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Death Penalty?

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Death Penalty
Yes
41%
 41%  [ 13 ]
No
45%
 45%  [ 14 ]
Not Sure
3%
 3%  [ 1 ]
I really wanna spank the Monkey
9%
 9%  [ 3 ]
Total Votes : 31

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think positive Libra

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Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere

PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 12:00 am
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David wrote:
Guy's very overweight, apparently has no friends and is into £$%$ed-up shit on the internet. Also relatively young, suggesting this habit might have started in his teenage years. I think I'll stick with my amateur diagnosis, thanks.

You'd be surprised how little dysfunction actually comes from being a "spoilt brat". If anything, I'd wager the opposite—more often than not, damage causes damage.


1. Some fat people just like food too much, and don't like exercise
2. Some people have no personality
3. Lots of guys are into £$%$ed up shit on the Internet, my loveable sane nephew for one, though I don't think it involves selling kiddy porn.
4. Habit? What's his habit? Selling pics of his child?
5. Bullshit. I'll show you my old man one day, he was not abused, not damaged, just spoilt $£$%^%%$ rotten and dysfunction is his middle name

David, some people are just utter filth, no excuses, no reason, just shit people

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David Libra

I dare you to try


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda

PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 7:13 am
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1. That's a superficial explanation of how people become overweight, but you're ignoring the factors that lead to overeating, lack of exercise, poor self-control and so on. They differ from person to person, but I think you'll find a high correlation with low socioeconomic background, depression, lack of family/friend support networks, other medical issues and/or family history of obesity. And once someone is obese, they are much more likely to be discriminated against, vilified and ostracised. Any exercise in pointing the finger at overweight people and morally condemning them is almost certainly misguided and unjust.

2. "Some people have no personality." What does that even mean? That's a pretty absurd claim.

3. Yep, indeed they are.

4. The article stated that the police found heaps of images of child pornography on his computer. This habit appears to be what got him into contact with the FBI agent in the first place.

5. I don't know your father, obviously, and I'm hesitant to speculate about what led to him being physically and psychologically abusive, but I have no doubt that there were some underlying dysfunctions there. It may well be an undiagnosed mental disorder, antisocial tendencies developed in his upbringing or some deep feeling of powerlessness or unhappiness arising from a multitude of factors (or a combination of some or all of these). Violence, particularly habitual violence, doesn't come from nowhere; the desire to commit it has to come from somewhere, and well-adjusted people tend to either lack that desire or have the ability to effectively suppress it. The fact that your father didn't means there must have been something going wrong along the way.

There are always reasons.

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think positive Libra

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 7:22 am
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David wrote:
1. That's a superficial explanation of how people become overweight, but you're ignoring the factors that lead to overeating, lack of exercise, poor self-control and so on. They differ from person to person, but I think you'll find a high correlation with low socioeconomic background, depression, lack of family/friend support networks, other medical issues and/or family history of obesity. And once someone is obese, they are much more likely to be discriminated against, vilified and ostracised. Any exercise in pointing the finger at overweight people and morally condemning them is almost certainly misguided and unjust.

2. "Some people have no personality." What does that even mean? That's a pretty absurd claim.

3. Yep, indeed they are.

4. The article stated that the police found heaps of images of child pornography on his computer. This habit appears to be what got him into contact with the FBI agent in the first place.

5. I don't know your father, obviously, and I'm hesitant to speculate about what led to him being physically and psychologically abusive, but I have no doubt that there were some underlying dysfunctions there. It may well be an undiagnosed mental disorder, antisocial tendencies developed in his upbringing or some deep feeling of powerlessness or unhappiness arising from a multitude of factors (or a combination of some or all of these). Violence, particularly habitual violence, doesn't come from nowhere; the desire to commit it has to come from somewhere, and well-adjusted people tend to either lack that desire or have the ability to effectively suppress it. The fact that your father didn't means there must have been something going wrong along the way.

There are always reasons.


1. Kerry packer, his son and the beloved Gina might disagree. (My favourite biggest loser moment, when asked why they had packed on the weight, didn't use some childhood episode as an excuse simply said "I eat too much"

As for the rest, bullshit David, some people will use anything as an excuse. Why don't ise just insert your no free will clause in there too?

I put on some beef lately, I could blame knocking my head and dislocating my shoulder, stress from worrying about hubby, stress from a house full of people at Christmas, stress from work, lack of time from work, my knee pain getting too much to take, or I could be honest with myself and admit my willpower dipped, I didn't say no to the chocolate, the ice cream or the booze! I made the choices and now I'm paying for it.

It's called personal responsibility, and I'm taking it

Cheers, gym time!

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David Libra

I dare you to try


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 7:48 am
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You've just provided a reason, though: your willpower dipped. Why did it dip? It could well be that the stresses you list were major factors, though only you would know whether that's true; either way, something caused it, right? But you also have strong enough willpower to bounce back. Some people never quite develop that, or only have it in small doses, or just haven't learned how.

As for Gina et al, socioeconomic background is only one potential reason out of many. It's not as simple as lying on a psychoanalyst's couch and putting all your life's troubles down to that day when you were 3 and Dad left for work without saying goodbye; to understand this stuff you need to look at a huge range of factors. All I know is that there always will be factors.

Somehow, the vast majority of us get along in life without even considering selling our children's bodies on the internet, let alone making concrete plans to do so. Such highly dysfunctional behaviour is only ever going to emerge from serious dysfunction. This isn't about 'excuses'; he'll do his time, and rightly so (though thankfully won't be getting executed). It's about recognising the fact that human behaviour is caused.

That's not just my opinion; it's widely accepted scientific fact. You can reject it and go on claiming that "some people are just evil", but if so you're arguing with reality, not me.

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think positive Libra

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 9:41 am
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David wrote:
You've just provided a reason, though: your willpower dipped. Why did it dip? It could well be that the stresses you list were major factors, though only you would know whether that's true; either way, something caused it, right? But you also have strong enough willpower to bounce back. Some people never quite develop that, or only have it in small doses, or just haven't learned how.

As for Gina et al, socioeconomic background is only one potential reason out of many. It's not as simple as lying on a psychoanalyst's couch and putting all your life's troubles down to that day when you were 3 and Dad left for work without saying goodbye; to understand this stuff you need to look at a huge range of factors. All I know is that there always will be factors.

Somehow, the vast majority of us get along in life without even considering selling our children's bodies on the internet, let alone making concrete plans to do so. Such highly dysfunctional behaviour is only ever going to emerge from serious dysfunction. This isn't about 'excuses'; he'll do his time, and rightly so (though thankfully won't be getting executed). It's about recognising the fact that human behaviour is caused.

That's not just my opinion; it's widely accepted scientific fact. You can reject it and go on claiming that "some people are just evil", but if so you're arguing with reality, not me.


Of course they were factors, but I let them become excuses. Even if it was just to let my brain cool off a bit. I even knew what the result would be, and how much it would piss me off. Was it worth it? Doesn't really matter.

Human behaviour is certainly guided by stuff that happens to us, but, and here is the but, it comes down to choices. Choosing to do the right thing. Don't give me that shit about poor will power. I'm nothing special, just your average Jo, literally! This guy knew it was wrong. He still CHOSE to do it anyway. If he didn't know, he wouldn't have been hiding on the Internet.

You don't do anyone any favours by continually allowing people to excuse bad behaviour by using blame.

Otherwise we may as well quit now.

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1061 



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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 10:04 am
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think positive wrote:

Otherwise we may as well quit now.


I stopped discussing it as I refuse to encourage anyone posting such rubbish(not tp).

Sorry but if I found anyone doing what this animal not I don't think an animal would do this, I'll call him a monster, had planned I'd hope no court would convict me of what I'd to to that monster, but as we have seen some think these monsters have a reason and then fabricate an excuse to help them get away with abusing a new born baby.


Last edited by 1061 on Tue Jan 27, 2015 1:12 pm; edited 2 times in total
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think positive Libra

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 12:57 pm
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1061 wrote:
think positive wrote:

Otherwise we may as well quit now.


I stopped discussing it as I refuse to encourage anyone posting such rubbish.

Sorry but if I found anyone doing what this animal not I don't think an animal would do this, I'll call him a monster, had planned I'd hope no court would convict me but as we have seen some think these monsters have a reason and then fabricate an excuse to help them get away with abusing a new born baby.


Hmm, maybe I'm dense today! First did you mean me or David "posting rubbish"?

Second, nope not an animal, a monster, got that! But then you say if you found anyone doing what he had planned, you'd "hope no court would convict you".

The last sentence, yep agree totally!

Wink

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1061 



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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 1:12 pm
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edited to make more sense.
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think positive Libra

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 3:16 pm
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1061 wrote:
edited to make more sense.



Very Happy Wink

Ta!

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David Libra

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 8:20 pm
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Sorry, but every Australian court would convict you, and rightly so.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 8:29 pm
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And every talking head would be calling a non custodial sentence, maybe even a pardon. But your honor I did it in an act of vengeful rage and I'd turn my life around maybe making pretty pot plants for the needy to sell at open air street markets.

I'd expect those calling for clemency for those in Bali out to be shot they would surely get behind my cause as well.
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David Libra

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 8:33 pm
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You'd be a legend among the Derryn Hinch set, but the rest of us would see you as a sad wannabe vigilante playing out twisted revenge fantasies. Not sure there's much of a market for prison-made potplants, though.

We've discussed an incident on here in the past in which something like this actually happened. As many of us agreed, your Hollywood fantasy is a bit uglier, messier and more traumatic than you might like to think.

http://www.magpies.net/nick/bb/viewtopic.php?t=67320

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Tannin Capricorn

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Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania

PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 8:53 pm
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David wrote:
So, you guys would be happy to kill and/or torture someone who is clearly mentally ill? Very sad (all of it).

At the very least, you'd want to know all the facts before pulling the switch. Was this even his idea, or was he a weak-minded individual goaded into the plan by an FBI agent seeking to entrap him? Do you know for a fact that he would have actually been able to follow through? Was he actually going to abuse his baby in some way, or would the images have been fairly mundane? I have no idea what gets baby-paedophiles off (or why they even exist), but considering how often I and my partner have to touch our baby's genitalia during changing and bathing, I'm not even sure what you could do. Perhaps I'm blessed with limited imagination.

Anyway, even if you were to give the very worst possible answer to all of those questions, you're still dealing with an individual with an extraordinarily sick mind who needs some pretty serious help. I hope he can somehow be successfully rehabilitated.


^ Completely wrong.

The correct expression is "my partner and I".

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1061 



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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 9:05 pm
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Actually I'm thinking eye dropper, battery acid .......
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think positive Libra

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 11:20 pm
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1061 wrote:
And every talking head would be calling a non custodial sentence, maybe even a pardon. But your honor I did it in an act of vengeful rage and I'd turn my life around maybe making pretty pot plants for the needy to sell at open air street markets.

I'd expect those calling for clemency for those in Bali out to be shot they would surely get behind my cause as well.


Just tell me your mentally fragile, it wasn't your fault! No free will!

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