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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| They're not as bad as Greeks with cars in the CBD. |
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Culprit 
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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| Pies4shaw wrote: | | They're not as bad as Greeks with cars in the CBD. |
What about our Sheep? Baaaaaaaaa |
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Pies4shaw
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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Now you're just being racist - my comment was "evidence-based": more deliberate killings by Greeks in cars in the CBD than by Islamic terrorists in the whole history of our city. How much clearer does it need to be before you people take the threat seriously? I bet you think souvlakis are OK because they're not halal!  |
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Culprit
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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It's OK it's lamb.  |
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Member 7167
"What Good Fortune For Governments That The People Do Not Think" - Adolf Hitler.
Joined: 18 Dec 2008
Location: The Collibran Hideout
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David 
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| Skids wrote: | So people voicing their concern is the cause of these atracks?
Your logic is like that of a piss weak parent appeasing a naughty child..... give them what they want to stop them misbehaving.
This arguement, along with the, refugees have no link to terrorism and all the other leftists insane excuses are wearing mighty thin.
I'm sorry David, but you and all the other snowflakes are in for a rude shock. I don't know how many more attacks or how many more deaths there have to be before the left finally admit to their terrible mistakes.
Again, Poland - NO refugees - NO terrorism..... HELLO! |
Wait, I'm talking about violent attacks against Muslims here the same ones that you more or less shrugged off in the previous post as people just being fed up. I'm saying anti-Muslim rhetoric makes those attacks more likely.
As for the left making terrible mistakes, don't forget that the world is currently trying and mostly failing to clean up the mess caused by all the conservatives who thought invading Iraq was a good idea and cheered on that disastrous conflict. That war created ISIS, whose success have acted as a flashpoint for the recent wave of terror attacks.
The far-right may be xenophobic and opportunistic, but their defining trait is their inability to understand history.
http://www.magpies.net/nick/bb/viewtopic.php?p=49004
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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Ummmm David 9/11 was 3 years before the Iraq invasion.
What about Poland... nobody seems to want to acknowkedge that NO refugees = NO terrorism 
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Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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The War on Iraq and 9/11 were part of a chain of events going back decades. The important point, of course, is that the Iraq War was not in any sense a relevant, useful or necessary response to those attacks it was an unprovoked attack that destabilised the country and region for a decade and counting. While Al-Qaeda were operating before and after, their attacks on the West were petering out by the end of the last decade. Then the Syrian civil war happened, jihadists found a new flashpoint to rally around, and a fairly minor player in that war named Islamic State became a new focal point by invading a weakened Iraq and declaring a caliphate something that most analysts agree would never have happened if the US hadn't disbanded Saddam's army. And that's when the terror attacks in the West started happening again.
One thing I really wish people would understand the amateur Koran-quoters most of all is that terrorism comes and goes in waves.
Why is it that the IRA stopped bombing England? What happened to militant leftists like the Baader-Meinhof group? Does anyone even remember today that there was a radical Jewish group in the US committing terrorist acts in the 1980s?
The IRA didn't get what they want, and neither were they defeated in any meaningful sense. Northern Ireland is still under the sovereignty of the UK. With the neoliberal order dominating the continent, European far-leftists would seem to have far more reason to engage in extremist violence now, but they don't. The Jewish Defence League are still in existence, but haven't committed a terrorist attack in years.
My theory is that radical political violence needs something unified to rally around. When that goes whether it's the result of external cultural change, or the loss of charismatic leaders, or group divisions, or a loss of faith in the cause and its ability to achieve its aims the terrorism stops too. This is what happened with Al-Qaeda, and I suspect it's what will happen with ISIS after they are defeated in Iraq and Syria. There may be other successful international jihadist groups in future, or there may not. What seems certain to me is that we are in the middle of a wave and that it will pass.
But the far-right politicians and their supporters who want everyone to believe that the West is at war with Islam, not Islamist jihadism, play into the hands of the ISIS narrative. By giving that group credibility, they ensure this wave will take a little longer to end, and by doing so they endanger us all.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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https://www.thenews.com.pk/latest/207047-Religious-scholars-issue-unanimous-fatwa-declaring-suicide-attacks-Haram
| Quote: | ISLAMABAD: Religious scholars from all schools of thought on Saturday issued a fatwa (religious decree) that declared suicide attacks, armed insurgency against a state and use of force in the name of imposing Shariah as Haram or forbidden in Islam.
The fatwa carrying signatures of 31 noted scholars was released at a seminar 'Reconstruction of Pakistani society in the light of 'Mithaq-e-Madina' (Charter of Madina) and announcement of 'Paigham-e-Pakistan' (Message of Pakistan). The event was organised by the Islamic Research Institute of the International Islamic University Islamabad.
The unanimous declaration was presented by Professor Masoom Yasinzai while Mufti Rafi Usmani read out the fatwa. The religious edict condemned terrorism and extremism and declared suicide attackers and their supporters as traitors. It also declared Jihad a jurisdiction of Islamic state and disallowed use of force in name of enforcement of Islamic laws. |
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| Skids wrote: |
What about Poland... nobody seems to want to acknowkedge that NO refugees = NO terrorism |
Yes, Skids, you present a further point of clear (and blindingly obvious) evidence that terrorism is strongly correlated with Islamic immigration ...and the silence is deafening. This idea that controlling your borders to keep out further mass immigration from Islamic countries is a "war on Islam" tells you how corrupted and deranged our language and thinking has become. As though a sovereign people has no right to determine, on the basis of its interests, who it admits to its house ; and if It does, it is an act of war !
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Two more flags before I die! |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| David wrote: | https://www.thenews.com.pk/latest/207047-Religious-scholars-issue-unanimous-fatwa-declaring-suicide-attacks-Haram
| Quote: | ISLAMABAD: Religious scholars from all schools of thought on Saturday issued a fatwa (religious decree) that declared suicide attacks, armed insurgency against a state and use of force in the name of imposing Shariah as Haram or forbidden in Islam.
The fatwa carrying signatures of 31 noted scholars was released at a seminar 'Reconstruction of Pakistani society in the light of 'Mithaq-e-Madina' (Charter of Madina) and announcement of 'Paigham-e-Pakistan' (Message of Pakistan). The event was organised by the Islamic Research Institute of the International Islamic University Islamabad.
The unanimous declaration was presented by Professor Masoom Yasinzai while Mufti Rafi Usmani read out the fatwa. The religious edict condemned terrorism and extremism and declared suicide attackers and their supporters as traitors. It also declared Jihad a jurisdiction of Islamic state and disallowed use of force in name of enforcement of Islamic laws. |
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It is good to see though I have no idea how much authority this group has in the mosh pit of Islamic clerisy. Having complained about this in the past, I was also pleased to see that there seemed to be unanimity among British mosques and religious leaders that the three murderers last week will be denied Islamic burial. Again, I have no idea how effective it is given the diffuse nature of Islamic authority, but it was good to see this statement. Credit where due.
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Two more flags before I die! |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| Again, Would you like to have an idea? |
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Wokko 
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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Don't criticize Islam because it will turn Muslims towards terrorism which has nothing to do with Islam.
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| David wrote: | The War on Iraq and 9/11 were part of a chain of events going back decades. The important point, of course, is that the Iraq War was not in any sense a relevant, useful or necessary response to those attacks it was an unprovoked attack that destabilised the country and region for a decade and counting. While Al-Qaeda were operating before and after, their attacks on the West were petering out by the end of the last decade. Then the Syrian civil war happened, jihadists found a new flashpoint to rally around, and a fairly minor player in that war named Islamic State became a new focal point by invading a weakened Iraq and declaring a caliphate something that most analysts agree would never have happened if the US hadn't disbanded Saddam's army. And that's when the terror attacks in the West started happening again.
One thing I really wish people would understand the amateur Koran-quoters most of all is that terrorism comes and goes in waves.
Why is it that the IRA stopped bombing England? What happened to militant leftists like the Baader-Meinhof group? Does anyone even remember today that there was a radical Jewish group in the US committing terrorist acts in the 1980s?
The IRA didn't get what they want, and neither were they defeated in any meaningful sense. Northern Ireland is still under the sovereignty of the UK. With the neoliberal order dominating the continent, European far-leftists would seem to have far more reason to engage in extremist violence now, but they don't. The Jewish Defence League are still in existence, but haven't committed a terrorist attack in years.
My theory is that radical political violence needs something unified to rally around. When that goes whether it's the result of external cultural change, or the loss of charismatic leaders, or group divisions, or a loss of faith in the cause and its ability to achieve its aims the terrorism stops too. This is what happened with Al-Qaeda, and I suspect it's what will happen with ISIS after they are defeated in Iraq and Syria. There may be other successful international jihadist groups in future, or there may not. What seems certain to me is that we are in the middle of a wave and that it will pass.
But the far-right politicians and their supporters who want everyone to believe that the West is at war with Islam, not Islamist jihadism, play into the hands of the ISIS narrative. By giving that group credibility, they ensure this wave will take a little longer to end, and by doing so they endanger us all. |
David, you have tried this "it will pass" line before, on the basis that the IRA and BaaderMeinhof both passed. Militant Islam is nothing like those two movements, in its aims, its history, its geographic scale, methods, religious nature and its sheer complexity. It really is rather unique. So if it seems certain to you that it will pass, I'd say your sense of "certainty" is numinous indeed. Even if it does pass, of course, there may well be hundreds of thousands of innocent lives lost.
As for "amateur" Koran quoters, I presume that's a term for someone who quotes what the Koran actually says. So when evidence is produced and quoted perfectly correctly, it's "amateur". Right.
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Two more flags before I die! |
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