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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| Well, to actual human beings, they do. |
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Skids 
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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Topic title is spot on.
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Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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David 
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| Wokko wrote: | | Those on the right who are for free speech (Libertarians/Anarcho-Capitalists) are for free speech without reservation and those against it (Nationalists/Neo-Conservatives) are not against 'free speech' per se but have hang ups about patriotism/security in much the same way as the liberal left and their 'hate speech'. |
So, you've listed four different kinds of right-wingers with varying views of freedom of speech but continue to sweep everyone else into a homogenous group called "the left". Can you at least acknowledge that there's a range of differing opinions held by anarchists, left-liberals, left-libertarians, social democrats, environmentalists, Trotskyite socialists and old school Stalinists, and that views on freedom of expression and censorship vary accordingly?
Ayn Rand didn't invent freedom of speech, you know. It's a right that's been fought for by disadvantaged groups, progressives, reformers and socialists for centuries against right-wing authoritarianism, a fight that's continued today by mostly left-wing groups like the ACLU in America and progressive civil libertarians here and elsewhere. Seeing it as a purely right-wing concern is fantastical thinking.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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Jezza 
2023 PREMIERS!
Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End
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| watt price tully wrote: | Personally, I think that people who believe that Halal leads to sharia leads to funding terrorists should be jailed; not for their views but for their ignorance in holding those views in the first place!!(alarmist nonsense) We need to expose such stupidity
At the same time, religious extremism & killers, that is conspicuous in the form of fundamentalist Islam needs to be monitored & surveilled. That is quite a right & proper thing to do. |
I'm not sure if you're serious or not but if you are then no they shouldn't be jailed. Because you think their opinions are 'stupid' does not give you any right or encourage others to jail people for such opinions. The best way to disagree with these people is to form your own opinions and justify why your viewpoint is correct in contrast to them.
Your spot on with your second point about fundamentalist Islam needing to be monitored and surveilled.
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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| Jezza wrote: | | watt price tully wrote: | Personally, I think that people who believe that Halal leads to sharia leads to funding terrorists should be jailed; not for their views but for their ignorance in holding those views in the first place!!(alarmist nonsense) We need to expose such stupidity
At the same time, religious extremism & killers, that is conspicuous in the form of fundamentalist Islam needs to be monitored & surveilled. That is quite a right & proper thing to do. |
I'm not sure if you're serious or not but if you are then no they shouldn't be jailed. Because you think their opinions are 'stupid' does not give you any right or encourage others to jail people for such opinions. The best way to disagree with these people is to form your own opinions and justify why your viewpoint is correct in contrast to them.
Your spot on with your second point about fundamentalist Islam needing to be monitored and surveilled. |
Right, you're next. jail now. 
Nah, just frustration at such obvious stupidity such as Obama is a secret Muslim coz I saw it on youtube. Same shit different day.
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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Jezza
2023 PREMIERS!
Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End
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| watt price tully wrote: | | Jezza wrote: | | watt price tully wrote: | Personally, I think that people who believe that Halal leads to sharia leads to funding terrorists should be jailed; not for their views but for their ignorance in holding those views in the first place!!(alarmist nonsense) We need to expose such stupidity
At the same time, religious extremism & killers, that is conspicuous in the form of fundamentalist Islam needs to be monitored & surveilled. That is quite a right & proper thing to do. |
I'm not sure if you're serious or not but if you are then no they shouldn't be jailed. Because you think their opinions are 'stupid' does not give you any right or encourage others to jail people for such opinions. The best way to disagree with these people is to form your own opinions and justify why your viewpoint is correct in contrast to them.
Your spot on with your second point about fundamentalist Islam needing to be monitored and surveilled. |
Right, you're next. jail now.
Nah, just frustration at such obvious stupidity such as Obama is a secret Muslim coz I saw it on youtube. Same shit different day. |
LOL hopefully the sentence isn't lengthy 
Thanks for clarifying mate.
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watt price tully
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| Skids wrote: | | Topic title is spot on. |
Nah Skids, it applies to both sides if you want to split things into the left & right. It would be far truer to say that some elements of the left & some elements of the right would like to ban free speech. When you face such sweeping generalizations like the title then you know it to be wrong. That should be pretty self evident.
It's like saying all religious people are nutters when we know that actually not all are 
Mind you I did try to become a right wing moral majority Southern Baptist once till I realized they didn't hold under long enough
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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pietillidie
Joined: 07 Jan 2005
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Fringe posturing all 'round, surely?
Once again, of course, the Muslim family down the road wears the only serious insult concerned.
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In the end the rain comes down, washes clean the streets of a blue sky town.
Help Nick's: http://www.magpies.net/nick/bb/fundraising.htm |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| watt price tully wrote: | | Jezza wrote: | | watt price tully wrote: | Personally, I think that people who believe that Halal leads to sharia leads to funding terrorists should be jailed; not for their views but for their ignorance in holding those views in the first place!!(alarmist nonsense) We need to expose such stupidity
At the same time, religious extremism & killers, that is conspicuous in the form of fundamentalist Islam needs to be monitored & surveilled. That is quite a right & proper thing to do. |
I'm not sure if you're serious or not but if you are then no they shouldn't be jailed. Because you think their opinions are 'stupid' does not give you any right or encourage others to jail people for such opinions. The best way to disagree with these people is to form your own opinions and justify why your viewpoint is correct in contrast to them.
Your spot on with your second point about fundamentalist Islam needing to be monitored and surveilled. |
Right, you're next. jail now.
Nah, just frustration at such obvious stupidity such as Obama is a secret Muslim coz I saw it on youtube. Same shit different day. |
You're right about the stupidity, there's actually a growing intolerance that I'm finding disturbing. Comments that I see and hear from people (usually young) who I don't consider to be stupid or racist, yet the disparaging remarks about muslims and/or Asians are both.
Actions like these "counter protests" are actually counter productive yet the zealous petals who participate are utterly oblivious to their own hypocrisy.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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How and when do you think we should respond to that ignorance, then? Because as far as I can tell, these sentiments are only growing, and if the debates on here are indicative of anything, people have no interest in listening to reason.
If you don't support counter-protests, what else do you suggest? How can we show the "Reclaim Australia" protestors that they don't speak for us, and how do we show Australian Muslims that they're not on their own?
As much as I share your displeasure with some of the tactics used by protestors on the weekend, I would imagine that many Muslims took heart from seeing non-Muslim Australians stand up for them.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace
Last edited by David on Tue Apr 07, 2015 2:41 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| Thanks for the information. They do their own thing. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| David wrote: | How and when do you think we should respond to that ignorance, then? Because as far as I can tell, these sentiments are only growing, and if the debates on here are indicative of anything, people have no interest in listening to reason.
If you don't support counter-protests, what else do you suggest? How can we show the "Reclaim Australia" protestors that they don't speak for us, and how do we show Australian Muslims that they're not on their own?
As much as I share your displeasure with some of the tactics used by protestors on the weekend, I would imagine that many Muslims took heart from seeing non-Muslim Australians stand up for them. |
People have interest in listening to reason, they no interest in having views shoved down their throat. I'd argue that while your motives are good in defending the average muslim person, the manner you often do it is what elicits the kind of response that you really don't want.
" How can we show the "Reclaim Australia" protestors that they don't speak for us"? Good question. Do you need to? How do I show the Occupy protestors they didn't speak for me? The G20 protestors??
Leaving aside for a minute my observation of the counter protest being designed deliberately to disrupt, there are plenty of positive things that can be done.
Firstly, my suggestion is stay away from the reclaim Australia mob if they want to rally, don't give their cause oxygen or publicity. If you want to show muslims that those nutters aren't the majority, stage a positive rally rather than a protest one. March in support of something instead of against something, make it a positive event on a separate day.
I doubt very much that many muslims took anything positive from the events, the overly combatative and overzealous counter protesters were much more interested in seems in picking a blue with the reclaim australia nuffies than in sending out any positive message.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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watt price tully
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| David wrote: | | How and when do you think we should respond to that ignorance, then?.... |
1. Re-education camps;
2. Disenfranchisement - if you're that thick then you lose the privilege to vote;
3. Get Port Arthur back to it's original purpose & translocate;
4. Be locked up with Miranda Divine reading you lullabies for the term of your natural life;
5. Be forced to eat Gina Rineharts iron ore; and,
6. Go to a vegan restaurant with Clive Palmer
Not that hard really.
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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Dave The Man
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia
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Lucky I did not go up that way after the VFL Game on Saturday
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I am Da Man |
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