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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| thompsoc wrote: | Man, why do we keep getting "we are going to be great tomorrow" threads but somehow we are in free fall for a couple of years now.
Fact is we have a list of potentials and that is it!
As I have said in past threads we have not recruited an A grader since 2008.
Things may change in the next year or two but at the moment we are ordinary! |
Do we know that? It's plain that we recruited Jolly and Ball at the end of 2009, when that was the need. In 2010 and 2011 we had limited opportunities to draft A graders (after trades, our first live picks in the draft in those years were Fasolo at 45 and Paine at 50), although Elliott was taken in a trade for pick 25 and may yet become one. 2 seasons is probably not enough to judge how good (or otherwise) Grundy, Broomhead and Kennedy will be, Langdon aside, our 2013 picks haven't got on the park much, yet and our 2014 picks haven't had a competitive opportunity in a real game. Isn't it fairer to say that we don't know whether we have recruited any A graders recently because they haven't had the opportunity to find their levels to date?
I do understand your concern (I am equally troubled that, although there are good explanations, Scharenberg and Freeman are the only two of the 2013 top 10 who haven't played at senior level) but I don't think that much could have been done differently with the drafting. After the Club took Thomas, Pendlebury, Reid, Brown, Sidebottom and Beams, the 2009 and 2010 years were about getting players for instant success and the jury is still out on the last three drafts. |
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thompsoc
Joined: 21 Sep 2009
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Ball and Jolly were A grade mature aged players so it wasn't rocket science picking up these guys.
As I keep saying we have not picked up an A grade draftee or rookie player since beams and sidebottom. The club had picks every year since 2008.
People keep telling me Hine is a genius. Well it ain't playing out well on the scoreboard so far this decade!
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we don't eat our own at collingwood we just allow them to foul our nest. |
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thompsoc
Joined: 21 Sep 2009
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[quote="3rd degree"][quote="thompsoc"] | Bay Pie wrote: |
What's Pearl Harbour got to do with this? |
The Japs are the rest of the comp and they are smashing us!
Capt. Bucks is going down with the USS Arizona.
Battleships were useless in WW2.
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we don't eat our own at collingwood we just allow them to foul our nest. |
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3rd degree 
Joined: 22 Jun 2004
Location: John Wren's tote
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[quote="thompsoc"][quote="3rd degree"] | thompsoc wrote: | | Bay Pie wrote: |
What's Pearl Harbour got to do with this? |
The Japs are the rest of the comp are they are smashing us! |
Emperor Tojo never made it!
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" Ohhh Banksy and out comes the Note Book".
www.facebook/the hybernators |
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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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[quote="3rd degree"][quote="thompsoc"] | 3rd degree wrote: | | thompsoc wrote: | | Bay Pie wrote: |
What's Pearl Harbour got to do with this? |
The Japs are the rest of the comp are they are smashing us! |
Emperor Tojo never made it! |
You mean the Japanese didn't win the war? FFS.
I've got to get off this island.
Who's gunna be the Enola Gay?
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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thompsoc
Joined: 21 Sep 2009
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[quote="3rd degree"][quote="thompsoc"] | 3rd degree wrote: | | thompsoc wrote: | | Bay Pie wrote: |
What's Pearl Harbour got to do with this? |
The Japs are the rest of the comp are they are smashing us! |
Emperor Tojo never made it! |
Very funny - I like that!
_________________
we don't eat our own at collingwood we just allow them to foul our nest. |
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jackcass 
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Bendigo
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| Pies4shaw wrote: | | thompsoc wrote: | Man, why do we keep getting "we are going to be great tomorrow" threads but somehow we are in free fall for a couple of years now.
Fact is we have a list of potentials and that is it!
As I have said in past threads we have not recruited an A grader since 2008.
Things may change in the next year or two but at the moment we are ordinary! |
Do we know that? It's plain that we recruited Jolly and Ball at the end of 2009, when that was the need. In 2010 and 2011 we had limited opportunities to draft A graders (after trades, our first live picks in the draft in those years were Fasolo at 45 and Paine at 50), although Elliott was taken in a trade for pick 25 and may yet become one. 2 seasons is probably not enough to judge how good (or otherwise) Grundy, Broomhead and Kennedy will be, Langdon aside, our 2013 picks haven't got on the park much, yet and our 2014 picks haven't had a competitive opportunity in a real game. Isn't it fairer to say that we don't know whether we have recruited any A graders recently because they haven't had the opportunity to find their levels to date?
I do understand your concern (I am equally troubled that, although there are good explanations, Scharenberg and Freeman are the only two of the 2013 top 10 who haven't played at senior level) but I don't think that much could have been done differently with the drafting. After the Club took Thomas, Pendlebury, Reid, Brown, Sidebottom and Beams, the 2009 and 2010 years were about getting players for instant success and the jury is still out on the last three drafts. |
Maybe it says more about who was/is coaching than the recruiting staff, and ladder position is generally pretty important.
In 12 years (1999-2010 drafts) under Malthouse we had 7 top 10 picks (Fraser, Didak, Egan, Thomas, Pendlebury, Reid, and Brown), the last in 2006. Sidebottom and Cole both at 11. All too frequently 1st round picks were traded away.
In the 4 years under Bucks (2011-2014 drafts) we've already added 4 top 10 picks (Scharenberg, Freeman, Moore, De Goey) and a further 1/2 dozen 1st round picks.
Under MM, we had to fall down the ladder to get those picks although he did inherit the wooden spoon in 99. Apart from the 2014 season, Bucks has been able to trade into 1st round picks.
Yes, Hine has a job to do but ultimately he operates at the behest of the coach.
I agree, we don't know how our recent additions will develop but based on our top 10 picks under Malthouse where 6 of 7 turned out to be players, we can have some high confidence that our more recent top 10s will be players. |
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BazBoy
Joined: 11 Sep 2014
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What i am hoping for is the young group arrived end 2013 and 2014 to be not only future
A grade players for us to add to Grundy ,Witts and Gault and others i,ve missed in time to
compliment the 28 /29 yr old Pendles and 25/26yr old Steele and again other seniors that age bracket / experience
End result is to have a 6 to 8 yr "Cats style" era with 3 flags
Fullness of time will reveal it ????
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I'm not arguing--just explaining why i am right |
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Dave The Man
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Someville, Victoria, Australia
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What about Darcy?
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I am Da Man |
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BazBoy
Joined: 11 Sep 2014
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He is in the "ones i missed" and yes Darcy and a few more
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I'm not arguing--just explaining why i am right |
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Pies2016
Joined: 12 Sep 2014
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I guess you could add taylor adams into this thread, given that we traded him in as a recent first round draft pick. He continues to polarize as a ball magnet that butchers the ball. Time will tell.
I would also add Broomhead, had heaps of setbacks and a little bit disappointing this pre season but has all the tools. I remember Robert shaw ( who was involved with junior development in SA at the time ) saying broomhead may well be an absolute steal at # 20. Get him cherry ripe, add scharenberg and de goey on the park and i think the future of our club will look a lot better pretty quickly. |
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Stupied
Joined: 14 Mar 2013
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| thompsoc wrote: | Ball and Jolly were A grade mature aged players so it wasn't rocket science picking up these guys.
As I keep saying we have not picked up an A grade draftee or rookie player since beams and sidebottom. The club had picks every year since 2008.
People keep telling me Hine is a genius. Well it ain't playing out well on the scoreboard so far this decade! |
Hine hadn't had a top 10 pick to work with since 2006, and even then he managed to grab two a graders in 08. Since then we've had:
2009- first and second round picks traded for Jolly and Ball
2010- traded picks for Tarrant and Krakouer. Recruited Fasolo, who is well above average for a player taken at 50.
2011- traded pick 25 for Clarke and Elliott, who is a bona-fide A grader in the making, if he isn't already. Was well on the way to AA last year before injury.
2012- traded in to the end of the first round. Picked up Grundy, Kennedy and Broomhead. Grundy is the premier young ruck in the comp at the moment. As with all rucks, he will take more time than a mid to reach his peak, but he screams quality. Broomhead and BK both show a lot of promise (Broomy moreso imo). Both will be B graders at worst, Broomy has the potential to take the next step. Both had their development interrupted with injury/ailments.
2013- two top 10 picks. Scharenberg at 6, who mark Williams described as the best schoolboy player he'd seen since Carey, and Freeman at 10, who is lightning fast and has shown the ability to take a game by the scruff of the neck when he builds a head full of steam. Both injured all of 2012, but both project as likely A graders based on their junior careers. Pick 63 was Langdon, who was the steal of the draft, and projects to be at minimum B grade, an exceptional return for that pick.
2014- DeGoey at 5, who looks the goods already, and Moore at 9, who was arguably the best KPP in the draft. Both project as A grade. Maynard with pick 30, classy user of the ball who won the best and fairest at the Dragons ahead of Brayshaw. Too early to make a call but looks a likely type.
So we have 3 years of trading our top picks, two years for 4 mature A graders, 1 for Elliott who is future A grade, then 3 years of top picks, 5 of which project as A grade, two of which have been unfortunately injured, two that haven't had the chance to play yet, and 1 who, by nature of his size and position, will take longer to develop.
Keep posting that Hine is poor at the drafting table mate, it just makes you look even more dopey than your God awful grammar and sentence structure does. |
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thompsoc
Joined: 21 Sep 2009
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[quote="Stupied"] | thompsoc wrote: | B
Keep posting that Hine is poor at the drafting table mate, it just makes you look even more dopey than your God awful grammar and sentence structure does. |
Well MATE you can't see the forest for the trees!
Keep making excuses - you must enjoy being thrashed every year by Hawthorn.
Wow, what have we got at the moment - 1 definite A grader
in Pendles and a few close to A grade.
He has been there for over a decade and doing great according to you!
Meanwhile Wright from Hawthorn ........
PS
"Hine hadn't had" is wonderful grammar...
PS
It is A grader not a grader..
and Fasolo went for pick 45 not 50 etc...etc..
do you want me to go on ... in this trivial nit picking?
_________________
we don't eat our own at collingwood we just allow them to foul our nest.
Last edited by thompsoc on Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:38 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Tannin 
Can't remember
Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania
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Stupied, that post was a tour de force. Perhaps just a fraction optimistic to my mind, but top class posting.
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�Let's eat Grandma.� Commas save lives! |
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Tannin
Can't remember
Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania
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PS: Even without bonus points for neat alliteration, "Hine hadn't had" is perfectly correct.
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�Let's eat Grandma.� Commas save lives! |
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