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RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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| Post subject: A tall order |  |
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Now that Buck's patience with White's inability to hold marks has finally run out and he's been dropped, the pressure will soon turn on Witts, who has been slow to impact games, either up forward or around the ground.
In a couple of weeks however, the pressure on our talls will only increase with the return of Cloke and hopefully a rejuvenated Reid. If we decide to play Cloke, Reid and Moore up forward, then there's clearly no spot for Witts. The only problem with this line-up is that neither Cloke, Reid or Moore are likely to be able to assist Grundy in the ruck. More importantly, Cloke would be the only one with the physique possibly suited to helping out in the ruck. So the question is, at this late stage of his career, is Cloke capable of evolving into a forward and part-time ruckman to assist Grundy? If not, then we may need to keep Witts in the side and leave out one or both of Reid and Moore. Somehow I can't see that happening. So basically I'm confused as to which way we should go.  |
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jackcass 
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Bendigo
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| I'd have thought Moore more suited to it than either Cloke or Reid. |
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Dave The Man 
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia
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| jackcass wrote: | | I'd have thought Moore more suited to it than either Cloke or Reid. |
Reid is at least 3 years away from even thinking of playing any time in the Ruck.
Though you Hope Grundy and Witts would be holding down the Ruck at that time and taking some marks
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Pies2016
Joined: 12 Sep 2014
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Im not convinced its over for White just yet. He was still averaging near two goals a game and giving away assists every week before he got dropped. He is probably our best " five mins in the ruck '' player we have after grundy and Witts.
I just feel that White has been sent a message by being dropped to the VFL this week. I reckon he will be back soon enough just as average as ever but still worthy of a game in our team as it stands.
My preference is Grundy in ruck with Cloke as a roaming half forward target and Moore and White coming in behind the space he has created. ( at the MCG )
As for Reid, I now find it easier to put a line through his name until he is finally selected in the seniors once again. I know he played forward last week in VFL but I still think the club would rather him play in the backline in the perfect selection world |
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yin-YANG
Joined: 03 Oct 2011
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I raised this briefly in the pre-game thread and you are right Rudeboy it is an issue that none of our other talls can give the ruck a chop out.
Reid, Cloke, Moore, Frost, Marsh and Brown are just not suited to rucking and WHite is not going to be carried when we get CLoke and eventually Reid back.
The extended bench might help having both rucks- but I think we need to be a bit more creative with our use of our two rucks. I would like to see one cover the forward zone/half and the other the middle and back. Grundy needs to be a kick or so behind play when the ball is in the forward one for example and leave the rucking duties to Witts. They will build their tanks and their marking abilities so as poor as they both are as forwards and in their around the ground role they will both improve. They are already good rucks - not great but that will come too.
So play both - Witts or Grundy rotating through the forward zone will demand a tall -- which will stretch any back line trying to cope with even two of Moore, Cloke and Reid - never mind all three. Besides the ruck duo the rest are great athletes and could run up and down and then use their height to advantage if put on a smaller type!
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inxs88
Joined: 17 Aug 2014
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bottom line we are bound to have a injury/suspension in our big man dept which makes the discussion a moot point!
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E
Joined: 05 May 2010
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White is a much better player with cloke in the game because his opponent has to help out on cloke which gives him room to work. White also cant be the spot up forward since he cant mark the ball and has no idea where the fall of the ball is.
what I mean to say is - now can we appreciate what Cloke brings to the table just a little bit please.
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Bob Sugar
Joined: 11 Feb 2010
Location: Benalla
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We have a decision to make with white, we all know he isn't up to being a consistant forward, pretty sure he's on good coin and has 2 years to run on his contract, IMO we need to play him as a defender at VFL level for the remainder of the season, who knows he could end up being good at it, he certainly has the tools.
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| Yep, could bolster that VFL defence nicely. |
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dalyc
Joined: 02 Mar 2005
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| yin-YANG wrote: | I raised this briefly in the pre-game thread and you are right Rudeboy it is an issue that none of our other talls can give the ruck a chop out.
Reid, Cloke, Moore, Frost, Marsh and Brown are just not suited to rucking and WHite is not going to be carried when we get CLoke and eventually Reid back.
The extended bench might help having both rucks- but I think we need to be a bit more creative with our use of our two rucks. I would like to see one cover the forward zone/half and the other the middle and back. Grundy needs to be a kick or so behind play when the ball is in the forward one for example and leave the rucking duties to Witts. They will build their tanks and their marking abilities so as poor as they both are as forwards and in their around the ground role they will both improve. They are already good rucks - not great but that will come too.
So play both - Witts or Grundy rotating through the forward zone will demand a tall -- which will stretch any back line trying to cope with even two of Moore, Cloke and Reid - never mind all three. Besides the ruck duo the rest are great athletes and could run up and down and then use their height to advantage if put on a smaller type! |
Gault can chop out ruck
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Four legged animals good, two legged animals better |
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jackcass
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Bendigo
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| Dave The Man wrote: | | jackcass wrote: | | I'd have thought Moore more suited to it than either Cloke or Reid. |
Reid is at least 3 years away from even thinking of playing any time in the Ruck.
Though you Hope Grundy and Witts would be holding down the Ruck at that time and taking some marks |
I assume you mean Moore but regardless, Cloke and Reid coming off soft tissue leg injuries and won't be risked in the ruck, hence in the scenario suggested Moore becomes the most suitable option. Didn't say he was ready or that we should do it, just that he's the best option if neither Witts or White play as some suggest. |
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jackcass
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Bendigo
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| Pies2016 wrote: | Im not convinced its over for White just yet. He was still averaging near two goals a game and giving away assists every week before he got dropped. He is probably our best " five mins in the ruck '' player we have after grundy and Witts.
I just feel that White has been sent a message by being dropped to the VFL this week. I reckon he will be back soon enough just as average as ever but still worthy of a game in our team as it stands.
My preference is Grundy in ruck with Cloke as a roaming half forward target and Moore and White coming in behind the space he has created. ( at the MCG )
As for Reid, I now find it easier to put a line through his name until he is finally selected in the seniors once again. I know he played forward last week in VFL but I still think the club would rather him play in the backline in the perfect selection world |
Think White will be back soon enough to annoy the shoit out of the haters. |
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Lutts
Joined: 29 Oct 2007
Location: Launceston
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| Defender wrote: | | We have a decision to make with white, we all know he isn't up to being a consistant forward, pretty sure he's on good coin and has 2 years to run on his contract, IMO we need to play him as a defender at VFL level for the remainder of the season, who knows he could end up being good at it, he certainly has the tools. |
I like this idea. He is a big unit, strong and attacks the ball. He just doesn't know where the ball is going to be. Let the opposition forward take him to the ball. He competes well in the air, just doesn't pull down enough marks. But in the backline, just as long as he doesn't let the opposition mark then I would be happy with that. Then Reid can play forward, but swing into the backline if White is needed to give the ruck a chop out.
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RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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| Lutts wrote: | | Defender wrote: | | We have a decision to make with white, we all know he isn't up to being a consistant forward, pretty sure he's on good coin and has 2 years to run on his contract, IMO we need to play him as a defender at VFL level for the remainder of the season, who knows he could end up being good at it, he certainly has the tools. |
I like this idea. He is a big unit, strong and attacks the ball. He just doesn't know where the ball is going to be. Let the opposition forward take him to the ball. He competes well in the air, just doesn't pull down enough marks. But in the backline, just as long as he doesn't let the opposition mark then I would be happy with that. Then Reid can play forward, but swing into the backline if White is needed to give the ruck a chop out. |
Problem is there's no room for him in defence with Brown, Frost as well as Langdon playing so well. That's why Reid will be played up forward when/if he returns, because we don't need another tall in defence. |
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