Climate change
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Skids 
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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https://earthsky.org/earth/top-10-new-species-2018
We always hear about the doom and gloom...why not the 10's of thousands of new species recently discovered?
Oh that's right, it doesn't fit the agenda.
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Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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So... do we blame climate change... or outdated cannabis laws?
Climate change, of course.
Man charged with lighting an out-of-control NSW fire to protect a cannabis crop
A 51-year-old man has been charged with lighting an out-of-control fire in the NSW Northern Tablelands in order to protect a cannabis crop.
The fast-moving blaze at Guyra Rd in Ebor, northeast of Armidale, was burning across more than 2000ha on Friday afternoon as it spread towards the Ebor township.
https://www.sbs.com.au/news/man-charged-with-lighting-an-out-of-control-nsw-fire-to-protect-a-cannabis-crop
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Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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Lies... The worst drought in Australian history was the 'Federation Drought' 1895-1903.
Historical accounts and scientific analysis indicate that South-Eastern Australia experienced 27 drought years between 1788 and 1860, and at least 10 major droughts between 1860 and 2000.
https://www.nma.gov.au/defining-moments/resources/federation-drought
The worst fire in Australian history was in 1851 when 5 million hectares of bush land burned
The Black Thursday bushfires, were caused in part by an intense drought that occurred throughout 1850 when the continent suffered from extreme heat. On 6 February 1851, a strong furnace-like wind came down from the north and gained power and speed as the hours passed. It is believed that the disaster began in Plenty Ranges when a couple of bullock drivers left logs burning unattended, which set fire to long, dry grass affected by the recent drought. The year preceding the fires was exceptionally hot and dry and this trend continued into 1851.
Intense bushfires are not uncommon in southern Australia. The region is one of the three most fire-prone in the world. Within the last two hundred years, the area has experienced and documented at least twenty-five major fires, beginning with Black Thursday in 1851. The intensity of these fires is due in part to natural fuels, such as sclerophyll forests in the region. While adapting to cope with drought and predators, the trees’ leaves turn into prime fuel for fires. They become tough as protection from dry conditions and to increase the efficiency of nutrient use. They also develop tough spikes and chemicals to protect themselves from small animals. The leaves’ tough surface allows them to last longer and build up on the forest floor and the chemical makes them flammable.. The abundance of flammable fuel can cause an inferno with a single spark
The primary cause of catastrophic bush fires during this period lies in a poor understanding of local fire regimes and in inappropriate landscape management by settlers. Aboriginal people had managed these areas for tens of thousands of years, using fire-stick farming to clear out fuel build up and maintain tracts of walkable land and hunting grounds. Their displacement by Europeans meant a complete regime shift in the ecology of the Australian bush with the result that tremendous fires become possible.
... nah, had to be Climate Change
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Thursday_bushfires
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Don't count the days, make the days count.
Last edited by Skids on Sun Nov 17, 2019 12:39 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| Methinks the lady doth protest too much. |
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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| Quote: | If you cast your mind back to high school science, you might recall something called the ‘fire triangle’. The three sides of the triangle – oxygen, heat and fuel – represent the three essential ingredients for a fire. Take any one of them away, and a fire won’t happen.
Bushfires have a triangle all of their own. The ‘fire behaviour triangle’ – topography, fuel and weather – represents the three key factors that influence how a bushfire behaves. Weaken any one of these and a bushfire becomes more manageable. If all three of these elements favour the bushfire, it’s time to seriously batten down the hatches. Unfortunately, we only have a say in one of those three elements. |
Guess which one of the 3 we can control?
| Quote: | Fuel
Now we come to fuel; the only element of the bushfire triangle that we can influence. Fuel – its availability, arrangement, size, amount and moisture content – decides the speed and intensity of a bushfire. |
| Quote: | Managing the risk
Of all the factors that influence the risk and severity of a bushfire, the only one we have any degree of control over is fuel. We can modify fuel structure and reduce fuel load in our immediate vicinity by clearing around houses and further afield, fuel reduction burns can make a big difference ahead of fire season.
“The key thing that we’ve found is that there is a strong link between initial attack success, so when firefighters first turn out to a fire, and the level of hazard represented by the fuel,” Sullivan says.
If we can reduce the hazard through prescribed burning, then there’s a greater chance that fires can be controlled at an early stage, even under bad fire weather conditions. It’s our only weapon and we better use it. |
https://blog.csiro.au/bushfire-basics/
I'll back the CSIRO over The Guardian any day.
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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You obviously didn't read my post... look, read this bit....
Intense bushfires are not uncommon in southern Australia. The region is one of the three most fire-prone in the world.
Within the last two hundred years, the area has experienced and documented at least twenty-five major fires, beginning with Black Thursday in 1851. The intensity of these fires is due in part to natural fuels, such as sclerophyll forests in the region.
While adapting to cope with drought and predators, the trees’ leaves turn into prime fuel for fires. They become tough as protection from dry conditions and to increase the efficiency of nutrient use. They also develop tough spikes and chemicals to protect themselves from small animals. The leaves’ tough surface allows them to last longer and build up on the forest floor and the chemical makes them flammable.
The abundance of flammable fuel can cause an inferno with a single spark
It's not really difficult.
_________________
Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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Fire facts
https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/topics/parks-reserves-and-protected-areas/fire/fire-facts?fbclid=IwAR0MRG882-lyDELpDRSzJ2mFm5ZpgAzxlwVUw_Mhs-cSy-z0WWk-Xogl1yI
| Quote: | The amount of flammable material in a park is referred to as the fuel load. How much fuel builds up in a given area depends on how much the local vegetation 'sheds' dead fine fuel litter and how quickly it rots.
We measure the amount of fuel available to burn to determine the overall fuel hazard in our parks. The greater the fuel load, the higher risk of bushfire. The overall fuel hazard is rated from low to moderate, high, very high and extreme.
The overall fuel hazard is measured by assessing the hazard posed by:
the type of bark on trees
the amount of ‘elevated’ fuel such as grasses, ferns and shrubs
the amount of fine fuel on the surface of the ground.
Research into fuel accumulation and rotting rates of different plant communities is used to develop fuel accumulation models. Fuel accumulation models are used when planning hazard reduction burns. We invest in research and development to help better manage bushfire risk and conserve biodiversity. |
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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Pies4shaw
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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From a couple of blokes and some sheilas on the ground at the CSIRO:
https://www.csiro.au/en/Research/OandA/Areas/Oceans-and-climate/Climate-change-information
"Changes to the climate system have occurred and are likely to continue
The international scientific community accepts that increases in greenhouse gases due to human activity have been the dominant cause of observed global warming since the mid-20th century. Continued emissions of greenhouse gases will cause further warming and changes in all components of the climate system.
Australia's changing climate represents a significant challenge to individuals, communities, governments, businesses, industry and the environment. Australia has already experienced increases in average temperatures over the past 60 years, with more frequent hot weather, fewer cold days, shifting rainfall patterns and rising sea levels. More of the same is expected in the future."
....
"Research has shown that most of the changes observed over recent decades will continue into the future. Projections suggest that for Australia:
- hot days will become more frequent and hotter (very high confidence)
- sea levels will rise (very high confidence)
- oceans will become more acidic (very high confidence)
- snow depths will decline (very high confidence)
- extreme rainfall events will become more intense (high confidence).
Seasonal-average rainfall changes will vary across Australia.
In southern mainland Australia, winter and spring rainfall is projected to decrease (high confidence), but increases are projected for Tasmania in winter (medium confidence).
In eastern Australia, there is high confidence that in the near future (2030) natural variability will predominate over trends caused by greenhouse gas emissions. This means that while the trend is skewing the natural variability towards winter decreases, it will be relatively minor compared to the natural seasonal and annual changes, so continuing to manage for large natural variability will still be appropriate. For late in the century (2090), there is medium confidence in a winter rainfall decrease.
In northern Australia and northern inland areas, there is high confidence that in the near future (2030), natural variability will predominate over trends due to greenhouse gas emissions. There is low confidence in the direction of future rainfall change by late in the century (2090), but substantial changes to wet-season and annual rainfall cannot be ruled out.
The time in drought is projected to increase over southern Australia (high confidence).
....
Southern and eastern Australia are projected to experience harsher fire weather (high confidence)." |
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watt price tully
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| stui magpie wrote: | | Quote: | If you cast your mind back to high school science, you might recall something called the ‘fire triangle’. The three sides of the triangle – oxygen, heat and fuel – represent the three essential ingredients for a fire. Take any one of them away, and a fire won’t happen.
Bushfires have a triangle all of their own. The ‘fire behaviour triangle’ – topography, fuel and weather – represents the three key factors that influence how a bushfire behaves. Weaken any one of these and a bushfire becomes more manageable. If all three of these elements favour the bushfire, it’s time to seriously batten down the hatches. Unfortunately, we only have a say in one of those three elements. |
Guess which one of the 3 we can control?
| Quote: | Fuel
Now we come to fuel; the only element of the bushfire triangle that we can influence. Fuel – its availability, arrangement, size, amount and moisture content – decides the speed and intensity of a bushfire. |
| Quote: | Managing the risk
Of all the factors that influence the risk and severity of a bushfire, the only one we have any degree of control over is fuel. We can modify fuel structure and reduce fuel load in our immediate vicinity by clearing around houses and further afield, fuel reduction burns can make a big difference ahead of fire season.
“The key thing that we’ve found is that there is a strong link between initial attack success, so when firefighters first turn out to a fire, and the level of hazard represented by the fuel,” Sullivan says.
If we can reduce the hazard through prescribed burning, then there’s a greater chance that fires can be controlled at an early stage, even under bad fire weather conditions. It’s our only weapon and we better use it. |
https://blog.csiro.au/bushfire-basics/
I'll back the CSIRO over The Guardian any day. |
Except the Guardian is quoting CSIRO.
The NSW government has slashed funding to deal with forest management:
Are you accusing ex fire chiefs of being Guardian employees? 🙄
_________________
“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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I'm surprised the climate extremists haven't mentioned the Venice floods.
I mean, rising sea levels should have swallowed the island city up by now shouldn't they? Even though the recent surge was well short of the heights reached in 1966.
Maybe it's because the city is 'sinking' 1-2mm/year that has kept the issue quiet. Which will go first? The Maldives (Which should have disappeared already going by projections from 30 years ago) or Venice?
http://www.softschools.com/facts/rome/venice_italy_facts/2227/
_________________
Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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Look, climate change is a slow process in human terms.
Any changes to our climate in Australia at the moment are infinitesimal, but if China and India keep pumping out CO2 like they do kids, it's going to get hotter and drier.
Therefore rather than just throwing the hands up and saying "climate changed caused the bushfires" (which is like saying summer caused them, and we get summer each year), we need to do something about the vast tracts of land purpose designed to be burnt which more and more people are living near.
Every state government should be putting more resources into forestry management not less but apparently if you say that you're a Murdoch media stooge.
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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It doesn't matter what facts you give to the Climate change extremists, they always come up with the same arguments, and never address the point raised.
Look at some of the issues that lead to catastrophic fires, and it's got nothing to do with the warmest summer in 50 years, or whatever other climate change dribble you want to highlight.
Qld landholder hit with record $1m penalty for making fire breaks too wide
Too Wide!!... that's like giving someone a fine for driving too safe!
Mr Baker was motivated to construct effective fire breaks because his 9242 hectare property Chess Park was almost totally burnt out by bushfire soon after he bought the property in May 2011.
The fires caused $300,000 worth of damage to property infrastructure. After that event, Mr Baker was determined to construct fire breaks to protect his family, property and livestock from future fires.
https://www.beefcentral.com/news/qld-landholder-hit-with-record-1m-penalty-for-making-fire-breaks-too-wide/
Collecting firewood from forest can land you hefty fines
 ..... the first step in hazard prevention is what? ELIMINATION.
But now, you get fined for removing an obvious bushfire hazard?
"Firewood is not always available from all areas due to environmental rules and operational considerations, so if you have collected firewood from a local forest in the past you will not necessarily be able to collect firewood from the same location.
"Our online permit system shows where you can collect firewood this season and when you arrange a permit you'll receive a map indicating the collection area the permit is valid for".
https://www.northernstar.com.au/news/collecting-firewood-from-forest-can-land-you-hefy-/3476826/
Heavy fines for illegal firewood collection in National Parks
“Many ground dwelling animals and threatened species use tree hollows for nesting so when fallen trees and deadwood is taken illegally, it destroys their habitat. This fallen timber is part of these animals’ natural ecosystem,” Ms Buchanan said.
It also makes really good fuel for a fire!
https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/news/heavy-fines-for-illegal-firewood-collection-in-national-parks
Fined for illegal clearing, family now feel vindicated
They were labelled law breakers, fined $50,000 and left emotionally and financially drained.
But seven years after the Sheahans bulldozed trees to make a fire break — an act that got them dragged before a magistrate and penalised — they feel vindicated. Their house is one of the few in Reedy Creek, Victoria, still standing.
https://www.smh.com.au/national/fined-for-illegal-clearing-family-now-feel-vindicated-20090212-85bd.html
In Australia if you try to clear a firebreak on your land you could go to gaol
As Greens blame coal miners and SUV drivers for contributing to firestorms that destroy houses, ponder that one man tried to reduce the risk of fires and cleared firebreaks on his property in WA in 2011 and is currently in jail for it, serving a 15 month sentence. Most of the cleared land had been cleared before in 1970 or 1983. This was mere scrubby regrowth. He was trying to separate his property from DEC (Dept of Environment and Conservation) managed land with a 20m wide fire-break. He is due out of jail sometime around Feb 10th, though his government minders have not even fixed that date (are they having trouble calculating “15 months”?) He had previously been jailed for three months in 2010 for a similar action.
http://joannenova.com.au/2013/01/in-australia-if-you-try-to-clear-a-firebreak-on-your-land-you-could-go-to-gaol/
But, come on, throw me up a graph showing the planet warmed 0.85 degrees in the last century and a 'projection'... not just ANY projection, an "Almost Certain" projection on how bad the upcoming cyclone season will be... or that the Maldives are sinking... oops, no, that projection didn't go to well.... um, all the polar ice will be gone by.... nope wrong one again, shit, you'll find one, I'm sure.
_________________
Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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Pies4shaw
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| What is the point that you think should be addressed and never is, Skids? It's not evident from the irrelevant things you post. |
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