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Evaluating the trade period: how did we go?

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Piesnchess 

piesnchess


Joined: 09 Jun 2008


PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:12 pm
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Pies4shaw wrote:
PnC, they didn't "retire bar Cloke". Frost, Brown, Williams, Cloke and Witts all got new jobs. It's difficult enough to discuss these issues without denying the obvious.


IM not denying it, I was actually referring more to swan, tooves, mc caffer re retired players, of course frost, brown, Williams have moved on, and Witts, none of them would figure big in our future, this is the time of hard decisions, not just us. Look at deludio and vickery leaving the tiges, lewis and Mitchell, the icons of the hawks, going, who would have thought that ???? Confused

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AN_Inkling 



Joined: 06 Oct 2007


PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 4:00 pm
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The hysteria over our loss of KPPs is a way out of proportion to what actually happened.

Here are our net changes:

KPF: -1
KPD: -1

Yes, we lost one of each and that somehow means we'll not be able to field a defence? Or that our forward line is non existant? Yeah, sounds like reasonable analysis.

We also still have an option to bring in insurance players who will mostly play VFL, you know just like the ones that we let go, but on much smaller salaries.

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What'sinaname Libra



Joined: 29 May 2010
Location: Living rent free

PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 5:54 pm
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AN_Inkling wrote:
The hysteria over our loss of KPPs is a way out of proportion to what actually happened.

Here are our net changes:

KPF: -1
KPD: -1

Yes, we lost one of each and that somehow means we'll not be able to field a defence? Or that our forward line is non existant? Yeah, sounds like reasonable analysis.

We also still have an option to bring in insurance players who will mostly play VFL, you know just like the ones that we let go, but on much smaller salaries.


We did, in Dunn. We still need a KP beckman to play in the seniors team.
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AN_Inkling 



Joined: 06 Oct 2007


PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:23 pm
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Dunn played 44 games of AFL from 2014-2015. He's a more than capable AFL player.

None of the players we let go were expected to play regular senior footy in 2017. Frost only played 10 games in 2016. Brown played 16, but we clearly would have preferred he didn't.

I think we do want to find another younger key defender at some point. At the moment though, a mixture of Dunn, Keeffe, Goldsack and potentially others we bring in will get the job done alongside Reid and our mediums, Howe, Langdon, Scharenberg, Oxley. It's not a huge downgrade on Brown, Frost and Marsh (if he doesn't stay on) no matter how you look at it. Not as good as individual defenders maybe, but far better mobility and ball use, which for me means it will be an improvement especially because we want to play a zone defence.

Also I'd not rule out the possibility of Scharenberg eventually playing key position. He's 191cm but we are seeing some smaller keys in recent years (Grundy, 192cm) and I think that trend will continue.

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swoop42 Virgo

Whatcha gonna do when he comes for you?


Joined: 02 Aug 2008
Location: The 18

PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2016 4:27 pm
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Well let's be honest we didn't have a great hand to play with in terms of draft picks.

I have concerns about the length and financial remuneration for Wells and Mayne but I can see reasons why we targeted both given the lack of experience on our list.

Wells and injury will always be a concern but if you look at some stats for him this season they are elite in areas we need improvement in.

Still he isn't no spring chicken.

Mayne hasn't been a high goal kicker in recent seasons but he can play a role both forward and back and is a more skilled and polished version of Toovey or Goldsack. Hopefully he should prove handy and like Howe make a position is own as the season progresses.

The bigger question is whether we should have waited till next year when a number of higher quality free agents like Martin will possibly be available.

This move seems partially motivated by the desire to give the coach every chance of returning to finals next year and saving his job.

Dunn was a need given the departure of Brown and Frost (and now Marsh).

He's arguably better than Brown in most areas and has played his best football in the latter stages of his career. He's coverage which is needed.

I don't know much about Hoskin-Elliott other than he was a former No.4 draft selection and has been very injury plagued the last 2 seasons.

Kicked 26 goals from 20 games in 2014 so must have some talent to play with.

I wonder if we made a decent play for Stewart or not?

Given the little Essendon had to give up to get him I'd be disappointed if we didn't have a real crack.

He may not be good enough but as that lighter framed mobile forward/ruck option he seems the prototype of how big forwards are going to be and would have been possibly a good combination with Moore and released some pressure and focus off him.

Perhaps he still harbours a grudge towards us as we didn't take the opportunity to draft as a father son and he told us to get stuffed when we came knocking.

Other teams did better this trade period but given our limitations I'd rate us a 7/10 or a grade B.

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MatthewBoydFanClub 



Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: Elwood

PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2016 4:48 pm
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We need another two or three Darcy Moores on our list starting with pick 28 in the national draft and whatever first round draft pick we have next year. Another KPP delisted free agent would be good as well, but doesn't look like we're going down that avenue. My prediction is, by round 10 -12 next year we will start regretting our shortage of KPP's, especially if injuries strike early next year.
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Dave The Man Scorpio



Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia

PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2016 7:17 pm
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5150 wrote:
I'm happy with the outs - all had poor disposal or declining rapidly. I would go as far as to say they cost us games this year.


Williams cost us the Hawks Game

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think positive Libra

Side By Side


Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere

PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2016 7:55 pm
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AN_Inkling wrote:
The hysteria over our loss of KPPs is a way out of proportion to what actually happened.

Here are our net changes:

KPF: -1
KPD: -1

Yes, we lost one of each and that somehow means we'll not be able to field a defence? Or that our forward line is non existant? Yeah, sounds like reasonable analysis.

We also still have an option to bring in insurance players who will mostly play VFL, you know just like the ones that we let go, but on much smaller salaries.


We were already struggling in defence big time, not sure how this won't make much difference!

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Pies4shaw Leo

pies4shaw


Joined: 08 Oct 2007


PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2016 7:55 pm
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Cloke cost us the GWS game.
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Dave The Man Scorpio



Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia

PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2016 8:02 pm
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Piesnchess wrote:
Not bad I suppose, pretty good, Wells and Hosin -Elliott, are going to be great, and thank the Lord we did not get Vickery, biggest spud in the history of spuds, Clarkos first and biggest, mistake of his footy career. LOL


I think Vickery is Underrated by Many

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Dave The Man Scorpio



Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia

PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2016 8:07 pm
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What'sinaname wrote:
I think the trade was a 7/10 without the Witts deal, but drops to a 5/10 because of Witts.

We will regret this trade.


How?

Grundy is Clearly the Better Talent out of the 2

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watt price tully Scorpio



Joined: 15 May 2007


PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2016 10:50 pm
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Dave The Man wrote:
Piesnchess wrote:
Not bad I suppose, pretty good, Wells and Hosin -Elliott, are going to be great, and thank the Lord we did not get Vickery, biggest spud in the history of spuds, Clarkos first and biggest, mistake of his footy career. LOL


I think Vickery is Underrated by Many


For sure DTM. Hawks have picked up a very useful player that will fit in nicely for them. Smart pickup by the Hawks

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Last edited by watt price tully on Thu Nov 10, 2016 10:51 pm; edited 1 time in total
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HAL 

Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.


Joined: 17 Mar 2003


PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2016 10:51 pm
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Sorry you've lost me, we were talking about we'd get Brown and pick 58 for 28 .
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