 |
|
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
|
| Post subject: |  |
|
| E wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | | daics aka the ruckman wrote: | | 35forever wrote: |
1/It's the best possible move CFC could make. What Roos is good at is lifting sides mentally, he's a highly intelligent guy, and knows what guys need (and that they are individuals!) |
I disagree.
Last season, second last game, Melbourne had to beat Carlton to make finals and lost. Last game against Geelong they lost by the biggest ever margin in Roos Coaching career. I don't think he changed much of the mental culture at all.
He was there for the money "all care and no responsibility" |
YES ! I don't want Roos, he didn't do the Deees any real power of good, made them some kinda defensive boring unit, and that last game v the cats did it for me, no way do I want this football mercenary now. I also think its just crap, eddie would never do that to Bucks, he may be thinking about post Bucks, if we have a poor second half of the season, but hed never sneak around behind his back like that, he thinks the world of Bucks. Just pub news, by some pissed as a fart journo, I reckon.  |
he coached that team during the rebuild so that he could set the next guy up for success. He dramatically changed the culture. The dees look really healthy now AND stable. Do you remember where they were when he agreed to take them over?
The job of rebuilding a team is thankless and nearly no coach survives it because fans simply don't have the patience and look only to win loss record and finals appearances in judging a coach.
Leigh Matthews once famously said "show me the man coaching the best group of players and i'll show you a great coach". He was referring more to the way coaches are judged rather than what actuially makes a good coach.
By the way, some coaches are better suited to rebuilds while others are better suited to coaching great teams. Phil Jackson for example, could never coach a crap side, but is widely considered one of the genius coaches of all time. Having Jordan, Pippen, Kobe and Shaq I'm sure had nothing to do with it.
. |
Roos first couple of yrs with the deees were shit, he had them playing boring as batshit footy, totally defensive. He did improve them a bit, but your only as good as your last game, and his was absolutely shocking. Hes too defensive, if bucks goes, we need a younger bloke, from todays footy mindset, someone like ratten or dew, Roos is yesterdays man now, I don't want to see us playing drige football under him. 
_________________
Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
|
|
|
 |
piedys 
Heeeeeeere's Dyso!!!
Joined: 04 Sep 2003
Location: Resident Forum Psychopath since 2003
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| Cam wrote: | If I recall rightly, Eddie was sighted meeting with Malthouse in Perth for coffee around May 1999. For what it's worth.
But I don't believe this one. For what that's worth as well. |
There's something happening here; what it is, ain't exactly clear...
_________________
M I L L A N E 4 2 forever |
|
|
|
|
E
Joined: 05 May 2010
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| Piesnchess wrote: | | E wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | | daics aka the ruckman wrote: | | 35forever wrote: |
1/It's the best possible move CFC could make. What Roos is good at is lifting sides mentally, he's a highly intelligent guy, and knows what guys need (and that they are individuals!) |
I disagree.
Last season, second last game, Melbourne had to beat Carlton to make finals and lost. Last game against Geelong they lost by the biggest ever margin in Roos Coaching career. I don't think he changed much of the mental culture at all.
He was there for the money "all care and no responsibility" |
YES ! I don't want Roos, he didn't do the Deees any real power of good, made them some kinda defensive boring unit, and that last game v the cats did it for me, no way do I want this football mercenary now. I also think its just crap, eddie would never do that to Bucks, he may be thinking about post Bucks, if we have a poor second half of the season, but hed never sneak around behind his back like that, he thinks the world of Bucks. Just pub news, by some pissed as a fart journo, I reckon. |
he coached that team during the rebuild so that he could set the next guy up for success. He dramatically changed the culture. The dees look really healthy now AND stable. Do you remember where they were when he agreed to take them over?
The job of rebuilding a team is thankless and nearly no coach survives it because fans simply don't have the patience and look only to win loss record and finals appearances in judging a coach.
Leigh Matthews once famously said "show me the man coaching the best group of players and i'll show you a great coach". He was referring more to the way coaches are judged rather than what actuially makes a good coach.
By the way, some coaches are better suited to rebuilds while others are better suited to coaching great teams. Phil Jackson for example, could never coach a crap side, but is widely considered one of the genius coaches of all time. Having Jordan, Pippen, Kobe and Shaq I'm sure had nothing to do with it.
. |
Roos first couple of yrs with the deees were shit, he had them playing boring as batshit footy, totally defensive. He did improve them a bit, but your only as good as your last game, and his was absolutely shocking. Hes too defensive, if bucks goes, we need a younger bloke, from todays footy mindset, someone like ratten or dew, Roos is yesterdays man now, I don't want to see us playing drige football under him. |
Do you happen to recall the players in that team that played boring footy. I believe Dawes was the only forward they had. Dawes!!!!!!
our premiership team of 2010 played really really boring footy in2008 and 2009. really boring. It was total boundary line shit. we were pulling our hair out to get mick to stop having them play along the boundary.
and when they were a good enough team to do so, they did come off the boundary and boy it was a beautiful thing.
my point. you can only coach an exciting brand of fotty successfully if you have the cattle.
roos was the rebuild coach. rebuild coaches dont have the cattle. if they had the cattle, someone other than roos would have agreed to coach them..... at the time of roos appointment, you may recall that NO_ONE wanted to coach them!
_________________
Ohhh, the Premiership's a cakewalk ....... |
|
|
|
|
Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| E wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | | E wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | | daics aka the ruckman wrote: | | 35forever wrote: |
1/It's the best possible move CFC could make. What Roos is good at is lifting sides mentally, he's a highly intelligent guy, and knows what guys need (and that they are individuals!) |
I disagree.
Last season, second last game, Melbourne had to beat Carlton to make finals and lost. Last game against Geelong they lost by the biggest ever margin in Roos Coaching career. I don't think he changed much of the mental culture at all.
He was there for the money "all care and no responsibility" |
YES ! I don't want Roos, he didn't do the Deees any real power of good, made them some kinda defensive boring unit, and that last game v the cats did it for me, no way do I want this football mercenary now. I also think its just crap, eddie would never do that to Bucks, he may be thinking about post Bucks, if we have a poor second half of the season, but hed never sneak around behind his back like that, he thinks the world of Bucks. Just pub news, by some pissed as a fart journo, I reckon. |
he coached that team during the rebuild so that he could set the next guy up for success. He dramatically changed the culture. The dees look really healthy now AND stable. Do you remember where they were when he agreed to take them over?
The job of rebuilding a team is thankless and nearly no coach survives it because fans simply don't have the patience and look only to win loss record and finals appearances in judging a coach.
Leigh Matthews once famously said "show me the man coaching the best group of players and i'll show you a great coach". He was referring more to the way coaches are judged rather than what actuially makes a good coach.
By the way, some coaches are better suited to rebuilds while others are better suited to coaching great teams. Phil Jackson for example, could never coach a crap side, but is widely considered one of the genius coaches of all time. Having Jordan, Pippen, Kobe and Shaq I'm sure had nothing to do with it.
. |
Roos first couple of yrs with the deees were shit, he had them playing boring as batshit footy, totally defensive. He did improve them a bit, but your only as good as your last game, and his was absolutely shocking. Hes too defensive, if bucks goes, we need a younger bloke, from todays footy mindset, someone like ratten or dew, Roos is yesterdays man now, I don't want to see us playing drige football under him. |
Do you happen to recall the players in that team that played boring footy. I believe Dawes was the only forward they had. Dawes!!!!!!
our premiership team of 2010 played really really boring footy in2008 and 2009. really boring. It was total boundary line shit. we were pulling our hair out to get mick to stop having them play along the boundary.
and when they were a good enough team to do so, they did come off the boundary and boy it was a beautiful thing.
my point. you can only coach an exciting brand of fotty successfully if you have the cattle.
roos was the rebuild coach. rebuild coaches dont have the cattle. if they had the cattle, someone other than roos would have agreed to coach them..... at the time of roos appointment, you may recall that NO_ONE wanted to coach them! |
well, Roos went there for around two million bucks reasons, big cash, but the fact is, he still did not get them into the finals, and there last few games under him were shockers, he was embarrassed by them. Hes ;past it now, if Bucks goes, as I say, we need a modern day coach, a forward thinker, not a dour type like Roos, and his dour gameplan, and I'm far from the only one who thinks that, on this thread.
_________________
Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
|
|
|
|
Albert Parker
Joined: 13 Dec 2012
|
| Post subject: | |
|
I think this recently announced review is all part of the playbook to look like there is due process.
_________________
One team, one dream - the Pies and this year's premiership |
|
|
|
|
The Boy Who Cried Wolf
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Location: We prefer free speech - you know it's right
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| Albert Parker wrote: | | I think this recently announced review is all part of the playbook to look like there is due process. |
Give this man a kewpie doll!
_________________
All Aboard!! Choo Choo!!! |
|
|
|
|
daics aka the ruckman
Joined: 30 Aug 2010
Location: Scoreboard Hill @ Vic Park
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| BucksIsFutureCoach wrote: | | daics aka the ruckman wrote: | | 35forever wrote: |
1/It's the best possible move CFC could make. What Roos is good at is lifting sides mentally, he's a highly intelligent guy, and knows what guys need (and that they are individuals!) |
I disagree.
Last season, second last game, Melbourne had to beat Carlton to make finals and lost. Last game against Geelong they lost by the biggest ever margin in Roos Coaching career. I don't think he changed much of the mental culture at all.
He was there for the money "all care and no responsibility" |
I'm no great advocate of Roos coaching Collingwood but to dismiss his record at Melbourne over their last two losses is missing the point that without buy in from Roos (who had effectively resigned), the players had nothing to play for. |
But isn't that the point. The players took the easy cop out and blamed the coach who was leaving. Where was their own ambition to succeed ?
Also the coach in waiting was there. Why didn't he motivate them ?
I still think all Roos did was play boring defensive footy to limit the losses while the multitude of low draft picks matured.
_________________
go pies |
|
|
|
|
RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| daics aka the ruckman wrote: | | BucksIsFutureCoach wrote: | | daics aka the ruckman wrote: | | 35forever wrote: |
1/It's the best possible move CFC could make. What Roos is good at is lifting sides mentally, he's a highly intelligent guy, and knows what guys need (and that they are individuals!) |
I disagree.
Last season, second last game, Melbourne had to beat Carlton to make finals and lost. Last game against Geelong they lost by the biggest ever margin in Roos Coaching career. I don't think he changed much of the mental culture at all.
He was there for the money "all care and no responsibility" |
I'm no great advocate of Roos coaching Collingwood but to dismiss his record at Melbourne over their last two losses is missing the point that without buy in from Roos (who had effectively resigned), the players had nothing to play for. |
But isn't that the point. The players took the easy cop out and blamed the coach who was leaving. Where was their own ambition to succeed ?
Also the coach in waiting was there. Why didn't he motivate them ?
I still think all Roos did was play boring defensive footy to limit the losses while the multitude of low draft picks matured. |
I agree. I've never rated Roos much as a coach. We virtually never lost a game to the Swans when MM was coaching against Roos. He is yesterday's man. He had some impact at the Dees because they were a shit team and an even shittier club, with no culture or sense of purpose. They needed someone with a massive profile to shake the place up. That's not the situation at Collingwood - we just need a little tweaking and improvement from our emerging talent. Despite our current ladder position, I reckon we're in pretty good shape. |
|
|
|
|
35forever
"I feel sick - dada dada dada da"
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Location: Physical=Sunshine Coast -- Mental=Vic Park
|
| Post subject: | |
|
Is there a way to do the 'quote' posts without having to reprint the whole conversation? It leads to 3 posts per page which is a royal pain in the butt on a phone. Another site (Big Footy?) has a thing where it just shows the first few lines of the previous conversation which can be expanded if desired. Can we do that? Or is it a vast job? We are running a pretty old BB program, aren't we? Could it be time to upgrade?
Just a thought...
_________________
"If at first you dont succeed...
... oh who cares, we did it!!!!!"
-me, 2010
"The pies are going to the big dance!"-P.Daicos 2010
Visit My Website! |
|
|
|
|
ronrat
Joined: 22 May 2006
Location: Thailand
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| 35forever wrote: | Is there a way to do the 'quote' posts without having to reprint the whole conversation? It leads to 3 posts per page which is a royal pain in the butt on a phone. Another site (Big Footy?) has a thing where it just shows the first few lines of the previous conversation which can be expanded if desired. Can we do that? Or is it a vast job? We are running a pretty old BB program, aren't we? Could it be time to upgrade?
Just a thought... |
When typing your response you can delete parts of the quoted post you don't want. If you can't be bothered because it is too fiddly to do on a phone then so be it.
_________________
Annoying opposition supporters since 1967. |
|
|
|
|
AN_Inkling
Joined: 06 Oct 2007
|
| Post subject: | |
|
| E wrote: |
roos was the rebuild coach. rebuild coaches dont have the cattle. if they had the cattle, someone other than roos would have agreed to coach them..... at the time of roos appointment, you may recall that NO_ONE wanted to coach them! |
Exactly the reason Roos would be a terrible appointment for 2018. He's not in it for the long term and we are not in a rebuild.
_________________
Well done boys! |
|
|
|
|
35forever
"I feel sick - dada dada dada da"
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Location: Physical=Sunshine Coast -- Mental=Vic Park
|
| Post subject: | |
|
Anyway, back to bizniss... Is there any more info? I need a morsel of hope to hang onto that the McGuire/Buckley junta is not gonna continue after a 6th season is destroyed! If we win all but 1 H&A and win at least 1 final they can stay, otherwise heads OFF! (I think top 4 is out of reach now, but given that were only 2 or 3 games away, maybe this strange year makes it possible. All I know for sure (having watched the Freo game 4 times), is that this side is easily capable of beating all comers. If we'd kicked straight we'd have 2 losses. Also the only sides we find hard to beat are the middle bunch... Carl, Melb, Nth, Port, Stk, Ess. Those 2 factors are the unmistakeable sign of a side lacking confidence. The only person who can fix that is the coach, in fact it's his absolute number one job in the modern game.
Of course the Buckley fans will tell us that our list is rubbish. Of course that begs the question of how we managed to beat Geelong, Freo, Hawthorn, and Sydney, and getting within a few straight kicks of Footscray, GWS, & Richmond. Brilliant coaching? I don't think even his biggest fans would make that claim. We have a side that can play finals and win them. We hope the current form will continue, I couldn't wish a Collingwood loss if Hitler, or worse, Trump was our coach. I don't have a great feeling about Melbourne, but I will be crushed if we lose, my house will be a gloomy place. Especially as the right results would see us at least within striking distance of the 8, while a loss will make the 8 a distant dream.
If Roos is such a dud why have we fallen to the Dees in the last two encounters. They have a few guns, but their list is not a patch on ours. Could they have a better coach? The idea that Roos hasn't done much for them is an appalling lie believed only by those with short memories. Think back just a few years. Remember what a basket case they were? The year before Roos took them they lost their first 3 by 330 points!!! That's right! 330! An average loss of over a hundred!! In the end they beat fellow spoon contenders GWS & Footscray who were last & 3rd last when they met. Only the new GWS franchise saved them from a spoon, they ended with 8 points and 50%! (Web managed 14 wins & 115%, and we thought it was disastrous! How we'd love that result now after 3 more years of Buckley!!! Last year was a tad different. We couldn't manage Melbourne's half time score in round 4, nor could we do it in Rd.12 when they whipped us by nearly 50!
So yeah, not quite a Tom Hafey last to first turnaround, but going from absolute basket case with a crap list for years with 2 wins and 50%, to 10 wind with a slightly better list ain't bad these days. Especially while 'super coach with a list of stars was propelling us in the opposite direction.
What we need is a bloke that can Instill confidence in a group of guys. Buckley simply can't do it. Roos can. I will bet the house he would have us playing deep finals in 2 years, while we hunt for the best long term coach for our guys. After All, our guys don't need half of what Melbourne did. Still, it's highly unlikely, but we can't win the way things are,
_________________
"If at first you dont succeed...
... oh who cares, we did it!!!!!"
-me, 2010
"The pies are going to the big dance!"-P.Daicos 2010
Visit My Website! |
|
|
|
|
swoop42 
Whatcha gonna do when he comes for you?
Joined: 02 Aug 2008
Location: The 18
|
| Post subject: | |
|
If changes does occur then it's Clarkson or Longmire (both no chance I assume) or we go through the proper process and select the best assistant.
I don't want Roos.
Whether I'm drunk on the last 3 victories or I'm softening I feel with the players still on the side of the coach if we can reach 11 or 12 wins and still miss finals he'll be re-signed.
The worst thing we could do would be to have a break even season of 11-11 and replace Buckley with a coach who isn't a proven performer like the above 2.
Replace him with say a Brad Scott (who already seems like a step sideways more than a clear step up) could see the same situation as when Buckley took over from Malthouse and leave many players offside.
That would be a disaster.
If our season falls away from here and we see a result similar to that of last year I still feel he should be replaced.
_________________
He's mad. He's bad. He's MaynHARD! |
|
|
|
|
Presti35
Dick Lee for Legend Status
Joined: 05 Oct 2001
Location: London, England
|
| Post subject: | |
|
Only want Roos if he can bring Petracca and Weideman with him.
Then I'm all for it.
_________________
A Goal Saved Is 2 Goals Earned! |
|
|
|
|
The Boy Who Cried Wolf
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Location: We prefer free speech - you know it's right
|
| Post subject: | |
|
If I was a betting man (which I'm not), I'd put money on Roos being involved in some sort of way in our next coaching regime, be that as a 'hand over' coach, or as a director of coaching.
So stating the obvious here on that presumption. I'm pretty sure that any deal involving Roos, would in the long run be more about rebuilding the clubs culture and our recruitment strategy, with a mind to installing a new long term coach, than specifically installing himself as our long term coach.
I think the real question is 'who will that be'?
_________________
All Aboard!! Choo Choo!!! |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
|
|
The Rules
FAQ
Usergroups
Calendar
Search
Log in
Register
