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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| swoop42 wrote: | | Redlight wrote: | | swoop42 wrote: | Probably good fortune rather than good management he played well today and thank God he did as he was our only shining light.
Bucks played Moore in defence at the start of the VFL season when we were crying out for a key forward prospect (and no those few weeks wouldn't have made diddly squat of difference to his performance today), played him as a defender in the AFL last time around after debuting him as a forward the round before and wasn't initially selected this week.
If Cloke and Reid weren't injured who knows if he'd be still toiling away in defence in the VFL when we needed him developed forward.
Thank God he kicked 5 today so we'll see sanity prevail and he'll be played forward where most good judges thought a player with his talent always belonged.
Injury aside he's going to be a gun in a couple of seasons. |
I'm sure that there's benefit in a young forward going back to get an understanding of how defensive players think and set up. If you know what a defender is likely to do then you'll be a more effective forward. |
That's one way of thinking but in reality I can't think of many truly great forwards starting in defence.
Moore has the potential to be a great forward so unless he proves he can't be let him learn his craft as one.
He's our most talented key forward prospect since Cloke IMO but has more of the natural flair Tarrant possessed.
I think he has a better mentality than the latter though which should hold him in good stead.
Rather Moore going forward than million dollar Boyd. |
His own father started as a CHB. |
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jackcass 
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Bendigo
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| Jezza wrote: | | King Monkey wrote: | | Dave The Man wrote: | Moore’s Free when he Kicked the 4th Goal. That was happening earlier in the Game and he got nothing  |
Dave, I was going off my head about that!!
Pay it early and the defender has to stop doing it. |
Same here and the same thing happened to Jesse White as well in the first half on certain occasions. |
Pretty soft free, could equally have been paid to the Doggies forwards on a couple of occasions. |
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jackcass
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Bendigo
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| Tannin wrote: | | swoop42 wrote: | Bucks played Moore in defence at the start of the VFL season when we were crying out for a key forward prospect (and no those few weeks wouldn't have made diddly squat of difference to his performance today), played him as a defender in the AFL last time around after debuting him as a forward the round before and wasn't initially selected this week.
If Cloke and Reid weren't injured who knows if he'd be still toiling away in defence in the VFL when we needed him developed forward. |
All good forwards should spend some quality time in defence, just as defenders should spend time playing as forwards. You learn stuff about the game playing at the "wrong" end of the ground that is very useful to you when you go back to your rightful spot.
As an example, in cricket I always reckon I learned how to bowl by batting. Every time I nicked one or got trapped LBW, there was a good lesson in how to do it to the other bastard next time I got a bowl. (Very fast way to learn: with my batting skils, on average, I got a valuable lesson about once an over!  )
But seriously, playing a forward down back for a solid half-season or so can be an excellent aid to his development. Anthony Rocca was nothing special till he played CHB for half a season and got to see the game from the other side. Mick Malthouse knew what he was doing when he played Daisy as a HBF to teach him accountability. And so on.
Oh, and there is a bonus. If you play your forwards back as part of their development, you just might find that you have someone handy to swing back and cover an injury when you need to. Normally you wouldn't do this with your best marking forward (which is what we hope Moore will turn out to be) but it never hurts to have the option up your sleeve. |
Exactly! I've heard your batting was ordinary! No... I mean playing Moore back has in no way harmed his longer term development and in fact has likely enhanced it. Just because people don't like something doesn't make it wrong. |
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jackcass
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Bendigo
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| swoop42 wrote: | | Redlight wrote: | | swoop42 wrote: | Probably good fortune rather than good management he played well today and thank God he did as he was our only shining light.
Bucks played Moore in defence at the start of the VFL season when we were crying out for a key forward prospect (and no those few weeks wouldn't have made diddly squat of difference to his performance today), played him as a defender in the AFL last time around after debuting him as a forward the round before and wasn't initially selected this week.
If Cloke and Reid weren't injured who knows if he'd be still toiling away in defence in the VFL when we needed him developed forward.
Thank God he kicked 5 today so we'll see sanity prevail and he'll be played forward where most good judges thought a player with his talent always belonged.
Injury aside he's going to be a gun in a couple of seasons. |
I'm sure that there's benefit in a young forward going back to get an understanding of how defensive players think and set up. If you know what a defender is likely to do then you'll be a more effective forward. |
That's one way of thinking but in reality I can't think of many truly great forwards starting in defence.
Moore has the potential to be a great forward so unless he proves he can't be let him learn his craft as one.
He's our most talented key forward prospect since Cloke IMO but has more of the natural flair Tarrant possessed.
I think he has a better mentality than the latter though which should hold him in good stead.
Rather Moore going forward than million dollar Boyd. |
And you were on hand to see every reserves game of these apparent great forwards? Just how is he less developed by playing a few weeks in defense? I used to respect your posts but you're fast becoming a bit of a drama queen, looking for smoking guns on grassy knolls. |
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jackcass
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Bendigo
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| Better game than his debut, doubled his possessions from 4 to 9. Kicking straight actually inflates his efforts. Most pleasing aspect was the 2x solid marks and conversions and the athleticism shown to get to the Fasolo marking contest, gather the crumb and run into the open goal. Should get a run for the remainder of the season on the back of that and we'll likely see some steady improvement. |
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Dave The Man 
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia
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| jackcass wrote: | | Better game than his debut, doubled his possessions from 4 to 9. Kicking straight actually inflates his efforts. Most pleasing aspect was the 2x solid marks and conversions and the athleticism shown to get to the Fasolo marking contest, gather the crumb and run into the open goal. Should get a run for the remainder of the season on the back of that and we'll likely see some steady improvement. |
Well Kicking Straight means he has a Big Impact without having Tons of Shot. Which you have to do for Cloke to Kick 5 Goals. Moore would probably need 8 most to Kick5 where Cloke would need 10+ to kick 5.
His Athleticism is Amazing for a 199-200cm player
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I am Da Man |
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E
Joined: 05 May 2010
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| swoop42 wrote: | Probably good fortune rather than good management he played well today and thank God he did as he was our only shining light.
Bucks played Moore in defence at the start of the VFL season when we were crying out for a key forward prospect (and no those few weeks wouldn't have made diddly squat of difference to his performance today), played him as a defender in the AFL last time around after debuting him as a forward the round before and wasn't initially selected this week.
If Cloke and Reid weren't injured who knows if he'd be still toiling away in defence in the VFL when we needed him developed forward.
Thank God he kicked 5 today so we'll see sanity prevail and he'll be played forward where most good judges thought a player with his talent always belonged.
Injury aside he's going to be a gun in a couple of seasons. |
What makes you think that playing Moore in defense in the two means he wasn't being groomed as a forward. You guys all think you know everything about everything. the judgmental nature of this email cracks me up.
_________________
Ohhh, the Premiership's a cakewalk ....... |
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E
Joined: 05 May 2010
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| Pies4shaw wrote: | | swoop42 wrote: | | Redlight wrote: | | swoop42 wrote: | Probably good fortune rather than good management he played well today and thank God he did as he was our only shining light.
Bucks played Moore in defence at the start of the VFL season when we were crying out for a key forward prospect (and no those few weeks wouldn't have made diddly squat of difference to his performance today), played him as a defender in the AFL last time around after debuting him as a forward the round before and wasn't initially selected this week.
If Cloke and Reid weren't injured who knows if he'd be still toiling away in defence in the VFL when we needed him developed forward.
Thank God he kicked 5 today so we'll see sanity prevail and he'll be played forward where most good judges thought a player with his talent always belonged.
Injury aside he's going to be a gun in a couple of seasons. |
I'm sure that there's benefit in a young forward going back to get an understanding of how defensive players think and set up. If you know what a defender is likely to do then you'll be a more effective forward. |
That's one way of thinking but in reality I can't think of many truly great forwards starting in defence.
Moore has the potential to be a great forward so unless he proves he can't be let him learn his craft as one.
He's our most talented key forward prospect since Cloke IMO but has more of the natural flair Tarrant possessed.
I think he has a better mentality than the latter though which should hold him in good stead.
Rather Moore going forward than million dollar Boyd. |
His own father started as a CHB. |
ouch!!!
_________________
Ohhh, the Premiership's a cakewalk ....... |
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Dave The Man
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia
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jackcass
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Bendigo
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| Dave The Man wrote: | | jackcass wrote: | | Better game than his debut, doubled his possessions from 4 to 9. Kicking straight actually inflates his efforts. Most pleasing aspect was the 2x solid marks and conversions and the athleticism shown to get to the Fasolo marking contest, gather the crumb and run into the open goal. Should get a run for the remainder of the season on the back of that and we'll likely see some steady improvement. |
Well Kicking Straight means he has a Big Impact without having Tons of Shot. Which you have to do for Cloke to Kick 5 Goals. Moore would probably need 8 most to Kick5 where Cloke would need 10+ to kick 5.
His Athleticism is Amazing for a 199-200cm player |
Lets not get too carried away Dave. Cloke has 10 years of performances in the bank and is an aerobic competitive marking beast. Moore still has a long way to go to even get close to that level.
And let's also not forget that Talia, Morris and Wood aren't exactly the greatest KPDs in the league and that Moore only had to deal with 1 of them at a time.
I don't think anyone thinks we're a better side with Moore in instead of Cloke. |
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35forever
"I feel sick - dada dada dada da"
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Location: Physical=Sunshine Coast -- Mental=Vic Park
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Bloody short memories around here! It was only a month or so ago that Cloke kicked 7 goals straight, followed by 5.2 the next week. 12.2 is a damn good fortnight! Of course they were our last two wins.
The next 4 weeks Cloke kicked a total of 1 goal 4 behinds (and several oof and dmd ((didn’t make distance))).
So the Full Forward kicked one, single goal in 4 full games. No wonder we couldn’t manage a win! In that last quarter against Hawthorn we were 9 points up and attacking, but we'd missed so many shots by then, we should've been so far ahead, but we were missing the courage, the heart, the determination, and most of all the skills to close the game.
As I keep saying, ad frikkin nauseam, it’s the KICKING! Get Ryan Lonie back to the club to teach our players how to kick a football.
To excuse our worst performance since 2005 as a part of 'rebuilding' is a joke. We should be third on the ladder, instead we're 11th, all because of our kicking. We could easily have won every one of the last 5 games. We were 9 points down with 9 to go against West Coast, and attacking for ages. Then, after we missed shot after shot, they went forward once, and kicked a coast-to-coaster. Mentally you could see the players drop their heads. We may as well have left the field as Wet Toast went on to rack up a 31 point win like we were never in it.
After that game, like every other game, most of the idiots here, and we have no shortage, decided it was because of this or that player, who is obviously a dud. We don't have any duds! (okay Clinton Young has been disappointing). But Fasolo has had his best season in years, so has Blair, but as soon as we lose they're often the culprits.
But none of those guys are the problem. You all KNOW who the problem is, but half of you just won't accept it. We have the side to have been a genuine contender for the flag. Had we kicked two goals more in each game, especially the first two, Freo and Hawthorn, we would have been the hot side, the real deal! Go watch the Hawks game again, I'll send you a tape if you can't find it! It was very clear who the better side was, and Hawthorn weren't having a bad day, they played as well as I've ever seen, at least as well as in last years GF, but we were BETTER. Don't blame it on the kids, I saw Pendles, Swan, and Sidey miss shots they'd normally drill. On Sunday, when Pendles stepped around 5 guys like they weren't there and ran it to the 45, it looked like he was going to kick one of those amazing captains goals like he's done so many times - like the one that finished Geelong a few years ago after Fasolo got the 50m penalty and put us in front.
This side is mentally weak, WHO is responsible for that???
WHO?
_________________
"If at first you dont succeed...
... oh who cares, we did it!!!!!"
-me, 2010
"The pies are going to the big dance!"-P.Daicos 2010
Visit My Website! |
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35forever
"I feel sick - dada dada dada da"
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Location: Physical=Sunshine Coast -- Mental=Vic Park
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dp
_________________
"If at first you dont succeed...
... oh who cares, we did it!!!!!"
-me, 2010
"The pies are going to the big dance!"-P.Daicos 2010
Visit My Website!
Last edited by 35forever on Mon Jul 27, 2015 3:55 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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jackcass
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Bendigo
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| Dave The Man wrote: | | http://www.3aw.com.au/news/matthew-richardson-says-darcy-moore-can-be-a-champion-of-the-game-20150727-gil9vp.html |
I think we all think he can be a very good footballer Dave but Matthew Richardson's opinion hardly makes it any more or less likely. |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| 35forever wrote: | Bloody short memories around here! It was only a month or so ago that Cloke kicked 7 goals straight, followed by 5.2 the next week. 12.2 is a damn good fortnight! Of course they were our last two wins.
The next 4 weeks Cloke kicked a total of 1 goal 4 behinds (and several oof and dmd ((didn’t make distance))).
So the Full Forward kicked one, single goal in 4 full games. No wonder we couldn’t manage a win! In that last quarter against Hawthorn we were 9 points up and attacking, but we'd missed so many shots by then, we should've been so far ahead, but we were missing the courage, the heart, the determination, and most of all the skills to close the game.
As I keep saying, ad frikkin nauseam, it’s the KICKING! Get Ryan Lonie back to the club to teach our players how to kick a football.
To excuse our worst performance since 2005 as a part of 'rebuilding' is a joke. We should be third on the ladder, instead we're 11th, all because of our kicking. We could easily have won every one of the last 5 games. We were 9 points down with 9 to go against West Coast, and attacking for ages. Then, after we missed shot after shot, they went forward once, and kicked a coast-to-coaster. Mentally you could see the players drop their heads. We may as well have left the field as Wet Toast went on to rack up a 31 point win like we were never in it.
After that game, like every other game, most of the idiots here, and we have no shortage, decided it was because of this or that player, who is obviously a dud. We don't have any duds! (okay Clinton Young has been disappointing). But Fasolo has had his best season in years, so has Blair, but as soon as we lose they're often the culprits.
But none of those guys are the problem. You all KNOW who the problem is, but half of you just won't accept it. We have the side to have been a genuine contender for the flag. Had we kicked two goals more in each game, especially the first two, Freo and Hawthorn, we would have been the hot side, the real deal! Go watch the Hawks game again, I'll send you a tape if you can't find it! It was very clear who the better side was, and Hawthorn weren't having a bad day, they played as well as I've ever seen, at least as well as in last years GF, but we were BETTER. Don't blame it on the kids, I saw Pendles, Swan, and Sidey miss shots they'd normally drill. On Sunday, when Pendles stepped around 5 guys like they weren't there and ran it to the 45, it looked like he was going to kick one of those amazing captains goals like he's done so many times - like the one that finished Geelong a few years ago after Fasolo got the 50m penalty and put us in front.
This side is mentally weak, WHO is responsible for that???
WHO? |
Yeah okay, This is true. |
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jackcass
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Bendigo
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| 35forever wrote: | Bloody short memories around here! It was only a month or so ago that Cloke kicked 7 goals straight, followed by 5.2 the next week. 12.2 is a damn good fortnight! Of course they were our last two wins.
The next 4 weeks Cloke kicked a total of 1 goal 4 behinds (and several oof and dmd ((didn’t make distance))).
So the Full Forward kicked one, single goal in 4 full games. No wonder we couldn’t manage a win! In that last quarter against Hawthorn we were 9 points up and attacking, but we'd missed so many shots by then, we should've been so far ahead, but we were missing the courage, the heart, the determination, and most of all the skills to close the game.
As I keep saying, ad frikkin nauseam, it’s the KICKING! Get Ryan Lonie back to the club to teach our players how to kick a football.
To excuse our worst performance since 2005 as a part of 'rebuilding' is a joke. We should be third on the ladder, instead we're 11th, all because of our kicking. We could easily have won every one of the last 5 games. We were 9 points down with 9 to go against West Coast, and attacking for ages. Then, after we missed shot after shot, they went forward once, and kicked a coast-to-coaster. Mentally you could see the players drop their heads. We may as well have left the field as Wet Toast went on to rack up a 31 point win like we were never in it.
After that game, like every other game, most of the idiots here, and we have no shortage, decided it was because of this or that player, who is obviously a dud. We don't have any duds! (okay Clinton Young has been disappointing). But Fasolo has had his best season in years, so has Blair, but as soon as we lose they're often the culprits.
But none of those guys are the problem. You all KNOW who the problem is, but half of you just won't accept it. We have the side to have been a genuine contender for the flag. Had we kicked two goals more in each game, especially the first two, Freo and Hawthorn, we would have been the hot side, the real deal! Go watch the Hawks game again, I'll send you a tape if you can't find it! It was very clear who the better side was, and Hawthorn weren't having a bad day, they played as well as I've ever seen, at least as well as in last years GF, but we were BETTER. Don't blame it on the kids, I saw Pendles, Swan, and Sidey miss shots they'd normally drill. On Sunday, when Pendles stepped around 5 guys like they weren't there and ran it to the 45, it looked like he was going to kick one of those amazing captains goals like he's done so many times - like the one that finished Geelong a few years ago after Fasolo got the 50m penalty and put us in front.
This side is mentally weak, WHO is responsible for that???
WHO? |
So just out of interest... why do you think we're struggling at the moment? |
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