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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007 Location: Between London and Melbourne
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^ "many people of my generation who went through the modern public education system have turned into perfectly functional, capable, intelligent adults. And on the flipside, kids have always played up in class; "
No doubt many did turn out as you say, but in a good school system, such as we had in the 1960s, virtually all did. So we congratulate ourselves on small successes against low expectations, until we can almost believe we are not failing.
You are right that the issues are manifold, and the root of the problem is our unchallenged libertarian and fragmented culture, with two parents working and children parked in school by parents who are too tired and frazzled to manage them properly.
Those Asian countries which do not have such a culture are mostly thriving educationally. Finland has been high in league tables because its national culture was, until recently, still highly uniform and coherent, and it views teaching as a highly competitive profession, not a trade union activity, or a last resort for those with bad grades in unmarketable subjects.
I doubt that this attainment will last as Finnish society is being transformed by exponentially increasing rates of immigration (see the chart to 2011 in Wikipedia entry, which is stunning) and it has recently plummeted down the PISA rankings, but time will tell.
In any event, our schools can only control what is in their control, which is the classroom. Unfortunately, we have denied them the power and belief to do that. _________________ Two more flags before I die! |
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Dave The Man
Joined: 01 Apr 2005 Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia
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Bring Back the Strap and the Cane could sort some Kids Out _________________ I am Da Man |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005 Location: In flagrante delicto
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Dave The Man wrote: | Bring Back the Strap and the Cane could sort some Kids Out |
I don't think it ever sorted out kids back in the day. fear of getting the cane didn't stop many kids I knew from doing stuff, it was just an accepted consequence. Yeah it stung like hell, particularly on a cold morning, but the pain didn't last long _________________ Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007 Location: Between London and Melbourne
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^ I don't know whether it did or not, but it seems clear to me that the level of general violence in our society has gone up greatly since it ceased. No idea whether there is any causal relationship, but I think the idea that legitimate authority is mushy when prodded has something to do with it.
That said, if it were to remain an option in schools, its use would need to be graduated, monitored and controlled. I certainly saw some bloody awful actions by individual teachers during my schooling in the 1960s and '70s, and I would not want to see us go back to that. _________________ Two more flags before I die! |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007 Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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Mugwump wrote: | ^ I don't know whether it did or not, but it seems clear to me that the level of general violence in our society has gone up greatly since it ceased. No idea whether there is any causal relationship, but I think the idea that legitimate authority is mushy when prodded has something to do with it.
That said, if it were to remain an option in schools, its use would need to be graduated, monitored and controlled. I certainly saw some bloody awful actions by individual teachers during my schooling in the 1960s and '70s, and I would not want to see us go back to that. |
Could you imagine if precious little Xavier, Chaise or Austin got the cane . We'd be the biggest child abusers on the planet. _________________ Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003 Location: Andromeda
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^ Mate, given your post in the other thread about Muslim wives being 'hit' with folded handkerchiefs being a sign of the irredeemable evil of Islam... that's some cognitive dissonance there. _________________ All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007 Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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David wrote: | ^ Mate, given your post in the other thread about Muslim wives being 'hit' with folded handkerchiefs being a sign of the irredeemable evil of Islam... that's some cognitive dissonance there. |
Geez you draw some strange parallels. Comparing brutal domestic violence with the disciplining of naughty, disrespectful kids is a ripper. _________________ Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003 Location: Andromeda
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Language is really something, isn't it. _________________ All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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