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| Nathan Buckley: what should the club do with him? |
| Sack him now and pay him out |
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18% |
[ 28 ] |
| Sack him at season's end and pay him out |
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14% |
[ 22 ] |
| Wait and see until season's end, then review (inclined to sack) |
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14% |
[ 22 ] |
| Wait and see until season's end, then review (inclined to keep) |
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17% |
[ 26 ] |
| Keep him until mid-season 2017, then reassess |
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5% |
[ 9 ] |
| Keep him until end of 2017, then reassess |
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17% |
[ 27 ] |
| Back him for as long as it takes! All We Can Be with NCB! |
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9% |
[ 15 ] |
| Other (please outline in the thread) |
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1% |
[ 2 ] |
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| Total Votes : 151 |
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Krakouer Magic
Joined: 05 Apr 2011
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| 5 from the wing on debut wrote: | | Krakouer Magic wrote: | Gotta love this quote from buckley's presser today about the GWS half back line -
"There's no doubt their run off half-back is good and it's a strong aspect of their game, but it's not exceptional."
Great to see the coach keep it low key and not giving the opposition any extra motivation to want to kick our butts on Saturday.
Seriously, wtf?
What's not exceptional about Buntine, Wilson, Williams, Kennedy, Haynes, Shaw and Griffin. Even with a few of them injured, their half back flankers are elite.
It's just a mind numbingly stupid thing for a coach of the 11th side to say about the 3rd side. Take the training wheels off Bucks, it's your fifth season mate. Don't give the opposition anything.
Would much prefer a smart response that a clarko, Roos, Scott, Longmire or Lyon would have given... "Well GWS half backs are in phenomenal form. Our half Fwds have got their work cut out. But we're up for the challenge"....
... "Not exceptional"... Expecting Heater to kick 6 off half back this week |
I have often wondered why there is a "give them nothing to motivate them" attitude in AFL football. Perhaps those with a degree in psychology could contribute on the point, but why would a professional athlete try harder just because someone said something negative about them in the lead up to the game? Aren't they always giving it 100% ? I have often heard AFL players say that in milestone games the players forget about that and just play when the ball is bounced.
Muhammad Ali and many boxers and MMA fighters since then have no fear of telling their opponents exactly where there weaknesses are and what they are going to do to them.
Going back to the 70's Thommo had no problems telling the Poms what he was going to do to them. Glenn McGrath had no qualms about looking down the camera and telling Atherton that he was weak outside off stump and that he was going to target him.
This behaviour goes on in many other sports as well but in AFL football it is taboo. Why ? My guess is that as football is quite conservative and traditional, and as most people are sheep, that someone prominent in the game decided years ago not to give anything away and that has been followed blindly without thought ever since. I am looking forward to a coach saying we are better than them and this is what we are going to do to them. One day a coach will have the balls to say what he thinks and to do it. |
It ain't just AFL mate. It's every team sport. Individual sports are a completely different psychology to team sports. I'll just say Rex Ryan vs Bill Belichek. Loud mouth vs introvert.
Malthouse praised teams even in 2010-11 when we smashed em. He gave the nothing. And remember the 02 final vs port. "Pressure is all on Port" Malthouse said early in the week. Psychology is everything in team sport.
Internally say wtf you like. Externally, STFU!
The bottom line, GWS half back line is elite and is exceptional. To act like it isn't is stupid. Our half back flankers wouldn't even make their rookie list. Maybe sharenberg would, but the rest please.
Just praise them, and them when and if you beat them praise your own team even more |
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Krakouer Magic
Joined: 05 Apr 2011
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| stui magpie wrote: | | Krakouer Magic wrote: | | didick wrote: | The end of this article is the most interesting.
How ballet is behind the Pies’ resurgence
http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/the-crowd/the-unexpected-link-between-ballet-lessons-and-a-resurgence-in-collingwoods-football-fortunes/news-story/ab597b116ae5b8e6cb3f4c457aa4776a
From Fox Sports App.
Download the FOX Sports app here: http://www.foxsports.com.au/cs/Satellite/app?source=app&site=FoxSports&channel=mobile @FOXSportsAUS
On a recent episode of Fox Footy’s On The Couch, Jonathan Brown broke down how the Pies have stopped playing their 1-3-2 zone defence from the centre bounce, instead going the more traditional route, playing man-on-man defence.
“I think Nathan Buckley has just gone, righto, I’m going to back you guys in one-on-one,” Brown said. “Yeah of course, you’re still conscious of looking after your teammate and flying third up.
“That is a definite change of philosophy after the bye, and it’ll be interesting to see if that continues on.”
Now, whether Collingwood commits to playing a man-on-man defence for a prolonged period of time will be intriguing. In today’s era of versatility, elements of a zone and spatial defence need to be implemented to have the greatest possible rate of success.
It is ironic, though, that a simple change in game plan from Buckley, combined with a unique ballet training routine from the Pies’ best backman, has led to this dramatic change of fortunes. |
Haha Jono brown sees what happened. The joke of a game plan that was rounds 1 to 7 was changed. Surprise suprise with a change of game plan, even with injuries, the pies are much more competitive. Goodness me. Brown sees what all us "negative" types have seen all year. Yet the Bucks lovers will ignore the truth yet again and claim it's not his fault... |
I'm sorry, I missed your point.
A coach puts a tactic in place, it doesn't work properly which could be because it's a bad tactic or because the players aren't up to implementing it or any shade between, so he changes things and the changes work and that's the hallmark of a bad coach?
Did I miss something? |
Haha yeah you missed the point clearly. How about I spell it out for you...
Sh1t coach spends the entire pre season drilling the playing group from November with an abomination of a gameplan. Sh1t coach gets belted in round 1. Sh1t coach misreads how the game will be played in 2016 and continues with sh1t gameplan. Many supporters question gameplan after first 2 rounds yet sh1t coach maintains dud gameplan (relying on injuries to account for teams poor form). After team continues woeful performance, sh1t coach waits till Eddie Maguire cracks the sh1ts about the Carlton loss. Only then does the light bulb in sh1t coach's head go off and he decide to change stoppage and defensive set ups. Something the "negative" nicks posters have been talking about opening since the round 1 disgrace. And in my case since the swans loss last year.
It's 5 years of sh1t. Things work do they? Haha we beat Carlton by 2 goals and scored 57 points. And we beat freo. Hahaha. God lord. We have wasted a dynasty. If Buckley gave a sh1t about anyone but himself, he would have said to Eddie after 2010 "I want a clear run at back to back. I'll stay assistant till 2012 or 13. Let Malthouse and this team run its course"... Bucks didn't do that though did he?
5 years of ordinary sh1t. |
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Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
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| Krakouer Magic wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | | Krakouer Magic wrote: | Gotta love this quote from buckley's presser today about the GWS half back line -
"There's no doubt their run off half-back is good and it's a strong aspect of their game, but it's not exceptional."
Great to see the coach keep it low key and not giving the opposition any extra motivation to want to kick our butts on Saturday.
Seriously, wtf?
What's not exceptional about Buntine, Wilson, Williams, Kennedy, Haynes, Shaw and Griffin. Even with a few of them injured, their half back flankers are elite.
It's just a mind numbingly stupid thing for a coach of the 11th side to say about the 3rd side. Take the training wheels off Bucks, it's your fifth season mate. Don't give the opposition anything.
Would much prefer a smart response that a clarko, Roos, Scott, Longmire or Lyon would have given... "Well GWS half backs are in phenomenal form. Our half Fwds have got their work cut out. But we're up for the challenge"....
... "Not exceptional"... Expecting Heater to kick 6 off half back this week |
Perhaps he was alluding to the fact that its no better or worse than, say, geelong, or the hawks, swans or crows etc, any of the top sides, jeesus, its not as if he totally bagged them, but I guess Bucks haters like you just jump on him any chance you get, guess that's the way of it now.  |
Are you serious? I never see other "good" coaches give up easy quotes to the opposition like that. It's just further evidence of how out of his depth he is. You seriously think Leon Cameron, or Nick Maxwell (leadership coach) isn't gonna say "hey shawry, your old coach.. You know the one that got rid of you, thinks you and your half back mates are "not exceptional". You guys are just ok, good and average top 8 fodder"... Please. As coach your job in pressers is to give nothing. It's an absurd thing to say. And swans, Hawks, crows and dogs etc are all exceptional. |
You read far far too much into it, its not as if he said they are utter shit, he just said it as it is, hell, listen to Lyon or geelongs coach, they say similar things, as does Hardwick, I really don't think you can bag Bucks on t his one, at the end o fthe day I too reckon GWS are all attack and that's where they shine, steive j and Cameron, their defence does not exactly set the world on fire, so why not stir the pricks up a bit, tony shaw used to do it a lot, he did it to Sheedy prior to the 1990 GF, it can un nerve the opposition too. But , once again, its any chance to bag Bucks so twhat more can one expect from you. 
_________________
Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| Krakouer Magic wrote: |
Haha yeah you missed the point clearly. How about I spell it out for you...
Sh1t coach spends the entire pre season drilling the playing group from November with an abomination of a gameplan. Sh1t coach gets belted in round 1. Sh1t coach misreads how the game will be played in 2016 and continues with sh1t gameplan. Many supporters question gameplan after first 2 rounds yet sh1t coach maintains dud gameplan (relying on injuries to account for teams poor form). After team continues woeful performance, sh1t coach waits till Eddie Maguire cracks the sh1ts about the Carlton loss. Only then does the light bulb in sh1t coach's head go off and he decide to change stoppage and defensive set ups. Something the "negative" nicks posters have been talking about opening since the round 1 disgrace. And in my case since the swans loss last year.
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Damn pity you're not coaching us. You're not Alistair Clarkson posting as KMagic are you ? Because the way you tell it, you're a bloody footy genius who'd outcoach Buckley every day. But then, as Joe Theissman said, "no one's a genius in footy .... a genius is someone like Norman Einstein".
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Two more flags before I die! |
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The Boy Who Cried Wolf
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Location: We prefer free speech - you know it's right
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| Mugwump wrote: | | Krakouer Magic wrote: |
Haha yeah you missed the point clearly. How about I spell it out for you...
Sh1t coach spends the entire pre season drilling the playing group from November with an abomination of a gameplan. Sh1t coach gets belted in round 1. Sh1t coach misreads how the game will be played in 2016 and continues with sh1t gameplan. Many supporters question gameplan after first 2 rounds yet sh1t coach maintains dud gameplan (relying on injuries to account for teams poor form). After team continues woeful performance, sh1t coach waits till Eddie Maguire cracks the sh1ts about the Carlton loss. Only then does the light bulb in sh1t coach's head go off and he decide to change stoppage and defensive set ups. Something the "negative" nicks posters have been talking about opening since the round 1 disgrace. And in my case since the swans loss last year.
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Damn pity you're not coaching us. You're not Alistair Clarkson posting as KMagic are you ? Because the way you tell it, you're a bloody footy genius who'd outcoach Buckley every day. But then, as Joe Theissman said, "no one's a genius in footy .... a genius is someone like Norman Einstein". |
I wish he was coaching us... honestly, he'd be hard pressed to do _worse_ than Bucks over the last 5 years. |
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Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
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| Cam wrote: | | Krakouer Magic wrote: | | Are you serious? I never see other "good" coaches give up easy quotes to the opposition like that. It's just further evidence of how out of his depth he is. You seriously think Leon Cameron, or Nick Maxwell (leadership coach) isn't gonna say "hey shawry, your old coach.. You know the one that got rid of you, thinks you and your half back mates are "not exceptional". You guys are just ok, good and average top 8 fodder"... Please. As coach your job in pressers is to give nothing. It's an absurd thing to say. And swans, Hawks, crows and dogs etc are all exceptional. |
You mean good coaches like Clarkson who called out Port for toughness and mental strength and then put the whole competition on notice that basically the Hawks were going to win the flag again? |
Wasn't it angry little ant Clarko who also called out some other team on mental strength some years ago, I seem too recall. ?? Guess its ok for him too sling shit on teams cos his name is not Buckley, and he has coached an awesome team of seasoned champions, that helps too.
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Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
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5 from the wing on debut
Joined: 27 May 2016
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| Krakouer Magic wrote: | | 5 from the wing on debut wrote: | | Krakouer Magic wrote: | Gotta love this quote from buckley's presser today about the GWS half back line -
"There's no doubt their run off half-back is good and it's a strong aspect of their game, but it's not exceptional."
Great to see the coach keep it low key and not giving the opposition any extra motivation to want to kick our butts on Saturday.
Seriously, wtf?
What's not exceptional about Buntine, Wilson, Williams, Kennedy, Haynes, Shaw and Griffin. Even with a few of them injured, their half back flankers are elite.
It's just a mind numbingly stupid thing for a coach of the 11th side to say about the 3rd side. Take the training wheels off Bucks, it's your fifth season mate. Don't give the opposition anything.
Would much prefer a smart response that a clarko, Roos, Scott, Longmire or Lyon would have given... "Well GWS half backs are in phenomenal form. Our half Fwds have got their work cut out. But we're up for the challenge"....
... "Not exceptional"... Expecting Heater to kick 6 off half back this week |
I have often wondered why there is a "give them nothing to motivate them" attitude in AFL football. Perhaps those with a degree in psychology could contribute on the point, but why would a professional athlete try harder just because someone said something negative about them in the lead up to the game? Aren't they always giving it 100% ? I have often heard AFL players say that in milestone games the players forget about that and just play when the ball is bounced.
Muhammad Ali and many boxers and MMA fighters since then have no fear of telling their opponents exactly where there weaknesses are and what they are going to do to them.
Going back to the 70's Thommo had no problems telling the Poms what he was going to do to them. Glenn McGrath had no qualms about looking down the camera and telling Atherton that he was weak outside off stump and that he was going to target him.
This behaviour goes on in many other sports as well but in AFL football it is taboo. Why ? My guess is that as football is quite conservative and traditional, and as most people are sheep, that someone prominent in the game decided years ago not to give anything away and that has been followed blindly without thought ever since. I am looking forward to a coach saying we are better than them and this is what we are going to do to them. One day a coach will have the balls to say what he thinks and to do it. |
It ain't just AFL mate. It's every team sport. Individual sports are a completely different psychology to team sports. I'll just say Rex Ryan vs Bill Belichek. Loud mouth vs introvert.
Malthouse praised teams even in 2010-11 when we smashed em. He gave the nothing. And remember the 02 final vs port. "Pressure is all on Port" Malthouse said early in the week. Psychology is everything in team sport.
Internally say wtf you like. Externally, STFU!
The bottom line, GWS half back line is elite and is exceptional. To act like it isn't is stupid. Our half back flankers wouldn't even make their rookie list. Maybe sharenberg would, but the rest please.
Just praise them, and them when and if you beat them praise your own team even more |
I agree with what you say about GWS. They are my flag favourite this year. I disagree with what you say about giving the other team ammunition to play better. It is illogical to think that talking down an opponent will give that opponent an advantage. I doubt that you could give me one substantiated piece of evidence to support your proposition.
You mention the difference between individual and team sports. How is that relevant, except for the pressure being much greater in individual sports than team sports?
If an opponent has a potential mental weakness then by all means work on that. That is why McGrath said what he did about Atherton. He had Atherton thinking about what he could not do instead of what he could do. Warne used to psych out opponents by talking about balls that he had developed when he had done no such thing. But it worked.
If a GWS coach or player came out and said before the game today that GWS are not worried about Cloke as he can't kick straight & misses from the goal square do you think that is going to make Cloke kick straighter or is going to mess with his mind and make him worse? I know where my money would be and I would give kudos to a coach that was prepared to step out of the box and say something like that. I don't mean that in a way to belittle Cloke which isn't my intention, but just by way of a close to home example.
Football is very conservative and many views held by supporters and coaches are not based upon rational thought. People have a view because that's what everyone else thinks. One example of this is the introduction of the huddle on the kick in. You may have heard Robert Walls, one of the more intelligent people that is involved in football, discuss the background as to why he introduced the huddle. He was appointed Fitzroy coach at a young age and they had no money and little in the way of support staff. Walls sought some guidance from an American who was a university lecturer with a basketball background. He asked Walls why the full back always pointed where he was going to kick the ball. Walls answered that was so his ruckman knew where to go to mark the ball. The American responded that this also told the other team where to be, so why do you do it? The answer was that it's because it's what we do, we have always done it. As a result the huddle was born. You probably recall how surprised the rest of the competition were at something so basic but which had never been done before. Whilst this is not right on point it is an example of how insular and limited the thought that has traditionally gone into the game is. |
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Redlight
Joined: 11 Jun 2009
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| Cam wrote: | | Krakouer Magic wrote: | | Are you serious? I never see other "good" coaches give up easy quotes to the opposition like that. It's just further evidence of how out of his depth he is. You seriously think Leon Cameron, or Nick Maxwell (leadership coach) isn't gonna say "hey shawry, your old coach.. You know the one that got rid of you, thinks you and your half back mates are "not exceptional". You guys are just ok, good and average top 8 fodder"... Please. As coach your job in pressers is to give nothing. It's an absurd thing to say. And swans, Hawks, crows and dogs etc are all exceptional. |
You mean good coaches like Clarkson who called out Port for toughness and mental strength and then put the whole competition on notice that basically the Hawks were going to win the flag again? |
| Krakouer Magic wrote: | | I expected him to say "GWS half back line is clearly elite. It's in great form. We gotta stop their run". If, and when, we nullify their half back line and win (or get a close loss), he could say "we nullified GWS half back line and that's an awesome achievement. We executed brilliantly."... What is it that people's don't understand about not handing bulletin board material to the other side??? Why give them even 1% extra motivation? |
Cam has already completely destroyed the argument you were trying to make.
You can pretend you didn't notice, but the rest of us certainly did.  |
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Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
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THE Bucks haters can now spend the rest of the week wiping all the scrambled eggs off their sorry mooshes. ! LOL Krak magic, hope you have a massive sponge too remove all the egg off your face, in particular.
Finally, a week all the Bucks doubters can now STFU. thank the Lord.!
_________________
Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
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Krakouer Magic
Joined: 05 Apr 2011
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| Piesnchess wrote: | THE Bucks haters can now spend the rest of the week wiping all the scrambled eggs off their sorry mooshes. ! LOL Krak magic, hope you have a massive sponge too remove all the egg off your face, in particular.
Finally, a week all the Bucks doubters can now STFU. thank the Lord.! |
Haha seriously? What part of the disaster of rounds 1-7 do you not understand. Even beating stk and Melbourne once. We'd be right in the hunt for top 8 and top 4. This win vs GWS doesn't change anything. Unless we make finals it's another wasted year |
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Cam 
Nick's BB Member #166
Joined: 10 May 2002
Location: Springvale
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You mean when we had to overcome the drug scandal and wholesale changes to our side due to injuries to key players plus playing new guys unfamiliar to each other. Yeah you got a point.
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Get back on top. |
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Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
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| Krakouer Magic wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | THE Bucks haters can now spend the rest of the week wiping all the scrambled eggs off their sorry mooshes. ! LOL Krak magic, hope you have a massive sponge too remove all the egg off your face, in particular.
Finally, a week all the Bucks doubters can now STFU. thank the Lord.! |
Haha seriously? What part of the disaster of rounds 1-7 do you not understand. Even beating stk and Melbourne once. We'd be right in the hunt for top 8 and top 4. This win vs GWS doesn't change anything. Unless we make finals it's another wasted year |
you sure don't like losing the argument do you, naturally mass injuries mean nothing too you, as expected, you just cant help yourself. Back to your coloured pencils sonny, and keep wiping all that egg off your moosh for the next day at least. 
_________________
Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
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Krakouer Magic
Joined: 05 Apr 2011
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| Redlight wrote: | | Cam wrote: | | Krakouer Magic wrote: | | Are you serious? I never see other "good" coaches give up easy quotes to the opposition like that. It's just further evidence of how out of his depth he is. You seriously think Leon Cameron, or Nick Maxwell (leadership coach) isn't gonna say "hey shawry, your old coach.. You know the one that got rid of you, thinks you and your half back mates are "not exceptional". You guys are just ok, good and average top 8 fodder"... Please. As coach your job in pressers is to give nothing. It's an absurd thing to say. And swans, Hawks, crows and dogs etc are all exceptional. |
You mean good coaches like Clarkson who called out Port for toughness and mental strength and then put the whole competition on notice that basically the Hawks were going to win the flag again? |
| Krakouer Magic wrote: | | I expected him to say "GWS half back line is clearly elite. It's in great form. We gotta stop their run". If, and when, we nullify their half back line and win (or get a close loss), he could say "we nullified GWS half back line and that's an awesome achievement. We executed brilliantly."... What is it that people's don't understand about not handing bulletin board material to the other side??? Why give them even 1% extra motivation? |
Cam has already completely destroyed the argument you were trying to make.
You can pretend you didn't notice, but the rest of us certainly did. |
Firstly your talking about Port. Who are crap. And clarko is top of the ladder. Clarko wouldn't be saying GWS backline is not exceptional. They are. End of story. And our players did expectionally well to contain them today. Though they were missing a few great players, there's no doubt GWS half back line has been exceptional this year... So's as for Cam destroying my argument I think that's highly unlikely. |
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Krakouer Magic
Joined: 05 Apr 2011
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| Cam wrote: | | You mean when we had to overcome the drug scandal and wholesale changes to our side due to injuries to key players plus playing new guys unfamiliar to each other. Yeah you got a point. |
Oh and change the structures and game plan yeah? |
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Krakouer Magic
Joined: 05 Apr 2011
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| Piesnchess wrote: | | Krakouer Magic wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | THE Bucks haters can now spend the rest of the week wiping all the scrambled eggs off their sorry mooshes. ! LOL Krak magic, hope you have a massive sponge too remove all the egg off your face, in particular.
Finally, a week all the Bucks doubters can now STFU. thank the Lord.! |
Haha seriously? What part of the disaster of rounds 1-7 do you not understand. Even beating stk and Melbourne once. We'd be right in the hunt for top 8 and top 4. This win vs GWS doesn't change anything. Unless we make finals it's another wasted year |
you sure don't like losing the argument do you, naturally mass injuries mean nothing too you, as expected, you just cant help yourself. Back to your coloured pencils sonny, and keep wiping all that egg off your moosh for the next day at least. |
It's not about winning or losing. My argument is consistent. Malthouse had plenty of injuries in 2006-09. Always made finals. Never used it as an excuse. Pies from 2014 to 2016... Well injuries are all the excuse. |
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