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Proposal for new forum

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stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 7:13 pm
Post subject: Proposal for new forumReply with quote

Hi Mods,

I'd like to propose a new forum be created in the "other Forums", somewhere near the Vic Park Tavern. One that can be devoted to the intellectual debate around topics such as Politics and Religion, physcology, free will, etc etc.

That way those who are disposed to want intellectual debate can have it, and those who don't and who just want to go into the Vic Park Tavern, talk shit, swap stories, argue about news all in good nature, can do so without having their lack of education or intelligence pointed out ad infinitum.

Yes, it's traditional that all this stuff resides in the VPT, it was also traditional that general football discussion was in the main forum. That was moved elsewhere making the main forum Collingwood only.

The VPT membership has seriously declined over recent years, the intense nature of some of the debate has anecdotally made a large contribution to that. People just don't find it fun. If they wanted to be lectured on how dumb they were, they'd visit their parents or ask their wife.

This is a Collingwood Bulletin board, the pre requisite for being here is that you support Collingwood and as such we have all ages, educations and intellects here and they should all feel welcomed. They way the VPT is at present, that's not the case.

My thoughts.

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David Libra

I dare you to try


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda

PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 7:51 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

My thoughts (not as a moderator, but just from my own observation as a poster in the VPT over many years):

I'm surprised you think the membership has declined. Perhaps you're right, but I sometimes feel like it's grown over the last year or so. I still haven't forgotten what a nasty place it could be 5 to 10 years ago either, with Magpie Greg, Eunos, Dale61 and Tess teeing off against each other on a regular basis and pursuing vendettas going back years. That was not a welcoming place at all. At least discussion nowadays is mostly civil and doesn't involve too many gratuitous personal attacks.

My understanding of the politics/personal discussion divide on Nick's is that it was always well served by two forums: the Victoria Park Tavern and the Bored Board; one for vigorous political/philosophical debate, and one for laidback chat and exchange of personal stories. The trouble is that the Bored Board seems to have been largely abandoned, perhaps because its original core (teenagers in the pre-Facebook days) has long since departed. Also, its status as a private, invite-only forum meant that a lot of posters didn't appear to know it existed.

The problem, then, is not that so much vigorous, sometimes intellectual debate occurs in the Victoria Park Tavern. That's always been its purpose. The problem, perhaps, is that people who want more laidback, personal discussion don't really have anywhere else to go.

What to do with the Bored Board has been an issue I've raised a few times over the past few years, but I think it's time to consider it a lost cause and move on. The question, then, is whether we need a new, open subforum that can serve the purpose you suggest, Stui—perhaps one in which friendly discussion of personal stories, random chatter and perhaps discussion about music, film and TV can be housed, with political arguments and debates strongly discouraged. Do you think this might be a good solution? If there's enough demand for it, I'd be happy to take this to the other mods and see what they think.

Personally, I'd be excited about the prospect of starting a new forum. My only fear is that dividing the VPT in half might starve both the old VPT and the new subforum of oxygen and wind up killing them both. But, on the other hand, targeted forums could increase interest and encourage more Nick's posters to venture outside General Discussion. There's a delicate line to negotiate there.

(As for insults and putdowns, suffice it to say that respectful discussion should be the benchmark for all posting on Nick's. If you see a post that contravenes that standard, feel free to report it.)

What do others think? Is there a problem, and, if so, what do you think of Stui's solution (or my interpretation of it)?

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stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 8:24 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't believe that the bored Board is the answer. As you say it was pre facebook and also has a qualification for entry.

There's also the matter of labelling.

I see a revamped VPT for discussion on news, current affairs, funny shit, basically pub talk, the kind of conversations the average punter would have with mates over a few beers.

The more heavy topics could be in a forum titled great debates or solve world hunger here or some such, to clearly distinguish between the two.

My thought is, nothing is set in stone. If the idea has some support, why not try it for 6 months. If it doesn't work, try something else.

No sin in change.

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Bucks5 Capricorn

Nicky D - Parting the red sea


Joined: 23 Mar 2002


PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 8:36 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

Change doesn't worry me but there are not enough posts in VPT to warrant a sub-forum.

The religious/political stuff is easy enough to identify by its title and not open (if you are so inclined, like me)

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David Libra

I dare you to try


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda

PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 11:45 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think I'd be inclined to support that suggestion, Stui, because it feels like you want the divide to be less based on topics than on ways of discussing topics. For one thing, that'd be very hard to negotiate, and I also wonder about the motivation behind this—are you really going to kick PTID out of the 'pub' because he uses four-syllable words and terms like post-structuralism? Who says that an ordinary poster might not be interested in some of the more esoteric things we talk about? If you're trying to create an egghead ghetto, we'll start getting the impression that you want to get rid of us... Wink

I think any new subforum would have to have a very clearly defined space and role on the site, which is why I think my suggestion is a little stronger. But I'm happy to listen to others and see what they say.

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stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 6:41 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

Splitting forums based on discussion style isn't actually difficult at all, it all depends on how you frame it. If people were really interested in the more esoteric things you refer to then I'm sure they would visit.

I've put the thought up, I don't want to monopolise this thread, I'd be interested to see what others have to say on the subject.

Do others like the idea of creating a new forum for the more deep dive discussions and ban the use of the terms 'Straw Man" and "Post Structuralism" from the VPT? (instant yellow card if used).

Yes, no, alternative suggestions welcome.

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Jezza Taurus

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Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End

PostPosted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 4:08 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm indifferent on this issue to be honest. If there was to be a new section of the forum or a sub-section of VPT I'd be willing to go along with others and seeing how it works or not for a few months. If nothing changes however and the format remains the same then I'm fine with that as well.

If there is a consideration of change maybe you can split it up into four or five sub-forums. One can involve topics with society, religion and politics which has been the dominant category of discussion on VPT in recent times. Another category could involve music, TV, entertainment and technology as the second sub-forum. Another forum devoted to foods and drinks and discussing favourite eateries and bars for example and lastly another section devoted to other issues and things that don't fit into these three categories such as the 'what made you happy or pissed off today' threads for example.

I do agree with David though that heading down this particular path may kill both forums and therefore we're worse off than before so I think all users should be consulted about this especially those who post on VPT regularly before any further action is taken.

VPT can be taxing at times and maybe this results in only the same regular users posting in this area whereas others outside are reluctant to join into the discussion. Sometimes posters air very strong opinions or views passionately but across the board I think most of us have a mutual respect with one another and know when to not draw the line without losing the plot and going into meltdowns towards one another.

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Joined: 06 Sep 2013


PostPosted: Sat Feb 21, 2015 11:27 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

So I have a suggestion for the name any new forum "the monkey spankers club"!
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Morrigu Capricorn



Joined: 11 Aug 2001


PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2015 6:47 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that's a good idea Stui if it has a bloody word limit for posts!

Sorry but IMO there is some very very long twaddle posted and it gets quoted in responses which makes you lose the will to live let alone read and it seems to infiltrate just about very topic - so all very well to say don't read it but then there's no point coming here at all.

I know that's why quite a few regulars have buggared off!!

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Joel Capricorn



Joined: 23 Mar 1999
Location: Mornington Peninsula

PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 1:25 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

Must admit, I hardly post in VPT because I just can't be bothered in long winded debate (even if I think I have something relevant to add).
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Piethagoras' Theorem Taurus

the hypotenuse, is always a cakewalk


Joined: 29 May 2006
Location: is where I'm at

PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 6:32 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't get involved in the intellectual stuff but still find it fascinating to read if not educational, most of the time. Googling big words isn't a problem, it's much less annoying than social media speak where I'm expected to make out words from the latest, trending abbreviation! I mean WTF is YOLO?? (irony intended Wink)

Back on topic, why not sticky your more staple 'what did you.......today' and the like threads to separate from the hardcore debating/pissing contest threads Razz

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John Wren Virgo

"Look after the game. It means so much to so many."


Joined: 15 Jul 2007


PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 10:07 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

icymi @frankiegoestocollingwood the vpt reminds me of a collingwood cafe. hashtag pretentiouswank. #twiceinonedayihaveusedthatterm

more seriously, i enjoy some of the debate in vpt but when it becomes self-indulgent claptrap i tune out.

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Piethagoras' Theorem Taurus

the hypotenuse, is always a cakewalk


Joined: 29 May 2006
Location: is where I'm at

PostPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 7:02 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

there you go, I had to google 'icymi', you bastard. F U Razz
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John Wren Virgo

"Look after the game. It means so much to so many."


Joined: 15 Jul 2007


PostPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 7:28 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

you're welcome.
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