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David 
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| King Monkey wrote: | | Did the threat of the stick ever deter you and/or your siblings from playing up?? |
I can't think of specific examples, but I'm sure it did. Fear is an effective motivator. Long-term consequences may not be so pretty, though.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| King Monkey wrote: | Did the threat of the stick ever deter you and/or your siblings from playing up??
I must admit, I've smacked my kids. Never used weapons though, and never with enough force to cause physical damage.
When the message isn't getting through using other means, sometimes a bit of a hard lesson and/or a shock tactic is required. Then the threat of a little sting is always there when there is a choice to do the right or wrong thing.
It has worked for us, I haven't had to actually give the 9 year old a tap for at least 5 years. He knows his boundaries. He's a good kid.
What has worked well for us, is certainly not a one-size-fits-all policy. I'm only saying it has worked for us.
I'm so proud of my eldest boy the way he's carrying himself at the moment.
I was so chuffed at the compliments we were getting from our mates about what a well-behaved, respectful, helpful boy he is; on the camping trip we just got back from. Joined in with a fair bit of the adult activities, and maintained a respectful cheekiness! 
He's got some little sh** friends that do the wrong things all the time, (poor kids, they've got sh** parents actually), but he's a bit of leader with his right-from-wrong attitude.
I'm quite worried for the future actually, really scared about the prevalence of things like Ice and the growing number of "gangs" and the like.
Consequences for actions is a lesson that needs to be taught at a young age. I'm disturbed when I see a kid walk all over their parents. They're the ones that won't listen when they're sat down and told - this, that and the other are dangerous and to stay away. |
This is my view 100%
And I also get great feedback about my kids behaviou, always have.
There is a big difference between a smack to get the message across when a stern talking, or trying logic (haha, on a four year old I know!) and just belting through laziness, or the fun of it. It shouldn't be all or nothing. A tap on the bum never did anyone any harm. And it's quicker, and less painless than sticking a kid on the naughty chair whilst others have fun. And more effective!
I know a lot of parents resorted to iron cords, and sticks and things, mine never did, but my dad our full force in his fist. My mum only smacked us, and not often. I guess when the teachers could still give you the strap at school, (not me I was the daggy nerd!) then it was the norm for parents to follow suit.
I'm sure there was parents who pulled out a stick, while still having a healthy family respect, it's when there is a massive in balance of power, when mum or dad as the case may be, is overruled, or just as afraid. I have too many friends who remember mum saying, quick your father is coming, clean it up, be quite, go to your room. And it wasn't because dad would come in and do like my hubby does "on your iPad again?" "Why aren't you studying" blah blah blah!
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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King Monkey
Joined: 15 Apr 2009
Location: On a journey to seek the scriptures of enlightenment....
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There is respectful fear of the consequences of being caught doing the wrong thing.
And there is fear of someone because they're a violent cu**.
Both completely different.
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"I am a great sage, equal of heaven.
Grow stick, grow.
Fly cloud, fly.
Oh you are a dee-mon, I love to fiiight." |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| King Monkey wrote: | There is respectful fear of the consequences of being caught doing the wrong thing.
And there is fear of someone because they're a violent cu**.
Both completely different. |
Yep
And the mental abuse, agony that goes with it is just as bad. I'm not sure you ever really get over it.
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| King Monkey wrote: | There is respectful fear of the consequences of being caught doing the wrong thing.
And there is fear of someone because they're a violent cu**.
Both completely different. |
I don't think things are so black and white. A lot of parents who go overboard with corporal punishment are responding to kids who've "done the wrong thing". That doesn't mean that kind of punishment can't be abusive, but it also doesn't necessarily make them violent c#%s either. As with everything in life, there are grey areas.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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We brought our kids up without smacking because we both felt that is not the way we wanted our kids raised.
I can understand why parents smack but I still think at the end of the day it's about anger for one reason or another. Violence was not needed.
We've been lucky, both girls in their 20's & really can't complain. Both hard working & good people
The girls have a pretty open relationship with us more particularly with their mother.
With respect to drugs:
Both drink a bit when they go out with friends although both work too hard to write themselves off. The oldest too for about the last 12 moths does't drink much at all - she was doing a boot camp & was getting "high" doing that.
The youngest said to us when she was in yr 11 - I'm not going to ask if you tried drugs when you were younger I'm just assuming you did. She said she tried marijuana but did not like it. Friends of hers used Ketamine for a while - now she's into boutique beers etc.
The youngest has always had a pretty good circle; of friends. The oldest did when she got older!!
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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Bumping this thread to respond to this post in another:
| K wrote: | A bit off topic: I'm looking at this Fortnite streaming video [imbedded in the article below] that captured an altercation between a gamer and his wife. It's really only audio. You don't see him slapping his wife, though you hear a lot.
https://www.theage.com.au/national/nsw/partner-of-fortnite-gamer-applies-to-change-avo-conditions-20181213-p50lyg.html
Police charged him. He lost his Telstra job. I'm wondering what you think about that, David? I guess you think Telstra should butt out. [Oh, I see it says "suspended", not "sacked". 'Telstra general manager media Steve Carey said the alleged assault "goes against what we stand for as an organisation..." ']
The media have gone to town. Pictures of him in bed trying to avoid them... |
I have a few thoughts about this. The first is that the video (which is very hard to watch, or, more accurately, listen to) is quite unusual in that domestic violence is generally such a hidden phenomenon we see statistics about it, read stories about it, sometimes see the results in terms of injuries, but only very rarely actually witness what it's like in the moment. So, for such a widespread crime, this is a rare public recording. That's a good thing, generally, because it's harder to downplay a crime when people are forced to deal with the ugly reality. It also means that this guy will, fairly or otherwise, become a figure of hate for a large section of the population, including people who might themselves be far from paragons of virtue. While that might be understandable, I don't think it's helpful.
I agree with the police charge. A serious crime has been committed and needs to be dealt with by the law. It is interesting but not overly surprising that his partner has written a letter asking for the AVO to be withdrawn as we know, domestic violence is a hugely complex phenomenon and victims often don't feel able (or even, in some cases, don't particularly want) to leave their partners. We had an interesting thread about that here a couple of years ago: http://magpies.net/nick/bb/viewtopic.php?p=1742331
I don't agree with Telstra suspending or sacking him, though, because ultimately it shouldn't be their jurisdiction (unless his behaviour suggests a credible threat to other staff or customers, and I highly doubt that that's the case). Beyond any other considerations of defendants' and workers' rights both of which are extremely relevant let's not forget that his family, including his victim, may well be depending on his earnings and may be inadvertently punished further by his employer's decision. But the company will be very eager to wash their hands of him, and unfortunately that has become both the norm and the expectation in this society.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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It is an interesting video as it also contains the oft used "provoked" excuse. That was some A grade nagging, and she continued doing it after he'd seemingly already hit her twice.
OK, he shouldn't have hit her, not acceptable. But should he have just done what he was told and got off the game? She's his partner not his mother, why should he stop playing just because she says so?
He tells her repeatedly to leave him alone, she refuses and continues to harass him, he seemingly slaps her, she keeps going, he does it again, she keeps going, he then seemingly hits her several time. I stopped watching then.
It certainly doesn't seem like the stereotypical case of violent serial abuser and frightened partner, scared to say anything. You had 2 strong willed people wanting their own way and it ended in violence as neither would conceed.
In regard to Telstra, they've suspended him which would be with pay, not sacked him, so the argument about penalising his family doesn't fly. He's been charged with assault, his employer has suspended him until (I assume) the court hands down a finding. If found guilty, then they would take action which may include sacking him.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| What happened to 2 strong willed people wanting their own way and it ended in violence as neither would conceed. |
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Wokko 
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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Toxic relationship with reciprocal violence (apparently she threw something at him first) and only he gets charged.
If the roles were reversed and he was demanding she stop gaming and threw a box at her then she hit him we'd be hearing about a brave woman defending herself from an abusive and violent boyfriend.
He's a violent c* , she's a violent c* but only he faces consequences, both legal, losing his job and public humiliation. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| Wokko wrote: | | Toxic relationship with reciprocal violence (apparently she threw something at him first) and only he gets charged. |
Where did you read that, Wokko? Even if true, it makes a big difference what it was if it was a ceramic plate or a brick, then, yeah, you have a mutual violence situation, but if it was a tissue box, then, maybe not? What's clear (if the audio is an accurate representation, as it seems to be) is that he did hit her in the face several times. Of course there may have been other violent incidents in their relationship that we don't know about, but this incident seemed pretty one-sided to me.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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^
What about her behaviour?
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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All I could make out was that she was nagging him (to come to the dinner table, or some such). That can be irritating, but it's not criminal and certainly not any kind of excuse for violence.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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swoop42 
Whatcha gonna do when he comes for you?
Joined: 02 Aug 2008
Location: The 18
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He's prone to violence and a douche. She's happy with a meal ticket and popping out more babies.
You see these types of dysfunctional relationships all the time in the area I live and my guess is they both deserve each other.
Plenty of gentle and kind men in the world if she wants one and in a wealthy country like Australia numerous support services available to women if they wish to leave.
Alas I doubt she will and the cycle of arguing and f**king with this man will continue.
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He's mad. He's bad. He's MaynHARD! |
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