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HAL 

Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.


Joined: 17 Mar 2003


PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:15 pm
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Sorry mr nice guy does it I don't do math.
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stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 6:36 pm
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think positive wrote:
So got the three month bill from Oct to Jan. If I pay on time it's.........$349.67! Full price is $371.87. I just pulled out last years bill for the same period, (no discounts offed back then!) total price .....$783.81!
So we saved $434.14! Add that to the hundred from the first bill (which was the transition period, so hard to work out the actual savings) and the $202 saving from the last bill, (oct) and We have already recouped $736 in just 7 months! I'll take that! And I haven't even negotiated a deal for elec/gas yet. I was waiting to see what the bills would be like!


geezus. Shocked Your bill with solar is similar to mine without solar.

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think positive Libra

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Joined: 30 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:24 am
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/\ that's why I wanted solar! Mind you changing all the down lights over, and swapping out the giant plasma probably helped too!

$350 summer bill for a family of 4 adults plus strays, with a pool, I'll happily cop to that!

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luvdids Sagittarius



Joined: 22 Mar 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 3:23 pm
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Geez! My Mum's got solar panels & I'm pretty sure she hasn't even HAD a bill since she got them. They only thing she's got from the power company is a couple cheques for the power she's supplied to them!

Have you been cleaning the panels? That can make a difference to the amount of power generated, got to get the bird droppings & dust off them pretty regularly.
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Member 7167 Leo

"What Good Fortune For Governments That The People Do Not Think" - Adolf Hitler.


Joined: 18 Dec 2008
Location: The Collibran Hideout

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:02 pm
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Hi TP

I have solar. I have a 4 kw system that uses individual Enphase micro-inverters on each panel as opposed to having a single larger string converter. (It produces about 5400 kw per year.) The micro-inverters were used because of shading and in this environment the output is better. That said it is a more expensive option. Don't worry about which retailer you are with just do the conversion and get a quote from your current provider. You can then shop it around or use a service like Electricity Wizard to get the best deal.

There is a site called PV Output that many people in Australia and overseas upload their info into. It will give you real information of how different size system with varying inverters and panels operate in your suburb.

The other thing you need to do is down load your consumption from the electricity wholesaler. This gives you enough information to assist in calculating what is the best quotation to take up. Peak / Off Peak etc from various retailers.

I used this information to compare the last twelve months actual figures Peak, Off Peak and Solar Feed In to calculate what their new rates would mean to my wallet. The KW rate went up, the feed in tarrif went up as well but the the daily supply charge went down. In all I worked out an increase of only $20pa.

If you need some help send me a PM.

Regards Phill.

Also there a a tech head site called Whirlpool than can be very useful.

PS. Do not go for the real cheap systems but find a combination of panel and inverter that provides longevity / quality and suits your budget. Getting a good honest installer is a plus. There are sites where different installers are rated and reviewed.

P.S. The days of power companies paying big money for the feed in tariff are over. Some received up to 60c per kw but that was subsidised by the rest of us. It is now closer to 6.5 cents and the state government sets the minimun.

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think positive Libra

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Joined: 30 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:40 pm
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luvdids wrote:
Geez! My Mum's got solar panels & I'm pretty sure she hasn't even HAD a bill since she got them. They only thing she's got from the power company is a couple cheques for the power she's supplied to them!

Have you been cleaning the panels? That can make a difference to the amount of power generated, got to get the bird droppings & dust off them pretty regularly.


They are New! Did you see the old bill? This is the quarter we get the biggest bill due the pool! How long ago did your mum get it? She probably has the good deal for power put into the grid, you don't get that be you get 5 cents!
Also How many people live in the house?

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think positive Libra

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Joined: 30 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:45 pm
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Member 7167 wrote:
Hi TP

I have solar. I have a 4 kw system that uses individual Enphase micro-inverters on each panel as opposed to having a single larger string converter. (It produces about 5400 kw per year.) The micro-inverters were used because of shading and in this environment the output is better. That said it is a more expensive option. Don't worry about which retailer you are with just do the conversion and get a quote from your current provider. You can then shop it around or use a service like Electricity Wizard to get the best deal.

There is a site called PV Output that many people in Australia and overseas upload their info into. It will give you real information of how different size system with varying inverters and panels operate in your suburb.

The other thing you need to do is down load your consumption from the electricity wholesaler. This gives you enough information to assist in calculating what is the best quotation to take up. Peak / Off Peak etc from various retailers.

I used this information to compare the last twelve months actual figures Peak, Off Peak and Solar Feed In to calculate what their new rates would mean to my wallet. The KW rate went up, the feed in tarrif went up as well but the the daily supply charge went down. In all I worked out an increase of only $20pa.

If you need some help send me a PM.

Regards Phill.

Also there a a tech head site called Whirlpool than can be very useful.

PS. Do not go for the real cheap systems but find a combination of panel and inverter that provides longevity / quality and suits your budget. Getting a good honest installer is a plus. There are sites where different installers are rated and reviewed.

P.S. The days of power companies paying big money for the feed in tariff are over. Some received up to 60c per kw but that was subsidised by the rest of us. It is now closer to 6.5 cents and the state government sets the minimun.


Cheers yeah we get 5 cents was about $60! Yeah I didn't get the cheap panels or controller, went mid range. I will pm you when I get home. I'm
More than happy with the savings we have got (there is 4-6 adults here a lot of evenings sometimes 4 pcs or tvs going! Plus the pool pumps) but I intend to chase down a deal for gas and electricity together if possible (we have solar hot water too)

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Last edited by think positive on Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:59 pm; edited 1 time in total
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luvdids Sagittarius



Joined: 22 Mar 2008
Location: work

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 4:50 pm
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think positive wrote:
luvdids wrote:
Geez! My Mum's got solar panels & I'm pretty sure she hasn't even HAD a bill since she got them. They only thing she's got from the power company is a couple cheques for the power she's supplied to them!

Have you been cleaning the panels? That can make a difference to the amount of power generated, got to get the bird droppings & dust off them pretty regularly.


They are New! Did you see the old bill? This is the quarter we get the biggest bill due the pool! How long ago did your mum get it? She probably has the good deal for power put into the grid, you don't get that be you get 5 cents!
Also How many people live in the house?


I don't really understand what you're getting at telling me they're new?? If you're talking about them being cleaned - you got them say mid last year? They'd need a wipe over.

Mum got hers probably a year/year & half ago - not exactly sure. Not sure again what you mean by "you don't get that be you get 5 cents!"

There's 2 living in the house. Spa on regularly, 2 fridges, dryer, lights are always on (Rolling Eyes), as is tv. Occasionally add another 3 grandkids.
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think positive Libra

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Joined: 30 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 5:09 pm
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Hubby checked them about three months ago after a storm dislodged a tile they are fine
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Member 7167 Leo

"What Good Fortune For Governments That The People Do Not Think" - Adolf Hitler.


Joined: 18 Dec 2008
Location: The Collibran Hideout

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 6:34 pm
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I must admit TP that I did not notice the date of your initial post. Join PV PVoutput. It is free or you can get all the bells and shistles for a donation for as little as $10. My system on PV output is Trina~Enpahse McKinnon. For no other reason being on PV output gives you the ability to compare your system and it can highlight issues with your system a lot easier than otherwise.
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think positive Libra

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 6:51 pm
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Thanks mate I'll do that cheers 😎👍
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Culprit Cancer



Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne

PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 5:39 am
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The Vic State Government has increased the rebate back to consumers and the LNP is up set as they want Power from Clean Coal (Who say's we can't polish a turd)? The more people running solar the more renewable energy is pumped back into the grid. The LNP hate that as their mates who they sold the power companies off too are losing money. The Governments of Australia need to be pushing Solar Energy all the way.
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Skids Cancer

Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.


Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175

PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 10:49 am
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Solar energy is great, but, don't be sucked in to the "It's great for the environment" spin.

How do you think solar panels are made? What minerals need to be mined for their production? How much energy is used in the mining of these minerals, how much waste is there?

Plenty!

Solar panels glimmering in the sun are an icon of all that is green. But while generating electricity through photovoltaics is indeed better for the environment than burning fossil fuels, several incidents have linked the manufacture of these shining symbols of environmental virtue to a trail of chemical pollution. And it turns out that the time it takes to compensate for the energy used and the greenhouse gases emitted in photovoltaic panel production varies substantially by technology and geography.

Manufacturing has moved from Europe, Japan, and the United States to China, Malaysia, the Philippines, and Taiwan; today nearly half the world’s photovoltaics are manufactured in China. As a result, although the overall track record for the industry is good, the countries that produce the most photovoltaics today typically do the worst job of protecting the environment and their workers.

While solar energy can be generated using a variety of technologies, the vast majority of solar cells today start as quartz, the most common form of silica (silicon dioxide), which is refined into elemental silicon. There’s the first problem: The quartz is extracted from mines, putting the miners at risk of one of civilization’s oldest occupational hazards, the lung disease silicosis.

The initial refining turns quartz into metallurgical-grade silicon, a substance used mostly to harden steel and other metals. That happens in giant furnaces, and keeping them hot takes a lot of energy

. The refinement process involves combining hydrochloric acid with metallurgical-grade silicon to turn it into what are called trichlorosilanes. The trichlorosilanes then react with added hydrogen, producing polysilicon along with liquid silicon tetrachloride—three or four tons of silicon tetrachloride for every ton of polysilicon.

The reporters found that the company was dumping silicon tetrachloride waste on neighboring fields instead of investing in equipment that could reprocess it, rendering those fields useless for growing crops and inflaming the eyes and throats of nearby residents. And the article suggested that the company was not alone in this practice.

These steps all involve hazardous chemicals. For example, manufacturers rely on hydrofluoric acid to clean the wafers, remove damage that comes from sawing, and texture the surface to better collect light. Hydrofluoric acid works great for all these things, but when it touches an unprotected person, this highly corrosive liquid can destroy tissue and decalcify bones. So handling hydrofluoric acid requires extreme care, and it must be disposed of properly.

Toxicity isn’t the only concern. Making solar cells requires a lot of energy. Fortunately, because these cells generate electricity, they pay back the original investment of energy; most do so after just two years of operation, and some companies report payback times as short as six months. This “energy payback” time is not the same as the time needed to recoup a consumers financial investment in solar panels; it measures investments and payback times in terms of kilowatt-hours, not in terms of money.

http://spectrum.ieee.org/green-tech/solar/solar-energy-isnt-always-as-green-as-you-think

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stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 7:57 pm
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^

Similar argument works for bio diesel made from canola and many other things.

To get an accurate assessment of the "green" ROI, you need to take into account the environment cost to produce these things, not just the cost in using them.

And in response to Culprit above, if I ever go for the solar option, I won't be putting the excess back into the grid, I'll be going batteries with the intent of going off the grid as much as possible.

The ideal would be a place on a decent block with a combination of solar and wind into batteries with a generator as backup.

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think positive Libra

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 8:15 pm
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/\ we all want to do that, but right now the battery option is too expensive to justify, I made sure the system I picked can be swapped out for batteries fairly easily.
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