The 2017 Nathan Buckley Debate

[Krakouer Magic]

[Lone Ranger]

We should beat Brisbane. Any chance they reappoint Bucks if we win?

[qldmagpie67]

The thing I find most interesting and frustrating is how we seem to start matches or resume from a break and have easy goals kicked against us.
Either the coach hasn't got the players ready to go or the players don't know how to get themselves ready to go.
I'm leaning more towards the players as really in professional sport it shouldn't be the coaches job to make sure your mind is in the correct frame to start a match or resume from a break.
17 quarters this year we have had a goal kicked on us inside the first 2 minutes. Just seems that the players aren't switched on for this to occur so frequently.
The finals or bust comment may be hurting the mental side of the players which is directly the coaches fault making the comment.
We seem so nervous at times and that brings bad school boy level errors even by the most seasoned players.
When we seem to play a more care free style and run carry and take the game on we make far better decisions and actually look like a competitive side.
Then stark contrast is mind blowing really.
Buckley has obviously not lost the group because the efforts they show indicates they play for him.
I would like to see him ream a few more players for some there errors especially the seasoned players. Even go to the selection table and make examples of a couple.
I'm doubting we can make finals really but with the up and down nature of the competition we are very much a chance still by winning 5 of our next 7 games would put us right in the 8 (maybe as high as 6th) and then we would be left with winning 4 of our last 6 to make them.
Highly unlikely until we become a consistent side
If we do get on a bit of a roll which is possible playing our best football then maybe but from what I've seen I wouldn't be putting my hard earned on it

[Piesnchess]

Bucks is safe, for now anyway.

[PyreneesPie]

[Number 35]

" Nathan Buckley is the Chosen One. He has given his life to Football. He has been a Good role model for kids of all ages and backgrounds of the land from Coast to Coast! He was once a Great Warrior for THIS Army and DESERVES the respect of every SINGLE person posting on this site. ( Trolls included! ) He will lead this group toward the Holy Grail, IT is written in the Stars for Nathan. And so Nothing else Matters. "

- TheSandman

[swoop42]

The most important role a coach has is to implement a game style that is robust enough to stand up across a season and against differing opposition structures.

The second most important role is teaching the players to understand it throughout the season and off season so they can execute it properly on game day on a consistent basis.

The third most important aspect is being able to motivate your players, engage with them and have them emotionally invest in your vision for the team.

The fourth most important ability is being able to identify on game day what is not working despite all of the above and be willing to adjust your side accordingly to produce the best chance of winning.

Now despite a coaches best efforts sometimes a side just has an off day emotionally and plays without intensity, sometimes circumstance with injury makes the likelihood of a win less and hell just like players I'm sure a coaching group can lose form also.

The best coaches like Clarkson will still lose games of football and after such sustained success the fall was always coming for his side but as we're presently seeing with Sydney and Fremantle the best coaches who have a proven track record look capable of turning around a sides fortunes in season or after a short period of seasons not finishing in the top 8.

During the first quarter against Hawthorn I thought I was about to witness a side no longer playing for the coach which is something I hadn't doubted all season. Thankfully for the club the fighting victory showed the players are still emotionally invested in the season and the coach and it's ironic that for a man who says his role isn't to motivate the players it's the biggest plus going for him at present. He gets a big tick for point 3.

They say Buckley has a high football IQ, I do believe that and it's why I was so strong in favour of the succession plan.

While I envisaged premiership success because of it the sad reality might be most players don't and the style he wants to play within the structures he sets is overly complicated and leads to confusion, which leads to loss of confidence, which leads to loss.

I have no way of knowing if this is indeed the case but I do know a good coach should be capable of identifying it well before year 6 and be willing and able to implement change that is best suited to the playing group at his disposal. On point 4 I remain neutral.

For mine though the biggest query about Buckley remains points 1 and 2 and has for many seasons now.

We just continually see the same patterns occurring both in terms of season results and how we play within a game and our inability to consistently produce our best football from one week to the next is something most of us find bewildering.

While I'd love to be proven wrong I just feel that despite his best intentions Buckley isn't capable of getting the best out of our list.

[qldmagpie67]

Swoop I basically agree but I think the motivation factor of the players at times seems sadly lacking and can be switched on and off like a light switch.
This I blame on players. They should be ready to play at all times. They are full time professionals with every need and whim catered to.
They have access to the best amenities available.
My issue is we seem to be stuck in a pattern of not being able to adjust our desired style of play to suit the opposition or conditions.
We've tried to play high possession football twice in the wet and came unstuck both times.
Our general over use of the handball is amazing at times.
The last perplexing thing for me is how several players the minute they get the ball look to go sideways or backwards as there first option instead of looking to attack.
Sidey is extremely bad for this. He averages just over 25 touches a game yet his average meters gained per disposals is under 13m this season. That in itself says a load about his mind set. We have only 3 midfielders averaging over 20m+ per disposal this season so basically nobody is going long as there first choice.
Yes I know some of it has to do with our style but more likely proves we over use the handball so much.
I'm with many and hope he can find a way to be the coach we need him to be I just don't see it.

[RudeBoy]

[The Boy Who Cried Wolf]

It is always to do with the coach, sometimes he might not have the cattle but he makes the best of it - we're not showing that, we never have

[Johnno75]

I also believe Bucks does not have the manpower or players with the right skills to implement his game plan. However you would imagine as head coach he would have had a decent say in the players drafted to the club since 2013, so for me it is squarely on his shoulders.

Also I am not so neutral on swoops point 4. Twice in wet conditions we have played high handball transition footy that came unstuck and it was as clear as day by qtr time yet that pattern continued against Essendon and Carlton and they were good enough to meet our challenge throughout the rest of the game. Hawthorn and Brisbane would be the only 2 teams in the comp that we would beat currently after such a 1st quarter as was witnessed on Saturday night.

In the 3rd quarter not only did we play on 49% of the time (ranked no 1 last week) but we used it by foot more, i.e. a couple of handballs to release the player into space then the long kick. So it didn't matter so much that we only had Moore as a key target because our forward line was open so our smalls were able to become targets and lead out the back because of the space.

This is not the first time we have seen this type of football we have seen it occasionally over the last few years where Bucks has failed is to produce this type of football consistently (like he says almost every week post game). Give me the next 3 or 4 games of this type of football.

He have seen that while our list is not perfect and has a few holes that need filling it can play exciting football that can match anyone and this is why as I said on the post game thread on Saturday that it might be better for someone new with fresh ideas to take this list forward.

[MatthewBoydFanClub]

[qldmagpie67]

^^^
All good points raised above by a few posters
In reality the buck stops with Bucks.
I'm sure the players buy in to what he is saying and I'm positive he has a very good footy mind but can he effectively communicate it to the whole squad ?
As for leaders from 1/2 time onwards Pendles and Adams were the absolute catalysts for getting the team going. I actually looked back over the stats and both went at over 85% eff in the 3rd term (along with Wells, Smith, Dunn, Howe, Moore with Treloar Crisp Greenwood all over 75% & Sidey Elliott Blair all over 70% which as a team is a very good stat) (team collectively went at 74.2% for the term and for the game our kick to handballs was 234-193 so we actually kicked more than handballing for a change)
Our ball movement and structures really showed in the second half and maybe the coach tinkered or reinforced it to the group but whatever happened it turned around and we looked way better.
As many have said our inconsistency from term to term or game to game is a huge concern.
When we are on we are good but when we aren't we look shocking. This inconsistency has cost us at least 3 games this season we could and should be 6-3 but alas we aren't and we now have a huge mountain to climb to make finals. One thing in our favour is that the competition is quite even this year and no side has really set the world on fire every week and especially this sides ranked 5-12 so if we can string another 3 wins together and get back to 6-6 we will be right on the cusp of the 8 maybe a game and some % outside but gives us every chance to really push home in the second half of the season

[Mugwump]

None of us really know, but coaches, in general, are overrated as a factor, provided they are basically competent. Clarkson is clearly a wonderful coach, yet he oversaw a 60 point turnaround in about a half of football on Saturday. If Buckley had done that, how many would be screaming for his head right now ?

The magic ingredients in any collective endeavour are talent, experience, confidence and leadership. The top management (i.e. The coach) has a role to play in leadership, but until the players get enough experience together to build their confidence and understanding of each other, it will never work right every time no matter what thecoach does. It is taking more time than I expected, but you can see it getting there soon, I think.

[eddiesmith]

The main excuse seems to be a lack of personnel, time and time again excusing Buckley from anything to do with recruiting. Seems a pretty shit coach if he has no say on who we recruit!

But if the personnel aren't able to execute his game plan then that is clearly the issue. The much hated boundary plan of Micks was created because that was the best plan for the team we had at the time.

Seems to me a good coach develops a game plan to suit his team and if he wants to do something else he recruits players to implement something different. After 6 years, Buckley clearly has NFI what he wants!