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mooretreloar
Joined: 21 Sep 2016
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| Cam wrote: | Bucks moved from school to school as a kid, 12 or 13 different ones IIRC from his book. He didn't have close friends, his relationship with his dad wasn't great until he was much older. He is tough, and didn't rely on close relationships or bonds to survive. He became one of the hardest men, mentally in the game. He didn't really need people much.
However he is married, and a father, and both those facts will have changed him. There is hope, but I fear his metamorphosis will come too late for us. Having taught 20-75 year olds at TAFE in IT, high school kids, and down to babies that have grown up in my house, I can safely say that in every class you have a clown, its their thing. There are the shy kids that work hard no matter what, ones that are shy and only thrive with constant praise, showoffs with high skills that have superiority complexes [possibly rightly so], showoffs with low skills that compensate via their vaudeville, high maintenance ones with low skills, need praise and disrupt others. Every class has these, no matter what the age, although you do get less disruptive ones after 30 as they tend to be there with a focus.
Point is, I really hope that we are not trying to have one type of player at Collingwood. Because no matter how hard we try, people shift roles to fill them. Take out the class clown and another will spring up in its place, it's social nature. Respect the diversity, embrace the diversity, individualise and maximise improvement. And don't tell the players to not listen to music before a game [as happened this year] - because everyone prepares differently.
I, too see the affable man on the TV and in the post game interviews and think "How can this possibly not be working?". Maybe it doesn't translate? Maybe MM poisoned everyone at the time and Bucks never had a chance. Not all movies have happy endings, particularly at Collingwood. |
Cam, I enjoy reading your posts, you write very well and provide support for your arguments.
However, I don't believe that it is not working. We were 4-8 at the bye and if the majority of the playing group had a problem with Buckley's methods they would have laid down their tools after the bye and we would have ended up 4-18. This would have guaranteed that Bucks would have been sacked.
The opposite actually occurred, they worked their backsides off and bar for 3 quarters out of 40, we were extremely competitive. Thus, there is no evidence that the playing group are not playing for him.
I also believe that too much emphasis is placed on what Buckley was like as a player and the assumption that he is the same as a coach. There are many examples of people that are complete opposites in the heat of battle to what they are actually are in everyday life. I know this from personal experience, the difference between what I am like "on field" v "off field" is like comparing chalk and cheese. |
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Millane42
Joined: 18 Aug 2000
Location: Sydney
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I had a vivid dream last night I was deep in conversation with Sheedy and I asked him directly do you think Buckley can coach? His response was a definitive No.
I have had faith but if this dream is a sign then surely a 9th place or lower will see the end of Figgie
_________________
Most of my favourite bands start with "M" - Mars Volta, Mastodon, Megadeth, Metallica, Midnight Oil, Misfits...except King Gizzard and the Lizard Wizard ~ |
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CarringbushCigar 
Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Location: wherever I lay my beanie
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| Millane42 wrote: | I had a vivid dream last night I was deep in conversation with Sheedy and I asked him directly do you think Buckley can coach? His response was a definitive No.
I have had faith but if this dream is a sign then surely a 9th place or lower will see the end of Figgie |
Its no dream mate - ask anyone who has coached if Bucks can coach - you won't get a Yes.
They are just waiting until Bucks is sacked before they change the rules.
The AFL will not allow someone as inexperienced as Bucks was to ever get the job.
Finals or Pack ya Bags. |
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Joel 
Joined: 23 Mar 1999
Location: Mornington Peninsula
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| thompsoc wrote: | Bux is a dud.
And when he and Ed steps down that is when things will start to improve. |
Yeah, just like magic. |
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RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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| It was not my intention to turn this thread into another one about Buckley's coaching prowess. That debate has become rather boring and everyone already has their own fixed position anyway. Rather, the OP was an attempt to identify one important area where we need to change and improve considerably to assist us rise up the ladder. Our club has a comparative advantage over other clubs, which is the size and passion of our support base. The point I was trying to make in the OP was that, even if it only has a miniscule effect on our team's performance, Bucks should be doing what he can to energise the club's fan base, so as to lift our team's performance, as well as scaring the living daylight out of our opponents. I'm not suggesting any of this has much of an impact, but in a game where inches matter, this is a weapon we have at our disposal and I would like to see Bucks using it to our advantage. As Cam has suggested, if we simply roll in to next season, doing things the same, then we are delusional if we expect a different result. Even before the first bounce on the 2017 season, I want Bucks, as our leader, to generate excitement, enthusiasm and passion and to encourage us all to believe once again. |
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CarringbushCigar
Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Location: wherever I lay my beanie
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| RudeBoy wrote: | | It was not my intention to turn this thread into another one about Buckley's coaching prowess. That debate has become rather boring and everyone already has their own fixed position anyway. Rather, the OP was an attempt to identify one important area where we need to change and improve considerably to assist us rise up the ladder. Our club has a comparative advantage over other clubs, which is the size and passion of our support base. The point I was trying to make in the OP was that, even if it only has a miniscule effect on our team's performance, Bucks should be doing what he can to energise the club's fan base, so as to lift our team's performance, as well as scaring the living daylight out of our opponents. I'm not suggesting any of this has much of an impact, but in a game where inches matter, this is a weapon we have at our disposal and I would like to see Bucks using it to our advantage. As Cam has suggested, if we simply roll in to next season, doing things the same, then we are delusional if we expect a different result. Even before the first bounce on the 2017 season, I want Bucks, as our leader, to generate excitement, enthusiasm and passion and to encourage us all to believe once again. |
Completely agree he should and he may.
Problem is after back to back wins he begins taking all the credit.
Back to back losses he will start to use the crowd excuse.
'The crowd got nutted in the stands'
He can't help himself - "he is what he is" - CarringbushCigar 2016. |
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think positive 
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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May the Faz be with you
Gimme Moore, Gimme Moore, Gimme Moore, please Mr Treloar.
Aish gunna dance like Billy Elliot, don't you get sidebottomed now,
Reid it here, we are on the white track.
Feeling kind of Blairish today!
We need to get some sparkle back to get the Army revved. Just like every club except Richmond, the prickle arsed band wagoners go into hiding at the first sign of trouble. We need a rip roaring win,a good preseason and some hope will get arses on seats round one, and a little luck will see us put those $£$%^%%$ puppies back in the kennel, injuries and maggots crueled us against them last season. You want belief? You want to hear the roar? Then first up Adams runs through Cloke, smash that little dirty prick libba, and then run them off their feet. All the way home. No junk time cheapies. Kill them dead. Last quarter I don't want to just hear it, I want to feel it roaring through the stands to my bones: Cooooooooollllllllliiiiiiinnnnnnggggggwwwoooooooooooood!
Watch the army rock up the next week. It's time. Bring it Bucks. Show us what your made of.
And I will then proceed to pay my husband back in spades, I'll make a nightmare on elm street look like Walt Disney. I will haunt his dreams, his nightmares, and every waking moment. Coooooooollllllliiiinnnnggggwwwwooooooddddd!
That's all I want for Christmas!
Side by Side we will get back to where we belong.
Hated. The most hated.
Go Pies!
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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thompsoc
Joined: 21 Sep 2009
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| Joel wrote: | | thompsoc wrote: | Bux is a dud.
And when he and Ed steps down that is when things will start to improve. |
Yeah, just like magic. |
yep.
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we don't eat our own at collingwood we just allow them to foul our nest. |
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Member 7167 
"What Good Fortune For Governments That The People Do Not Think" - Adolf Hitler.
Joined: 18 Dec 2008
Location: The Collibran Hideout
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| think positive wrote: | May the Faz be with you
Gimme Moore, Gimme Moore, Gimme Moore, please Mr Treloar.
Aish gunna dance like Billy Elliot, don't you get sidebottomed now,
Reid it here, we are on the white track.
Feeling kind of Blairish today!
We need to get some sparkle back to get the Army revved. Just like every club except Richmond, the prickle arsed band wagoners go into hiding at the first sign of trouble. We need a rip roaring win,a good preseason and some hope will get arses on seats round one, and a little luck will see us put those $£$%^%%$ puppies back in the kennel, injuries and maggots crueled us against them last season. You want belief? You want to hear the roar? Then first up Adams runs through Cloke, smash that little dirty prick libba, and then run them off their feet. All the way home. No junk time cheapies. Kill them dead. Last quarter I don't want to just hear it, I want to feel it roaring through the stands to my bones: Cooooooooollllllllliiiiiiinnnnnnggggggwwwoooooooooooood!
Watch the army rock up the next week. It's time. Bring it Bucks. Show us what your made of.
And I will then proceed to pay my husband back in spades, I'll make a nightmare on elm street look like Walt Disney. I will haunt his dreams, his nightmares, and every waking moment. Coooooooollllllliiiinnnnggggwwwwooooooddddd!
That's all I want for Christmas!
Side by Side we will get back to where we belong.
Hated. The most hated.
Go Pies! |
Good one TP. This is the type of contribution from you that I enjoy reading. We should catch up again at the beginning of next season. It has been a while since a few of us joined up at the Ponny for a beer.
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Now Retired - Every Day Is A Saturday |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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cheers, ill drink to that mate!!
_________________
You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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Member 7167
"What Good Fortune For Governments That The People Do Not Think" - Adolf Hitler.
Joined: 18 Dec 2008
Location: The Collibran Hideout
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TO. lets just hope we have something to celebrate every time we go the the MCG
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Now Retired - Every Day Is A Saturday |
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CarringbushCigar
Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Location: wherever I lay my beanie
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| Member 7167 wrote: | | TO. lets just hope we have something to celebrate every time we go the the MCG |
no doubt about that - we will be 1 week closer to the finals no matter what happens
Say goodbye to Lulie Street Limbo Land |
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qldmagpie67
Joined: 18 Dec 2008
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Rude in regards to the original post disconnect can occur for many reasons.
The move from our spiritual home would have no doubt caused angst among some that's just human nature. Some people dislike change for whatever reason some people embrace change.
Doesn't make either group more right or wrong than the other.
Supporting a club in any code is equal amounts of pride frustration fury joy and all emotions mixed together depending on current performances.
I don't think the Liverpool link is a fair comparison to us really other than the fact Klopp is smart enough to know embracing the clubs fans and history is only going to reap rewards long term. I think Liverpool lost its way when they become a private company owned by Americans who didn't or wouldn't understand that the club was more than a profit or loss centre it was people's lives and history. They never truly gave Dalgliesh the resources to be a true title challenger but just enough to keep him merely competitive. Every time we had good players we seemed to lost them to Europe or another club who would pay more and we could bank extra money. Now they see that there's money to be made being successful and they have opened the cheque book accordingly.
Buckley isn't responsible for members satisfaction other than having a team perform well. Yes it would be nice if he made a bigger effort to acknowledge fans more after games and in press conferences but he is all about business really. Eddie on the other hand should be doing more to create that link to th fans from th Pe club. He is after all our figure head and leader.
Im with the majority of posters when I say I support the club no matter who is coach. 2017 is like very year for me I want us to win games and make finals and if things fall our way win premierships. The club has appointed bucks our head coach for 2017 and I support him along with the club and players.
I'll cheer hard at all times hoping we win and getting shitty and moody and angry when we don't but I will do it all again next week
The emotional part of being a Collingwood supporter really means you are never alone no matter where you are in Australia or the world you can be sure to find some like minded supporter. I know I've met pies supporters in England Europe USA Canada South Africa and every corner of Australia
An old league coach I had back in the day had a saying "one in all in" that's what pies supporters are to me. They are like a brotherhood of like minded people emotional about our team and always looking for the next game
Rude on a side note I've travelled the world over and seen sporting events at many of the great stadium around. The welsh singing at Cardiff arms park, bears supporters at soldier field, 49ers at candle stick park, Yankees at the old house that Ruth built, first morning of the Boxing Day ashes test, Mumbai with Tendulkar batting etc. Being at Anfield hearing the Kopp sing you'll never walk along had me in tears mate. One of the most emotional days I've ever had (to boot we beat Arsenal 2-1). |
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5 from the wing on debut
Joined: 27 May 2016
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| Post subject: Re: A message to Bucks: use the force | |
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| thompsoc wrote: | | RudeBoy wrote: | | magpieazza wrote: | | RudeBoy wrote: | With the new season still several months away, I can't help but feel that our club is currently facing numerous problems, on and off the field, and there is a growing air of despondency. Apart from the latest Gubby Allan fiasco and murmerings of discontent amongst our football department over the treatment of some staff, our supporters seem to be divided into two camps, the "perceptive fellow" who want Buckley out and the lollipop brigade who think he deserves one more year to turn things around.
What is missing is a sense of genuine excitement and optimism for our short to medium term future. Part of this imo, is the way we have allowed our club to become not much more than a franchise of the AFL. In abandoning our spiritual home all those years ago, we set up shop in South Yarra, but despite the quality of the facilities there, it has never felt like a home. Collingwood members and supporters are simply customers. This is not a unique problem of ours, but rather the result of the corporatisation of sport.
The problem is made worse by the fact that our coach, whom I am a strong supporter of, seems oblivious to the need to engage and connect with fans. As good a communicator as Bucks is, and imo he's the best public communicator of all AFL coaches, one gets the feeling that he sees his job purely in terms of preparing the players and making positional moves on match day.
However, not all is lost. As a Buckley fan, I'm hoping he can do more than this. For those who follow the round ball game and especially the English Premier League, you should know about my 'other' club, Liverpool, and its amazing coach/manager, Jurgen Klopp. From the moment he arrived at Liverpool midway through last season, a team which were in the doldrums (but are now sitting equal first on the Premier League table), he made it clear that the players, coaches and the fans all had a role to play in making Liverpool great again. He regularly implores the fans to create a ferocious atmosphere for visiting teams, and speaks glowingly of them, as being part of the club, and the reason the club is great. He often says things like "to win this game we need the fans to help us and inspire us". He has created an incredible bond between players and fans, something which had been in decline for many years. Liverpool is now on the march, in part, because Klopp has smashed down the dividing line between team and fans.
So Bucks, I have been concerned at your apparent belief that it's not your role to motivate the players. Luke Beveridge has demonstrated how a coach can help generate team spirit and enthusiasm, beyond that of players being professional. However, as well as recognising that as coach you have a key role in motivating the team, as head of the CFC, you have a powerful weapon, a force, the Magpie Army, which you have not properly mobilised. Let's not simply limp into and through another season. Bucks, I'm asking you to make it your job to encourage, activate and mobilise the Magpie Army to support, encourage and inspire our team in 2017. We have a power and force like no other club, but it's been in 'sleep mode' for several years now. Make us believe again and together lets go into battle and demonstrate and celebrate the meaning of COLLINGWOOD. Side by Side. |
Mate, this is exactly what we need!!
I wrote about Klopp and his influence to the whole club just a few weeks ago when it looked apparent this was missing with us. I likened the influence of Beveridge similar to Klopps.
I too am a Buckley supporter but this slight disconnect between fans and the club is a piece missing from the puzzle.
Great to see another Liverpool fan, its going to be a great year and the belief he has spread around the club is very real.
The belief bounces from person to person within the club and media circles, and is a genuine force you can breath in and smell.
I loved it when Nick Maxwell came out at the start of 2010 and said Collingwood would win the premiership that year. |
"Side by Side" is the same as "You'll never walk alone".
Collingwood and Liverpool were both formed in 1892.  |
I love You will never walk alone...that is fantastic.
But side by side
Is often used on this forum to shut people up.
There is a huge difference in the meaning between the two. |
Yes, they are different. I see your point.
"Side by Side" means you are there with someone. Together. A common goal. United.
"You will never walk alone" may mean that someone is sneaking behind you. And is about to stick a knife in your back. |
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5 from the wing on debut
Joined: 27 May 2016
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| RudeBoy wrote: | | It was not my intention to turn this thread into another one about Buckley's coaching prowess. That debate has become rather boring and everyone already has their own fixed position anyway. Rather, the OP was an attempt to identify one important area where we need to change and improve considerably to assist us rise up the ladder. Our club has a comparative advantage over other clubs, which is the size and passion of our support base. The point I was trying to make in the OP was that, even if it only has a miniscule effect on our team's performance, Bucks should be doing what he can to energise the club's fan base, so as to lift our team's performance, as well as scaring the living daylight out of our opponents. I'm not suggesting any of this has much of an impact, but in a game where inches matter, this is a weapon we have at our disposal and I would like to see Bucks using it to our advantage. As Cam has suggested, if we simply roll in to next season, doing things the same, then we are delusional if we expect a different result. Even before the first bounce on the 2017 season, I want Bucks, as our leader, to generate excitement, enthusiasm and passion and to encourage us all to believe once again. |
Does size and passion of the supporter base really matter any more?
Once, it did. The atmosphere was electric at Vic Park in a big game. It was our home.We don't have a home any more. We have a place the players train at and places they play home games at. The last time that I can say that I experienced a Vic Park type atmosphere was at the Australia/NZ Olympic basketball qualifier when Patty Mills ran amok in the last few crucial minutes.
Football crowds are dead and lifeless now. Old style barracking has gone. It is many years since the enormous "Collingwood domination envy of the nation" banner was affixed to the top deck of the old Southern Stand. I miss those days and am quite sad that my children did not experience what I did when growing up. |
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