. |
Melbourne Storm when confronted with no points for the year went out and played every game as if their life depended on it.
It was their finest hour .....playing their guts out for no points..
What a champion team. And where did they end this year????
Premiers!
In all the football I watched this year both rugby and AFL the one thing that really impressed me was after the tigers won the flag Dusty Martin carried the cup down to the rooms and before the song was sang he insisted that every player both VFL and AFL was there to sing the song. It is all about the culture and Richmond had it this year. Collingwood do not have it. I don't think Buxkley has a clue about the right culture that is needed to win a flag. |
|
|
|
|
Adam Treloar 3 Votes
Joined: 09 May 2017
|
| Post subject: | |
|
^ masoncox
You say that as though your in the inner sanctum of the club which I doubt. I don't profess to know what the culture is like under Buckley, he says all of the right things during interviews etc. Another thing that stood out to me was each of our top Copeland finishers went out of their way to thank him and all made it clear they were glad he had been reappointed. They didn't have to as he had the job anyway but they did.
It may not count to you but I thought it was significant.
_________________
People forget that our last premiership was only 2010 and rebuilds take some time. 2018 we play finals again. |
|
|
|
|
masoncox
masoncox
Joined: 31 Aug 2015
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| Adam Treloar 3 Votes wrote: | ^ masoncox
You say that as though your in the inner sanctum of the club which I doubt. I don't profess to know what the culture is like under Buckley, he says all of the right things during interviews etc. Another thing that stood out to me was each of our top Copeland finishers went out of their way to thank him and all made it clear they were glad he had been reappointed. They didn't have to as he had the job anyway but they did.
It may not count to you but I thought it was significant. |
No doubt most current players like Buckley and he has their support. It wasn't so in the last 6 years. Buckley may well coach us deep into the finals. Who knows? if you give enough time anybody may impress. Next year we may dominate or we may sink. I just don't see us doing great things. We will wait and see. And lastly thankyou for posting in a civilized fashion. And I congratulate you for that. |
|
|
|
|
Adam Treloar 3 Votes
Joined: 09 May 2017
|
| Post subject: | |
|
^ masoncox
No problem and likewise, like most people I will react when things I am passionate about are threatened. People throw rocks at the Club, I will in all likelihood throw a couple at them.
But if sensible criticisms are aired in a proportionate manner then that is constructive and I have no issue with that.
_________________
People forget that our last premiership was only 2010 and rebuilds take some time. 2018 we play finals again. |
|
|
|
|
|
The Rules
FAQ
Usergroups
Calendar
Search
Log in
Register
