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David 
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| Post subject: Wonderful news from Ireland |  |
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The world's first referendum on same-sex marriage is being decided comprehensively in favour of the 'yes' vote, in one of the world's most traditionally conservative Christian countries.
http://www.theguardian.com/global/live/2015/may/23/counting-underway-for-irelands-referendum-on-marriage-equality
This is great news for the people of Ireland, but also a wake-up call to our two major parties—with the UK, most of the US, Canada, New Zealand and Ireland voting in favour, we're now the only developed English-speaking country that hasn't legalised marriage equality. Hopefully, by whatever means—whether it be the Liberal party room authorising a conscience vote or Labor winning the next election—that won't be the case for much longer.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Wokko 
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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| Such a non issue, but it makes the tumblr, twitter and Facebook slacktivists happy. Government getting out of the marriage business all together would be my preference. |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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It's not a non-issue for the people it affects. I can see how it seems like a small thing in isolation, but look at it in the wider context: this finally closes the door on generations of discrimination by removing the last barrier to the recognition of same-sex relationships. I think it's something to celebrate wherever it happens.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Morrigu 
Joined: 11 Aug 2001
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It is a MASSIVE leap forward - 3 aunts 68, 72, 76 and 2 uncles in their sixties voted yes  and as good Mics indoctrinated into the world of the head fairy at the bottom of the garden knows all and purgatory and hell and homosexuality is a sin -this change of attitude is fantastic!!
My aunt who rang me tonight to wish me safe travel and just quietly I think to tell me me how she and her mob voted was well pleased - " ah so now it is thee who lives in a backward country" - that's a bit embarrassing as it is now true 
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Dave The Man 
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia
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I can’t see the Problem of people of the same sex getting Married
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I am Da Man |
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Tannin
Can't remember
Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania
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Agree with Wokko. It's only an issue to the extent that people still think that marriage is (a) meaningful and (b) something the state has any damn business interfering in in the first place. Nevertheless, it is still a big step out of the dark ages for Ireland, so good on 'em.
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�Let's eat Grandma.� Commas save lives! |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| Dave The Man wrote: | | I can’t see the Problem of people of the same sex getting Married |
Neither, it seems, do most Irish people. 
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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pietillidie
Joined: 07 Jan 2005
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That's progress, for sure. David, if you do a search for some work on international bigotry by I think John Mangan at the Uni of Queensland, IIRC homophobic bigotry was higher in traditional Catholic countries, including Ireland (but don't quote me as it was a while ago). It would be interesting to see if there has been a noticeable turnaround and to explore why. As an unresearched guess, the GFC will have played a role. Generational change, combined with an economic trigger, can work wonders for countries.
(Which of course is why fighting extremist Islamic groups without eliminating the authoritarian oil economy is a complete farce  )
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In the end the rain comes down, washes clean the streets of a blue sky town.
Help Nick's: http://www.magpies.net/nick/bb/fundraising.htm |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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This is what a lot of people have been talking about in the wake of this vote, PTID—how unbelievably conservative Ireland was, right up until the early to mid-'90s when divorce was still illegal and homosexuality was a crime punishable by law. Even today, a woman cannot have an abortion unless her life is in danger. But this is a big step forward, and a real sign that the church is losing its grip on the country.
For anyone who's interested, the final vote was 62% for to 38% against. One can imagine that a referendum here in Australia would lead to an even more decisive result, but our PM seems to be unwilling to even acknowledge the people's will let alone do anything about it.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Wokko
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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| David wrote: | This is what a lot of people have been talking about in the wake of this vote, PTID—how unbelievably conservative Ireland was, right up until the early to mid-'90s when divorce was still illegal and homosexuality was a crime punishable by law. Even today, a woman cannot have an abortion unless her life is in danger. But this is a big step forward, and a real sign that the church is losing its grip on the country.
For anyone who's interested, the final vote was 62% for to 38% against. One can imagine that a referendum here in Australia would lead to an even more decisive result, but our PM seems to be unwilling to even acknowledge the people's will let alone do anything about it. |
Much like the last two PMs. |
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Skids 
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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| David wrote: |
For anyone who's interested, the final vote was 62% for to 38% against. One can imagine that a referendum here in Australia would lead to an even more decisive result, but our PM seems to be unwilling to even acknowledge the people's will let alone do anything about it. |
I think there's much more important things to spend $70 million on.
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Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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pietillidie
Joined: 07 Jan 2005
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| Skids wrote: | | David wrote: |
For anyone who's interested, the final vote was 62% for to 38% against. One can imagine that a referendum here in Australia would lead to an even more decisive result, but our PM seems to be unwilling to even acknowledge the people's will let alone do anything about it. |
I think there's much more important things to spend $70 million on. |
Unfortunately, that's an illogical dismissal. Name one thing that isn't a less important social good to spend money on than, say, saving a dying child's life?
Okay, so if as every other human being you accept a broad allocation of capital to social good that does not observe a strict hierarchy of priorities because you view betterment as a relative concept that ranges from, say, reducing cruelty to animals to saving dying children, why are you pretending to hold a different view in this instance?
Once you've come clean to yourself on that, then do yourself a favour and look through the broad allocation to social good and tell us how 70M spent on this particular bit of social progress compares to the capital expended on other major pieces of legislation, or on this particular percentage of folk and their kin vis-a-vis similar percentages of folk and their kin, in the area of legislative equality. Feel free to go back to the 1800s just in case you miss the legislative changes that you have long benefited from that others pushed through in your stead despite folk like your good self offering the very same sort of nonsense arguments against such progress back then.
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In the end the rain comes down, washes clean the streets of a blue sky town.
Help Nick's: http://www.magpies.net/nick/bb/fundraising.htm
Last edited by pietillidie on Sun May 24, 2015 12:24 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| I always feel completely free. |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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It is interesting that a country as conservative and religious as ireland got this up so easily.
I'm willing to bet that the reason why they had the referendum was that no politician was prepared to legislated for it and risk the backlash from the churches. By doing it this way all the "blame" rests with the voters.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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I just don't see the point in a referendum, should be something as simple as rubber stamp, done and dusted.... do we really need to send everyone to the polling booths for something, that quite frankly, most people couldn't give a toss about? (I passed a survey to 38 people at our BBQ lunch at work, 3 options to gay marriage; yes, no, who cares. Every single person ticked "who cares") $70 Million is also a pretty conservative estimate, the 1999, should we be a republic one, cost was $66 million.
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Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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