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3.14159 
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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| Post subject: How do the Kurd's fit into the battle against ISIS? |  |
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There was a great story on last nights 4 corners about the Kurdish fighters battling ISIS.
Apparently Daesh troops run from women because "if" they are killed by a female they don't get the 72 virgins they were promised, instead they get a "one way ticket to Hell"!
Off course this flies in the face of the notion that Islam is a religion that dismisses the rights of women and proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that all Muslims are not extreme fundamentalists.
"They run when they see us coming" (Kurdish woman commander).
""They fight better than men, they have no fear and very well trained".
For those of you that want to be better informed about what is going on in the disputed areas I recommend you watch this!
http://iview.abc.net.au/programs/four-corners/NC1504H013S00
Last edited by 3.14159 on Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:44 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Jezza
2023 PREMIERS!
Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End
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It's a great story if it's true and I do admire the Kurdish women fighting ISIS and its allies in Syria and Iraq. The Kurdish forces have always been strong and staunch fighters hence there's a level of confidence that they can starve off the latest threat as the Battle of Kobane showed a few months back.
However there's been conflicting sides to this story from what I can gather. There's this claim that ISIS fighters are afraid of being killed by Kurdish women because it supposedly means they'll go to "hell" however this has been disputed at various stages by various sources saying that this isn't entirely accurate. At the present time I'm still not sure what to make of it to be honest.
http://www.vox.com/cards/isis-myths-iraq/isis-female-soldiers
Nevertheless thanks for linking the story.
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5150 
Joined: 31 Aug 2005
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Now just Skyhooks - woman in uniform running through my head...
I'm sure if Shirl was still around he'd be able to rhyme something with Kurdish women, ISIS chicken shits and 72 virgins. |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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No great news about the women fighting against ISIS, that's been happening for a while.
Dunno about the claim they're running away because if they get killed by a woman they won't get their virgins, more likely they're running because:
A) they're weak pr1cks
2) Facing trained women with weapons is a fair fight which doesn't appeal to their innate sense of superiority
iii) It's all bushit and they aren't actually running away, they're just being beaten by a better fighting force.
Photo article on women fighting ISIS http://edition.cnn.com/2015/03/12/world/cnnphotos-female-peshmerga-fighters/
Here's an article from October last year that covers the same ground as the ABC http://rt.com/news/193972-kurdish-women-fighters-isis/
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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3.14159
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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| stui magpie wrote: | No great news about the women fighting against ISIS, that's been happening for a while.
Dunno about the claim they're running away because if they get killed by a woman they won't get their virgins. |
No arguing that ISIS fighters aren't as courageous as they like to make out
(how much guts does it take to execute a bound and helpless captive in the back with an AK 45)
If you skip to around the 37 minute mark 2 captured ISIS fighters say exactly what it means to be killed by a woman!
BTW.
Iran, Syria, Yemen and Jordan are all joining the growing band of Islamic countries actively countering the threat of Radical Fundamentalism in the Middle-East.
This is the only way to truly defeat organisations like ISIS the Taliban and Al Qaeda!
Me I'd like to open a dialogue than constantly hurl brick-bats at everything Islamic! |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| 3.14159 wrote: | | stui magpie wrote: | No great news about the women fighting against ISIS, that's been happening for a while.
Dunno about the claim they're running away because if they get killed by a woman they won't get their virgins. |
No arguing that ISIS fighters aren't as courageous as they like to make out
(how much guts does it take to execute a bound and helpless captive in the back with an AK 45)
If you skip to around the 37 minute mark 2 captured ISIS fighters say exactly what it means to be killed by a woman!
BTW.
Iran, Syria, Yemen and Jordan are all joining the growing band of Islamic countries actively countering the threat of Radical Fundamentalism in the Middle-East.
This is the only way to truly defeat organisations like ISIS the Taliban and Al Qaeda!
Me I'd like to open a dialogue than constantly hurl brick-bats at everything Islamic! |
This countries all have more moderate Islamic populations and if ISIS gets control, they will be treated the same as anyone else who isn't as farked in the head as they are, Muslim or not they get the treatment.
So yeah, good to see them standing up against a group of extreme numbats who would kill them. What's unknown is where on the continuum between Western society and ISIS do they sit. Hopefully somewhere that can enable us all to live together without conflict.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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3.14159
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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| stui magpie wrote: | | So yeah, good to see them standing up against a group of extreme numbats who would kill them. What's unknown is where on the continuum between Western society and ISIS do they sit. Hopefully somewhere that can enable us all to live together without conflict. |
Amen to that.
Kurds are largest people with-out a country in the world.
They have been fighting for the right to exist as a sovereign state since before Saddam Hussain came to power.
Their traditional homeland included parts of northern Iraq, Western Syria and southern Turkey.
What they are currently fighting for is exactly what they have been fighting for since the end of the first world war, the right to an autonomous homeland.
The French and the British carved up the Ottoman Empire it left the Kurds a nation with-out a home.
The suffering they endured under the regime of Sadistic Hussain was terrible and relentless, remember the mustard gas attacks and the attempted genocide of entire Kurkish cities they aided the US led coalition into Iraq in both Desert Storm and that other one 10 or so years ago.
Despite the fine work done by the Kurds in their battle against ISIS and the former dictator they are stihl left a nation with-out a homeland and on the Terrorist list.
They are on the Terrorist because Turkey, a US ally holds fairly large tracts of the Kurdish homeland and the Turkish army are fighting to retain it.
A year ago when the battle of Kurbain was at it's height Turkish tanks sat on the sidelines and did nothing.
Syria hates them because the Kurds claim a small part of that country as well. Iraq claims their lands because it has oil in it.
The Kurds only want small portions of land from each of these countries to build themselves a nation.
They do NOT want ISIS fighters (particularly foreign idiots) coming in and trying to take it from them
We've owe these people the right to a homeland ever since it was first carved up along lines that took little account of the peoples that actually lived there!
The danger of not honouring our debt to them is another Gaza, Left bank or another Lebanon.
These people have earned the right to govern themselves and not be listed as a terrorist organist organisation!
P.S They treat their women with a decency uncommon in the Middle East.
Their social development can only grow (and perhaps spread through the area that's seen more than it's troubles.
Hell give it to them to spite the Sunnis if you like but for heavens sake, we should give them a chance to give it a go! |
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Jezza
2023 PREMIERS!
Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End
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I think there are compelling and valid reasons for the Kurds to have a state in their own right called 'Kurdistan' and this has been openly advocated for by many people with the late Christopher Hitchens being the most notable advocator for the autonomy of 'Kurdistan'.
Lately there has been suspicions about Turkish involvement in the Syrian conflict as many claim in that part of the world especially by the Kurds themselves that ISIS and Turkey are in an agreement in some shape or form. ISIS' ongoing conflict against the Kurds actually benefits Turkey and there were many reports during the Battle of Kobane that Turkey was openly bombing Kurdish targets and safe havens in the area rather than taking down ISIS. Also this suspicion has been further perpetuated by the relative ease that foreign fighters have gone through to cross the Turkish-Syrian border to fight with groups like ISIS.
Here is a map of their traditional homeland as you describe earlier 3 which may make it clearer for other posters to see what could constitute 'Kurdistan' if they went through a process of self-determination.
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Jezza
2023 PREMIERS!
Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End
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| stui magpie wrote: | | So yeah, good to see them standing up against a group of extreme numbats who would kill them. What's unknown is where on the continuum between Western society and ISIS do they sit. Hopefully somewhere that can enable us all to live together without conflict. |
Great post Stui! Spot on.
The bolded part of your post especially is something that interests me greatly and I'd like to see further dialogue and discussion by more people to understand these different strands of thought.
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David 
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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I think if there was ever a time to set up a Kurdish state, it's now. Just about the only stable region in the whole of Iraq and Syria, with relatively clearly defined borders and the ability to defend themselves. The rest is a basket case.
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| Right now? That is only a hypothetical. |
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3.14159
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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Thanks for watching the clip and taking the time to do your own research Jezza.
I can see why Tannin rates you so highly.
re:the Map I'm not saying the Kurds should have all the land they claim but it's as a good starting point for negations as any
Giving the Kurd's their long over-due independence is the best (and by far the fairest) way to control the area ISIS is currently desecrating.
These people are expert fighters and the last thing they want is fundamental extremists high-jacking their struggle.
The Kurds have a good source of income from the oil beneath the feet an enlightened population with a fervent desire to be taken seriously as a modern democratic state free of the stench of ISIS.
We can take this opportunity (as David said) to right a past wrong and create some stability in an extremely troubled area.
Or we can keep calling them a terrorist organisation and bomb them into submission creating yet more problems or we could sit down and talk seriously about their claims. |
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Jezza
2023 PREMIERS!
Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End
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I agree with you guys! I would welcome these changes in the Middle East if they came to fruition in the near future.
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swoop42 
Whatcha gonna do when he comes for you?
Joined: 02 Aug 2008
Location: The 18
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pietillidie
Joined: 07 Jan 2005
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Remember, folks, more boundary drawing without getting rid of that evil best friend of despots and terrorists alike—the artificial, anti-competitive oil economy—will only result in more problems. Sustainable countries need sustainable economies first and foremost. Aside from obvious geographic features, presumably economics is the central factor in lasting national boundaries.
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