Leading cause of death in Australia

[Pies4shaw]

Make it a capital crime. That'd the obvious answer, David.

[Culprit]

[Mugwump]

^ My use of smoking and drink driving as cases in point has probably caused crossed wires. I don't think a campaign like those is going to help the far more complex issue of suicide. I was just trying to answer your question, David, "how do you change a culture?" conscious that our culture has been changed since the 1960s. My original post and point was that our society itself, and the almost unquestionable assumptions which underlie it, sets the conditions which make suicide more likely for troubled people. Our reflex response is to hire more social workers rather than consider that the suicide rate might be telling us something about our cosy assumptions.

Those assumptions are many and varied and deep and problematically popular, so questioning them tends to get you filed in the nutter file, but they include the idea that institutions - teachers, the law, the churches, marriage and the family and the nation itself are all subordinate to your right to freedom, at least until you act very outrageously. Like many of us I have had some interaction with suicide, and I am confident that a person who feels part of a rooted set of institutions is less likely to commit suicide than someone blown about like a piece of paper in the wind.

I am in China this week, and have been in four cities in four days. I am, as always, struck by the sense of rootedness that have in this country - their pride in the country and its history, sense of collective purpose, respect for authority, age and education, and a certain self-discipline and calm that comes from knowing what big things to believe in. I am not an expert in China and I am sure I have only scratched the surface in the twenty or so visits and the many conversations I have had here. It is a society with many problems - the air in Tianjin a few days ago was literally dangerous, and I am no fan of the political system though it does broadly work for China at this time. However, I suspect that China's per capita suicide rate will be much lower than that in Australia.

Maybe it was not clear but that is the level of cultural change that I was trying to think about. I do not believe that our postmodern neo-liberal society is really making us happier in the long-term, though "do what you wanna do" always makes you feel good in the short term. The assumptions that underpin our libertine culture run so deep that any suggestions they might be reversed is apt to elicit incomprehension and its surly cousin, hostility.

On suicide, it is a long time since Durkheim but I strongly suspect his conclusions remain valid.

[stui magpie]

^

You're potentially targeting 1 cause, social isolation. There's lots.

I currently know someone who is the parent of a 30+ yr old Adult who has made at least 3 serious attempts at their own life in the last 2 years.

The "child" has a history of depression and has now added Ice addiction to the recipe. They are married to a partner that loves them, are well off financially and have very supportive family. (perhaps too supportive).

They seem to understand that the Ice is a trigger at the moment but "don't have the strength" to stop.

Basically they're a ticking time bomb and their parent is going through all sorts of hell because they are totally powerless to do anything except be supportive and try to mentally prepare for what seems to be inevitable..

They've done the time in mental health institutions, but how do you help someone who doesn't seem to want to be helped?

[Mugwump]

^ Stui I think the ice addiction is another example of what happens when those in power lose their nerve. There is less ice addiction in Asia. That might be because they have a rather uncompromising way of dealing with drug traffickers. Nice liberals do not feel responsible for the miserable deaths of the desperate and addicted as long as we are not too nasty to the suppliers.

[think positive]

The drug thing, it's always bothered me the way this country seems to hand out ADHD drugs like candy. So easy to swap one attitude changing drug for another as they get older. Imall for legalising medical pot, but then what next?
Somewhere between our leniency and China's communism might be a place to start.

[Gone Critical]

Suicide is really hard to prevent is the base message I see. Mental health, particularly the long term thought disorder types, is still treated by just scratching the surface.

I do think we have created a society where the pendulum has swung too far on the personal freedom scale and not enough on social responsibility and do despair with how younger people get to navigate their world with so few borders or guides or social constraints. The search for something meaningful means so many lose track of taking responsibility for their own situation.

This may have some contribution to the suicide rates. Likewise our goal of reducing institutions housing the long term mentally was never backed up by providing them good housing and programs in the community.

Still its still true we know little about suicide prevention. We really scratch the surface when it comes to mental health. These factors are going to make tackling suicide prevention very difficult even with more money and programs created in the hope of achieving that.

[Pies4shaw]

^^^^ I think heightened expectations and demands, coupled with loss of opportunities, are more problematic than social freedom. Social conformism comes with its mental health costs, too - see Japan.

But, whatever the many and varied causes, we obviously do too little as a society to support and encourage young people. We have also, since the 1980s allowed our values to change so that, on the whole, we seem to value people more for what they have than for who they are. That must lead to dreadful emotional and mental health consequences for decent (and not so decent) people who don't have much or don't "fit in".