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Morrigu 
Joined: 11 Aug 2001
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| David wrote: | | But what I can go on is anti-Muslim comments that I hear at work, or at the pub, or from passers-by. They have certainly been increasing lately, so the sentiment is out there. |
Maybe the comments are increasing because of the increasing number of attacks and mass murders particularly in Western countries carried out by cowardly thugs yelling Allahu Akbar?
I was talking to a couple of my colleagues yesterday who are Muslim and they made the point that the fact that many of these murders have been carried out by people living in the country, in communities for a long time rather than just arrived has really heightened mistrust of Muslims in general.
She also said that there is a perception that the Muslim communities know all about these loose cannons but protect them - she said she has been asked many times lately if she would report a fellow Muslim who expressed extreme views or showed signs of being radicalised. 
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“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.” |
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David 
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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^ Well yes, I'm hardly suggesting that this hatred and xenophobia exists in a vacuum. But an increase in attacks by ISIS or ISIS-supporting thugs isn't going to make ordinary Muslims any more guilty or responsible for those actions. So while we may understand where the fear and hatred are coming from, we surely still need to fight against it.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| Morrigu wrote: | | David wrote: | | But what I can go on is anti-Muslim comments that I hear at work, or at the pub, or from passers-by. They have certainly been increasing lately, so the sentiment is out there. |
Maybe the comments are increasing because of the increasing number of attacks and mass murders particularly in Western countries carried out by cowardly thugs yelling Allahu Akbar?
I was talking to a couple of my colleagues yesterday who are Muslim and they made the point that the fact that many of these murders have been carried out by people living in the country, in communities for a long time rather than just arrived has really heightened mistrust of Muslims in general.
She also said that there is a perception that the Muslim communities know all about these loose cannons but protect them - she said she has been asked many times lately if she would report a fellow Muslim who expressed extreme views or showed signs of being radicalised. |
Out of curiosity, would she?
| David wrote: | | ^ Well yes, I'm hardly suggesting that this hatred and xenophobia exists in a vacuum. But an increase in attacks by ISIS or ISIS-supporting thugs isn't going to make ordinary Muslims any more guilty or responsible for those actions. So while we may understand where the fear and hatred are coming from, we surely still need to fight against it. |
Do you think the best way to fight against it is to publically ridicule, bully and berate the people who express these opinions?
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| stui magpie wrote: |
Do you think the best way to fight against it is to publically ridicule, bully and berate the people who express these opinions? |
It's a reasonable start. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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I'll give you the tip, it's not working.
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Morrigu
Joined: 11 Aug 2001
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| stui magpie wrote: |
She also said that there is a perception that the Muslim communities know all about these loose cannons but protect them - she said she has been asked many times lately if she would report a fellow Muslim who expressed extreme views or showed signs of being radicalised.
Out of curiosity, would she? |
I would think so but I didn't ask her
I think she would because she is a single 30 odd yr old career orientated well educated health professional who has her own home and enjoys her freedom practices her faith quietly but wears the hijab - and mostly I think she would because was really really pissed off at what she couldn't do when she went to Saudi - i wont repeat what she called them for quite some time when she returned 
_________________
“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.” |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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Hah,
I must confess I'm surprised that people like her still choose to wear the hijab. 
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Morrigu
Joined: 11 Aug 2001
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Oh I dunno every day I am having a bad hair day ( which is everyday  ) I think how much easier it would be!
I was so disappointed when they got rid of our nursing caps - I could just tuck it all up, chuck on the cap - a few strategic bobby pins and voil ready for work!!!
_________________
“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.” |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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LOL,
Yes Matron.
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| Morrigu wrote: | | stui magpie wrote: | Hah,
I must confess I'm surprised that people like her still choose to wear the hijab. |
......
I was so disappointed when they got rid of our nursing caps -..... |
Me too. 
I met Mrs WPT in the first 2 weeks of nurse training. I also kept a room in the nurses quarters. She kept her change of dresses / uniforms in the wardrobe & the cleaner told the D.O.N.
I had some explaining to do   
_________________
“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| stui magpie wrote: |
| David wrote: | | ^ Well yes, I'm hardly suggesting that this hatred and xenophobia exists in a vacuum. But an increase in attacks by ISIS or ISIS-supporting thugs isn't going to make ordinary Muslims any more guilty or responsible for those actions. So while we may understand where the fear and hatred are coming from, we surely still need to fight against it. |
Do you think the best way to fight against it is to publically ridicule, bully and berate the people who express these opinions? |
No, and I never have. But I do believe in the importance of criticism, and think that people are sometimes too quick to conflate criticism with abuse. For instance, there's a big difference between calling an opinion racist and calling an individual a racist. I don't generally see the latter as being useful.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace
Last edited by David on Fri Jul 22, 2016 2:54 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Morrigu
Joined: 11 Aug 2001
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| David wrote: | | But I do believe in the importance of criticism, and think that people are sometimes too quick to conflate criticism with abuse. . |
_________________
“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.” |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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Pies4shaw
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| David wrote: | | stui magpie wrote: |
| David wrote: | | ^ Well yes, I'm hardly suggesting that this hatred and xenophobia exists in a vacuum. But an increase in attacks by ISIS or ISIS-supporting thugs isn't going to make ordinary Muslims any more guilty or responsible for those actions. So while we may understand where the fear and hatred are coming from, we surely still need to fight against it. |
Do you think the best way to fight against it is to publically ridicule, bully and berate the people who express these opinions? |
No, and I never have. But I do believe in the importance of criticism, and think that people are sometimes too quick to conflate criticism with abuse. For instance, there's a big difference between calling an opinion racist and calling an individual a racist. I don't generally see the latter as being useful.
As for Adams, he certainly gets the chocolates for picking this so far out, but I still find his analysis way too shallow and superficial. So, was he merely lucky, did I overestimate the seriousness of American politics, or has he had his finger on the pulse all along? Time will tell. I still expect Clinton to win comfortably. |
This is particularly problematic when idiots substitute anger and prejudice for argument. Hanson isn't engaged in "political discourse" and it is a grave mistake to pretend that she is. There are serous problems being experienced by many of the people who voted for her - the "trickle down" theory of economic globalisation has never enamoured itself much to the people to whom the benefits don't trickle down - and our political culture is the poorer for failing to deal with those problems. However, Hanson doesn't offer any program to attend to the underlying concerns of the people (other than the actual racists) who voted for her party and there is, consequently, nothing of substance in her "platform" with which intelligent people can engage. Where there is no argument of substance being presented by an "opponent", we make fools of ourselves by pretending that there is. |
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Mountains Magpie
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Somewhere between now and then
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| David wrote: | | Let's not beat around the bush here: any policy that profiles and excludes 1/6th of the world's population because of the actions of a few is discriminatory and solely motivated by fear of difference (or else the desire to capitalise on that fear for political gain). It may not fit the dictionary definition of racism, but it is as bad as racism in every single respect. |
Perhaps it has nothing to do with the actions of a few.
It just might be more to do with the inaction of the many.
MM
_________________
Spiral progress, unstoppable,
exhausted sources replaced by perversion |
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