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A message to Bucks: use the force

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RudeBoy 



Joined: 28 Nov 2005


PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 3:56 pm
Post subject: A message to Bucks: use the forceReply with quote

With the new season still several months away, I can't help but feel that our club is currently facing numerous problems, on and off the field, and there is a growing air of despondency. Apart from the latest Gubby Allan fiasco and murmerings of discontent amongst our football department over the treatment of some staff, our supporters seem to be divided into two camps, the "perceptive fellow" who want Buckley out and the lollipop brigade who think he deserves one more year to turn things around.

What is missing is a sense of genuine excitement and optimism for our short to medium term future. Part of this imo, is the way we have allowed our club to become not much more than a franchise of the AFL. In abandoning our spiritual home all those years ago, we set up shop in South Yarra, but despite the quality of the facilities there, it has never felt like a home. Collingwood members and supporters are simply customers. This is not a unique problem of ours, but rather the result of the corporatisation of sport.

The problem is made worse by the fact that our coach, whom I am a strong supporter of, seems oblivious to the need to engage and connect with fans. As good a communicator as Bucks is, and imo he's the best public communicator of all AFL coaches, one gets the feeling that he sees his job purely in terms of preparing the players and making positional moves on match day.

However, not all is lost. As a Buckley fan, I'm hoping he can do more than this. For those who follow the round ball game and especially the English Premier League, you should know about my 'other' club, Liverpool, and its amazing coach/manager, Jurgen Klopp. From the moment he arrived at Liverpool midway through last season, a team which were in the doldrums (but are now sitting equal first on the Premier League table), he made it clear that the players, coaches and the fans all had a role to play in making Liverpool great again. He regularly implores the fans to create a ferocious atmosphere for visiting teams, and speaks glowingly of them, as being part of the club, and the reason the club is great. He often says things like "to win this game we need the fans to help us and inspire us". He has created an incredible bond between players and fans, something which had been in decline for many years. Liverpool is now on the march, in part, because Klopp has smashed down the dividing line between team and fans.

So Bucks, I have been concerned at your apparent belief that it's not your role to motivate the players. Luke Beveridge has demonstrated how a coach can help generate team spirit and enthusiasm, beyond that of players being professional. However, as well as recognising that as coach you have a key role in motivating the team, as head of the CFC, you have a powerful weapon, a force, the Magpie Army, which you have not properly mobilised. Let's not simply limp into and through another season. Bucks, I'm asking you to make it your job to encourage, activate and mobilise the Magpie Army to support, encourage and inspire our team in 2017. We have a power and force like no other club, but it's been in 'sleep mode' for several years now. Make us believe again and together lets go into battle and demonstrate and celebrate the meaning of COLLINGWOOD. Side by Side.
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Cam Capricorn

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Joined: 10 May 2002
Location: Springvale

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 4:59 pm
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Hear, hear.

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."


- Albert Einstein

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Rush Stand Wing 



Joined: 13 Sep 2016


PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 5:31 pm
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Well said.

...And the vessel to achieve this bond is NOT via 360. Use the Brief and get angry !
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Jezza Taurus

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Joined: 06 Sep 2010
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 5:47 pm
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It's difficult to get a handle on exactly what is happening behind the scenes without being actively involved in what goes on internally, but I'm always sceptical of the way the media has been reporting the issues regarding our off-field matters.

There's no disputing that we have issues and it would be better if they're resolved rather than becoming an unnecessary distraction, but at the same time I think it's been blown out of proportion somewhat without knowing the full facts which are yet to be determined. It's also important to note that what happens off-field doesn't always translate to what happens on the field.

The issue of moving away from our spiritual home seems to only have caused some angst amongst a few recently because we've struggled in the last few years. I didn't hear people whinging about it when we were regularly playing finals and when we won a flag in 2010. Also, our current headquarters are not located in South Yarra, rather we are located in the suburb of Melbourne near the major sporting precinct areas technically speaking.

I'd like to see Victoria Park still remain a key fabric of our club in some shape or form and if the club can try and push for more games at Victoria Park for the VFL side then I will be happy with that. However, it seems as though we've had ongoing issues with Yarra Council in the last few years and the club has grown tired of appeasing them hence we're seeing the VFL side play more matches at Olympic Park rather than at Victoria Park.

I still have concerns about Bucks as coach in various ways, but the club is emotionally and financially invested in him coaching in 2017 so I'm willing to get behind him and hopefully see him steer us up the ladder. He's entering his sixth season now so our patience and faith in him has to be rewarded and reciprocated sooner rather than later. I hope he's successful, but doubts still linger.

The list is in decent shape with still some holes, but if we're able to maintain a minimal injury list and play more consistent football week-to-week, I can't see why we cannot play finals with a bit of luck along the way. Our best football in 2016 was excellent as the performances against Geelong and GWS demonstrated, but our worst football was notably poor so we need to bridge that gap if we're going to be a finals team next year.

As it stands, I still remain cautiously optimistic rather than excited about our short-term prospects, but our performances in the latter stages of 2016 were very encouraging and a great platform and stepping stone to build from in 2017.

We need to start strongly and assert ourselves in the competition, otherwise we could see a repeat of 2016 where it almost felt like our season was over in round 1 symbolically speaking as we were left deflated and lost massive confidence in ourselves due to various issues, and significantly we lost key component of our team in Dane Swan.

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magpieazza 

magpieazza


Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Location: Griffith N.S.W

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 6:09 pm
Post subject: Re: A message to Bucks: use the forceReply with quote

RudeBoy wrote:
With the new season still several months away, I can't help but feel that our club is currently facing numerous problems, on and off the field, and there is a growing air of despondency. Apart from the latest Gubby Allan fiasco and murmerings of discontent amongst our football department over the treatment of some staff, our supporters seem to be divided into two camps, the "perceptive fellow" who want Buckley out and the lollipop brigade who think he deserves one more year to turn things around.

What is missing is a sense of genuine excitement and optimism for our short to medium term future. Part of this imo, is the way we have allowed our club to become not much more than a franchise of the AFL. In abandoning our spiritual home all those years ago, we set up shop in South Yarra, but despite the quality of the facilities there, it has never felt like a home. Collingwood members and supporters are simply customers. This is not a unique problem of ours, but rather the result of the corporatisation of sport.

The problem is made worse by the fact that our coach, whom I am a strong supporter of, seems oblivious to the need to engage and connect with fans. As good a communicator as Bucks is, and imo he's the best public communicator of all AFL coaches, one gets the feeling that he sees his job purely in terms of preparing the players and making positional moves on match day.

However, not all is lost. As a Buckley fan, I'm hoping he can do more than this. For those who follow the round ball game and especially the English Premier League, you should know about my 'other' club, Liverpool, and its amazing coach/manager, Jurgen Klopp. From the moment he arrived at Liverpool midway through last season, a team which were in the doldrums (but are now sitting equal first on the Premier League table), he made it clear that the players, coaches and the fans all had a role to play in making Liverpool great again. He regularly implores the fans to create a ferocious atmosphere for visiting teams, and speaks glowingly of them, as being part of the club, and the reason the club is great. He often says things like "to win this game we need the fans to help us and inspire us". He has created an incredible bond between players and fans, something which had been in decline for many years. Liverpool is now on the march, in part, because Klopp has smashed down the dividing line between team and fans.

So Bucks, I have been concerned at your apparent belief that it's not your role to motivate the players. Luke Beveridge has demonstrated how a coach can help generate team spirit and enthusiasm, beyond that of players being professional. However, as well as recognising that as coach you have a key role in motivating the team, as head of the CFC, you have a powerful weapon, a force, the Magpie Army, which you have not properly mobilised. Let's not simply limp into and through another season. Bucks, I'm asking you to make it your job to encourage, activate and mobilise the Magpie Army to support, encourage and inspire our team in 2017. We have a power and force like no other club, but it's been in 'sleep mode' for several years now. Make us believe again and together lets go into battle and demonstrate and celebrate the meaning of COLLINGWOOD. Side by Side.


Mate, this is exactly what we need!!

I wrote about Klopp and his influence to the whole club just a few weeks ago when it looked apparent this was missing with us. I likened the influence of Beveridge similar to Klopps.

I too am a Buckley supporter but this slight disconnect between fans and the club is a piece missing from the puzzle.

Great to see another Liverpool fan, its going to be a great year and the belief he has spread around the club is very real.
The belief bounces from person to person within the club and media circles, and is a genuine force you can breath in and smell.

I loved it when Nick Maxwell came out at the start of 2010 and said Collingwood would win the premiership that year.

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stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 6:24 pm
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^

IIRC Maxwell said publicly what Josh Fraser said at a team meeting. Josh was the one who said they shouldn't put limits on what they could achieve, they should aim for a flag.

I'm paid up for next year, even though now it seems I'll go to less than half the games. I'll get excited in February when the season is looming regardless of what Bucks does.

BTW, I really like how Bucks goes on AFL 360 and speaks well even though you can see he'd love to just punch Robbo right between the eyes.

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RudeBoy 



Joined: 28 Nov 2005


PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 6:36 pm
Post subject: Re: A message to Bucks: use the forceReply with quote

magpieazza wrote:
RudeBoy wrote:
With the new season still several months away, I can't help but feel that our club is currently facing numerous problems, on and off the field, and there is a growing air of despondency. Apart from the latest Gubby Allan fiasco and murmerings of discontent amongst our football department over the treatment of some staff, our supporters seem to be divided into two camps, the "perceptive fellow" who want Buckley out and the lollipop brigade who think he deserves one more year to turn things around.

What is missing is a sense of genuine excitement and optimism for our short to medium term future. Part of this imo, is the way we have allowed our club to become not much more than a franchise of the AFL. In abandoning our spiritual home all those years ago, we set up shop in South Yarra, but despite the quality of the facilities there, it has never felt like a home. Collingwood members and supporters are simply customers. This is not a unique problem of ours, but rather the result of the corporatisation of sport.

The problem is made worse by the fact that our coach, whom I am a strong supporter of, seems oblivious to the need to engage and connect with fans. As good a communicator as Bucks is, and imo he's the best public communicator of all AFL coaches, one gets the feeling that he sees his job purely in terms of preparing the players and making positional moves on match day.

However, not all is lost. As a Buckley fan, I'm hoping he can do more than this. For those who follow the round ball game and especially the English Premier League, you should know about my 'other' club, Liverpool, and its amazing coach/manager, Jurgen Klopp. From the moment he arrived at Liverpool midway through last season, a team which were in the doldrums (but are now sitting equal first on the Premier League table), he made it clear that the players, coaches and the fans all had a role to play in making Liverpool great again. He regularly implores the fans to create a ferocious atmosphere for visiting teams, and speaks glowingly of them, as being part of the club, and the reason the club is great. He often says things like "to win this game we need the fans to help us and inspire us". He has created an incredible bond between players and fans, something which had been in decline for many years. Liverpool is now on the march, in part, because Klopp has smashed down the dividing line between team and fans.

So Bucks, I have been concerned at your apparent belief that it's not your role to motivate the players. Luke Beveridge has demonstrated how a coach can help generate team spirit and enthusiasm, beyond that of players being professional. However, as well as recognising that as coach you have a key role in motivating the team, as head of the CFC, you have a powerful weapon, a force, the Magpie Army, which you have not properly mobilised. Let's not simply limp into and through another season. Bucks, I'm asking you to make it your job to encourage, activate and mobilise the Magpie Army to support, encourage and inspire our team in 2017. We have a power and force like no other club, but it's been in 'sleep mode' for several years now. Make us believe again and together lets go into battle and demonstrate and celebrate the meaning of COLLINGWOOD. Side by Side.


Mate, this is exactly what we need!!

I wrote about Klopp and his influence to the whole club just a few weeks ago when it looked apparent this was missing with us. I likened the influence of Beveridge similar to Klopps.

I too am a Buckley supporter but this slight disconnect between fans and the club is a piece missing from the puzzle.

Great to see another Liverpool fan, its going to be a great year and the belief he has spread around the club is very real.
The belief bounces from person to person within the club and media circles, and is a genuine force you can breath in and smell.

I loved it when Nick Maxwell came out at the start of 2010 and said Collingwood would win the premiership that year.


"Side by Side" is the same as "You'll never walk alone".

Collingwood and Liverpool were both formed in 1892. Cool
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Rush Stand Wing 



Joined: 13 Sep 2016


PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 8:41 pm
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stui magpie wrote:
BTW, I really like how Bucks goes on AFL 360 and speaks well even though you can see he'd love to just punch Robbo right between the eyes.


I enjoy watching it too, as he speaks brilliantly and gives the viewers great insights, possibly too much ! I just reckon his time could be spent doing more productive things for himself and group.

No doubt the players watch and assess it from a different perspective to his internal messages, which I think risks his viewpoint being misconstrued or at the very least, counter productive.

Even if its just to give him a break from the footy world and ensure a better work/life balance because he will need it this year more than ever. Its not running scared, its more a 'farQ' for trying to headline grab everything he says.

FFS if the club I contractually obliged then just get Sando to do it.
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thompsoc 



Joined: 21 Sep 2009


PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 8:50 pm
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Bux is a dud.
And when he and Ed steps down that is when things will start to improve.

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thompsoc 



Joined: 21 Sep 2009


PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 8:52 pm
Post subject: Re: A message to Bucks: use the forceReply with quote

RudeBoy wrote:
magpieazza wrote:
RudeBoy wrote:
With the new season still several months away, I can't help but feel that our club is currently facing numerous problems, on and off the field, and there is a growing air of despondency. Apart from the latest Gubby Allan fiasco and murmerings of discontent amongst our football department over the treatment of some staff, our supporters seem to be divided into two camps, the "perceptive fellow" who want Buckley out and the lollipop brigade who think he deserves one more year to turn things around.

What is missing is a sense of genuine excitement and optimism for our short to medium term future. Part of this imo, is the way we have allowed our club to become not much more than a franchise of the AFL. In abandoning our spiritual home all those years ago, we set up shop in South Yarra, but despite the quality of the facilities there, it has never felt like a home. Collingwood members and supporters are simply customers. This is not a unique problem of ours, but rather the result of the corporatisation of sport.

The problem is made worse by the fact that our coach, whom I am a strong supporter of, seems oblivious to the need to engage and connect with fans. As good a communicator as Bucks is, and imo he's the best public communicator of all AFL coaches, one gets the feeling that he sees his job purely in terms of preparing the players and making positional moves on match day.

However, not all is lost. As a Buckley fan, I'm hoping he can do more than this. For those who follow the round ball game and especially the English Premier League, you should know about my 'other' club, Liverpool, and its amazing coach/manager, Jurgen Klopp. From the moment he arrived at Liverpool midway through last season, a team which were in the doldrums (but are now sitting equal first on the Premier League table), he made it clear that the players, coaches and the fans all had a role to play in making Liverpool great again. He regularly implores the fans to create a ferocious atmosphere for visiting teams, and speaks glowingly of them, as being part of the club, and the reason the club is great. He often says things like "to win this game we need the fans to help us and inspire us". He has created an incredible bond between players and fans, something which had been in decline for many years. Liverpool is now on the march, in part, because Klopp has smashed down the dividing line between team and fans.

So Bucks, I have been concerned at your apparent belief that it's not your role to motivate the players. Luke Beveridge has demonstrated how a coach can help generate team spirit and enthusiasm, beyond that of players being professional. However, as well as recognising that as coach you have a key role in motivating the team, as head of the CFC, you have a powerful weapon, a force, the Magpie Army, which you have not properly mobilised. Let's not simply limp into and through another season. Bucks, I'm asking you to make it your job to encourage, activate and mobilise the Magpie Army to support, encourage and inspire our team in 2017. We have a power and force like no other club, but it's been in 'sleep mode' for several years now. Make us believe again and together lets go into battle and demonstrate and celebrate the meaning of COLLINGWOOD. Side by Side.


Mate, this is exactly what we need!!

I wrote about Klopp and his influence to the whole club just a few weeks ago when it looked apparent this was missing with us. I likened the influence of Beveridge similar to Klopps.

I too am a Buckley supporter but this slight disconnect between fans and the club is a piece missing from the puzzle.

Great to see another Liverpool fan, its going to be a great year and the belief he has spread around the club is very real.
The belief bounces from person to person within the club and media circles, and is a genuine force you can breath in and smell.

I loved it when Nick Maxwell came out at the start of 2010 and said Collingwood would win the premiership that year.


"Side by Side" is the same as "You'll never walk alone".

Collingwood and Liverpool were both formed in 1892. Cool

I love You will never walk alone...that is fantastic.
But side by side
Is often used on this forum to shut people up.
There is a huge difference in the meaning between the two.

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Member 7167 Leo

"What Good Fortune For Governments That The People Do Not Think" - Adolf Hitler.


Joined: 18 Dec 2008
Location: The Collibran Hideout

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 9:04 pm
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Cam wrote:
Hear, hear.

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."


- Albert Einstein


If you truly think that we are destined to keep repeating the same mistake you are certainly lacking any understanding of human development and intellect.

Bucks is not stupid and he certainly has the ability to analyse his past actions, recognise and identify the flaws and improve on the process.

I do not know much about coaching but after 40 + years of being a man manager I have a pretty good idea of what makes people tick and how to get the most out of people. It is obvious to me that Bucks still has a great deal to learn about human application and one of his greatest issues is that he has a tendency to judge others by his own high professional standards and expects others to behave in a similar manner to himself. Disapointment is guaranteed.

I am confident he is learning and we hopefully will see him as being a better people person next year and a better coach.

By the way Rude Boy, I think your assessment of the situation is spot on.

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Member 7167 Leo

"What Good Fortune For Governments That The People Do Not Think" - Adolf Hitler.


Joined: 18 Dec 2008
Location: The Collibran Hideout

PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 9:06 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

thompsoc wrote:
Bux is a dud.
And when he and Ed steps down that is when things will start to improve.


Gee you are original.

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Albert Parker 



Joined: 13 Dec 2012


PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 9:06 pm
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Jezza wrote:
It's difficult to get a handle on exactly what is happening behind the scenes without being actively involved in what goes on internally, but I'm always sceptical of the way the media has been reporting the issues regarding our off-field matters.

There's no disputing that we have issues and it would be better if they're resolved rather than becoming an unnecessary distraction, but at the same time I think it's been blown out of proportion somewhat without knowing the full facts which are yet to be determined. It's also important to note that what happens off-field doesn't always translate to what happens on the field.

The issue of moving away from our spiritual home seems to only have caused some angst amongst a few recently because we've struggled in the last few years. I didn't hear people whinging about it when we were regularly playing finals and when we won a flag in 2010. Also, our current headquarters are not located in South Yarra, rather we are located in the suburb of Melbourne near the major sporting precinct areas technically speaking.

I'd like to see Victoria Park still remain a key fabric of our club in some shape or form and if the club can try and push for more games at Victoria Park for the VFL side then I will be happy with that. However, it seems as though we've had ongoing issues with Yarra Council in the last few years and the club has grown tired of appeasing them hence we're seeing the VFL side play more matches at Olympic Park rather than at Victoria Park.

I still have concerns about Bucks as coach in various ways, but the club is emotionally and financially invested in him coaching in 2017 so I'm willing to get behind him and hopefully see him steer us up the ladder. He's entering his sixth season now so our patience and faith in him has to be rewarded and reciprocated sooner rather than later. I hope he's successful, but doubts still linger.

The list is in decent shape with still some holes, but if we're able to maintain a minimal injury list and play more consistent football week-to-week, I can't see why we cannot play finals with a bit of luck along the way. Our best football in 2016 was excellent as the performances against Geelong and GWS demonstrated, but our worst football was notably poor so we need to bridge that gap if we're going to be a finals team next year.

As it stands, I still remain cautiously optimistic rather than excited about our short-term prospects, but our performances in the latter stages of 2016 were very encouraging and a great platform and stepping stone to build from in 2017.

We need to start strongly and assert ourselves in the competition, otherwise we could see a repeat of 2016 where it almost felt like our season was over in round 1 symbolically speaking as we were left deflated and lost massive confidence in ourselves due to various issues, and significantly we lost key component of our team in Dane Swan.


Pretty fair summation of my own feelings. Eloquently put too Jezza

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thompsoc 



Joined: 21 Sep 2009


PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 9:09 pm
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Member 7167 wrote:
thompsoc wrote:
Bux is a dud.
And when he and Ed steps down that is when things will start to improve.


Gee you are original.

Thanks Mate!

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thompsoc 



Joined: 21 Sep 2009


PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 9:13 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

Member 7167 wrote:
Cam wrote:
Hear, hear.

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."


- Albert Einstein


If you truly think that we are destined to keep repeating the same mistake you are certainly lacking any understanding of human development and intellect.

Bucks is not stupid and he certainly has the ability to analyse his past actions, recognise and identify the flaws and improve on the process.

I do not know much about coaching but after 40 + years of being a man manager I have a pretty good idea of what makes people tick and how to get the most out of people. It is obvious to me that Bucks still has a great deal to learn about human application and one of his greatest issues is that he has a tendency to judge others by his own high professional standards and expects others to behave in a similar manner to himself. Disapointment is guaranteed.

I am confident he is learning and we hopefully will see him as being a better people person next year and a better coach.

By the way Rude Boy, I think your assessment of the situation is spot on.

Check the scoreboard....it ain't a pretty sight.
But after 5 years if you don't get the vibe...you will never get it.

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