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Stupied
Joined: 14 Mar 2013
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[quote="thompsoc"] | Stupied wrote: | | thompsoc wrote: | B
Keep posting that Hine is poor at the drafting table mate, it just makes you look even more dopey than your God awful grammar and sentence structure does. |
Well MATE you can't see the forest for the trees!
Keep making excuses - you must enjoy being thrashed every year by Hawthorn.
Wow, what have we got at the moment - 1 definite A grader
in Pendles and a few close to A grade.
He has been there for over a decade and doing great according to you!
Meanwhile Wright from Hawthorn ........
PS
"Hine hadn't had" is wonderful grammar...
PS
It is A grader not a grader..
and Fasolo went for pick 45 not 50 etc...etc..
do you want me to go on ... in this trivial nit picking? |
Rubbish. Pendles is A grade, as is Sidebottom (was exceptional last year post suspension), Cloke, and an uninjured Swan. We lost two A graders in Thomas and Beams which was no fault of Hines.
Whine about it all you like, but the reason we aren't the force we were is because of the loss of thousands of games of experience over the last few years due to retirements and trades (some forced, some not). Blaming Hine for his recruitment is simply making him a scapegoat for the state our list is in rather than conceding that we've been hurt by the player departures over the last 3 years.
P.S. It's P.S. not PS.
P.S. "Hine hadn't had" is perfectly fine.
P.S. Whether Fas was 45 or 50, my point still stands, but thanks for the pickup.
P.S. I used a small a in A grader in my first paragraph. The rest were capitals. Clearly an oversight by me, rather than something you needed to inform me of.
P.S. A graders are developed, they are very rarely A grade from the day they were recruited. Beams took 4 years to develop in to an A grader. Maybe you should develop some goddamn patience. |
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thompsoc
Joined: 21 Sep 2009
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[quote="Stupied"] | thompsoc wrote: | | Stupied wrote: | | thompsoc wrote: | B
Keep posting that Hine is poor at the drafting table mate, it just makes you look even more dopey than your God awful grammar and sentence structure does. |
Well MATE you can't see the forest for the trees!
Keep making excuses - you must enjoy being thrashed every year by Hawthorn.
Wow, what have we got at the moment - 1 definite A grader
in Pendles and a few close to A grade.
He has been there for over a decade and doing great according to you!
Meanwhile Wright from Hawthorn ........
PS
"Hine hadn't had" is wonderful grammar...
PS
It is A grader not a grader..
and Fasolo went for pick 45 not 50 etc...etc..
do you want me to go on ... in this trivial nit picking? |
Rubbish. Pendles is A grade, as is Sidebottom (was exceptional last year post suspension), Cloke, and an uninjured Swan. We lost two A graders in Thomas and Beams which was no fault of Hines.
Whine about it all you like, but the reason we aren't the force we were is because of the loss of thousands of games of experience over the last few years due to retirements and trades (some forced, some not). Blaming Hine for his recruitment is simply making him a scapegoat for the state our list is in rather than conceding that we've been hurt by the player departures over the last 3 years.
P.S. It's P.S. not PS.
P.S. "Hine hadn't had" is perfectly fine.
P.S. Whether Fas was 45 or 50, my point still stands, but thanks for the pickup.
P.S. I used a small a in A grader in my first paragraph. The rest were capitals. Clearly an oversight by me, rather than something you needed to inform me of.
P.S. A graders are developed, they are very rarely A grade from the day they were recruited. Beams took 4 years to develop in to an A grader. Maybe you should develop some goddamn patience. |
Who cares about the grammar!!!
I don't!!!!
As for patience .... 2 flags in nearly 60 years is a great strike rate!
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we don't eat our own at collingwood we just allow them to foul our nest. |
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Stupied
Joined: 14 Mar 2013
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| You've got nothing. Debate over. |
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thompsoc
Joined: 21 Sep 2009
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| Stupied wrote: | | You've got nothing. Debate over. |
I have had fun tonight.
Thanks for your contributions.
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we don't eat our own at collingwood we just allow them to foul our nest. |
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qldmagpie67
Joined: 18 Dec 2008
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On fox footy season preview last night Gerald Healy said it was Scharenberg who most excited him. Said he was all class and a top pick.
I've heard Leigh Matthews state before he believed he was a top 3 pick in that draft and was surprised he slipped down.
Look potential is a great thing but we need to see it come to realization along with Moore and others.
True a lot of our younger players have huge upsides and it does take time but we need to start seeing some of this in the guys in the 20-75 game bracket take that next step.
For mine if we can see this potential emerge and keep the likes of Pendles Cloke Reid Sidey healthy and burning for a serious premiership tilt in 2-3yrs then we have the "potential" to enter a long phase of premiership contenders like the hawks currently do |
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thompsoc
Joined: 21 Sep 2009
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We definitely have potential
but we need to translate that into reality.
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we don't eat our own at collingwood we just allow them to foul our nest. |
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skaman 
One step beyond.......
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Townsville via Melbourne
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Just discovered im close mates with Scharenbergs cousin up here in Townsville. Clinton Scharenberg. Top bloke, although this one is a Port supporter. He's keen to see his cuz do well, as we are all hoping. Small world.
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Enjoy yourself. Its later than you think! |
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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| skaman wrote: | | Just discovered im close mates with Scharenbergs cousin up here in Townsville. Clinton Scharenberg. Top bloke, although this one is a Port supporter. He's keen to see his cuz do well, as we are all hoping. Small world. |
Did Clinton Scharenberg not have sexual relations with that woman too?
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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MatthewBoydFanClub
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: Elwood
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| jackcass wrote: | | Pies4shaw wrote: | | thompsoc wrote: | Man, why do we keep getting "we are going to be great tomorrow" threads but somehow we are in free fall for a couple of years now.
Fact is we have a list of potentials and that is it!
As I have said in past threads we have not recruited an A grader since 2008.
Things may change in the next year or two but at the moment we are ordinary! |
Do we know that? It's plain that we recruited Jolly and Ball at the end of 2009, when that was the need. In 2010 and 2011 we had limited opportunities to draft A graders (after trades, our first live picks in the draft in those years were Fasolo at 45 and Paine at 50), although Elliott was taken in a trade for pick 25 and may yet become one. 2 seasons is probably not enough to judge how good (or otherwise) Grundy, Broomhead and Kennedy will be, Langdon aside, our 2013 picks haven't got on the park much, yet and our 2014 picks haven't had a competitive opportunity in a real game. Isn't it fairer to say that we don't know whether we have recruited any A graders recently because they haven't had the opportunity to find their levels to date?
I do understand your concern (I am equally troubled that, although there are good explanations, Scharenberg and Freeman are the only two of the 2013 top 10 who haven't played at senior level) but I don't think that much could have been done differently with the drafting. After the Club took Thomas, Pendlebury, Reid, Brown, Sidebottom and Beams, the 2009 and 2010 years were about getting players for instant success and the jury is still out on the last three drafts. |
Maybe it says more about who was/is coaching than the recruiting staff, and ladder position is generally pretty important.
Yes, Hine has a job to do but ultimately he operates at the behest of the coach.
I agree, we don't know how our recent additions will develop but based on our top 10 picks under Malthouse where 6 of 7 turned out to be players, we can have some high confidence that our more recent top 10s will be players. |
Your point about Hine acting at the behest of the coach is not my understanding of the way the football club operates.
Hine and Buckley might have a cosy relationship, but they operate within separate football departments. Hine as head of list management responds to Neil Balme as his boss. Likewise Buckley answers to Neil Balme.
This came up when MM was having too much influence over recruitment, so around 2004, Eddie restructured the football department, primarily to curb the influence that MM had on the type of players we were recruiting. |
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droversdog65
Joined: 27 Nov 2014
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Thomo and others complaining about long delayed flag gratification you should try witnessing 2 flags in over 60 years - I've lived that nightmare and it's no fun but just for a minute lets put our frenzy for a Pie flag aside and look at the sheer logistics of it.
Firstly there are 17 other clubs seeking exactly the same goal and at least 6 of them have a hefty helping hand from the AFL aside from their normal advantages of having only one other AFL side in their STATE to harness state talent and only sharing their home ground advantage with one other side.
Secondly there is one regional team in Victoria (Geelong) which has NO OTHER sides to share their home ground advantage.
Thirdly playing rules have recently been changed that directly impacted two of our most important stars.
Fourth our injury run over the last three years has been nothing short of catastrophic - yes it needs to be addressed via fitness coach but that has already happened and is no fault of coach or playing group.
Fifth we have had two established stars poached in recent years.
Sixth we have lost major experience in Shaw, Johnno etc., for various reasons.
Seventh - and this is seperate in a way to injury point made earlier - two of our prize recruits have been unavailable due to injury / illness. Now I look as this as seperate because it affects team balance and the game plan going forward - they should be pushing for senior positions already in the normal course of events but they are still to get a crack.
You can rant all you want about injuries being no excuse but the extent of our injury list and the unbelievable duration PLUS the huge impact it has had due to losing stars in Penders / Swan and the severely delayed debuts of young skilled players we had planned to help shift team balance is simply unprecedented in any team I have seen over half a century of supporting the Pies. |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| No I don't think I can do rant all you want about injuries being no excuse but the extent of our injury list and the unbelievable duration PLUS the huge impact it had due to losing stars in Penders Shaw and the delayed debuts of young skilled players we had planned to help shift team balance is unprecedented in a team he or she saw over half a century of supporting the Pies. |
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Bay Pie
Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Location: QLD
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| thompsoc wrote: | | Bay Pie wrote: | | thompsoc wrote: | Man, why do we keep getting "we are going to be great tomorrow" threads but somehow we are in free fall for a couple of years now.
Fact is we have a list of potentials and that is it!
As I have said in past threads we have not recruited an A grader since 2008.
Things may change in the next year or two but at the moment we are ordinary! |
How quickly do you expect a draftee to become an A-grader ?
Elliott drafted/traded for in 2011 is close.
Give the 2012 guys a little more then 2 years to show there wears. |
2008 was a fair time ago ( 7 years ).
The second world war only went for 6 years!
May explain part of our situation, as for Elliot being an A grader - not at the moment. |
2009 traded picks for Jolly & Ball.
2010 traded pick for Krakouer. Nearly won a comp
2011 traded pick for Elliott
2012 give these guys a chance
2013 give these guys a chance
2014 FFS give these guys a chance.
What year should we have developed an A-grader with the picks we used in the National Draft ?
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Go Pies
Last edited by Bay Pie on Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:18 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Bay Pie
Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Location: QLD
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Double post
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Go Pies |
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Lazza
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Bendigo, Victoria, Australia
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| barrybc41 wrote: | | I would prefer to have hope than wallow in despair |
^^^^ THIS ^^^^
Or we could always be a St. Kilda, Bulldogs or Melbourne who havent won a flag for donky's years...  Or a Freo who have won zero flags. 
WHY can't some Collingwood supporters have patience? We won a flag only 4 years ago FFS. We are on the right track unless these white ants derail the bloody thing. Just chill, stay cool and Collingwood WILL have success.. 
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Don't confuse your current path with your final destination. Just because it's dark and stormy now doesn't meant that you aren't headed for glorious sunshine! |
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Brown26
Joined: 14 Sep 2001
Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
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I reckon the 2012 and onwards draftees are looking ok, given they've had 2 years or less to impress... I mean, that De goey - why the hell isn't he in the AFL players top 50!! C'mon guys - if in 2017 we have a HBF of Langdon, Frost, Sharenberg, a centreline of Broomhead, De Goey, Kennedy, and followers of Grundy, Adams, Freeman and Moore at CHF and I reckon we'll say the last 3 years have been VERY good for us. Maybe not premiers in 2015, but give them a couple of years and it's all on! Add book ends of Brown and Cloke, add Sidebottom, Elliot and Williams and I reckon we'll be pretty sweet.
No one will be saying 2012/2013/2014 were not good drafts for us.
If we happen to score another top 10 draftee this year - watch out. It's called dynasty. Is it worth a few poor years - not at the moment, but if we snag a few flags 2017 - 2022, maybe...
- Ben |
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