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themonk
Joined: 02 Mar 2004
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Time will tell regarding Crisp & DeGoey, they have been at the club for 5 minutes.
As for Beams, he's a superstar, not was or will be but is.
No one wants their elite players leaving. |
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STOKA35 
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Mount Barker. South Australia
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| As the years go on and players retire there will be a time when stories will come out about the buckley-Malthouse changeover era. |
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| themonk wrote: | Time will tell regarding Crisp & DeGoey, they have been at the club for 5 minutes.
As for Beams, he's a superstar, not was or will be but is.
No one wants their elite players leaving. |
I think the word "superstar" is somewhat devalued if you are willing to apply it to a player who wasn't in the best 5 players at your club (Pendlebury, Sidebottom, Swan, Cloke, Reid). In this case, he wasn't even the best player we took in that draft.
Collingwood supporters have always tended to over-rate their young players and make the "big call" about how great they are too early. I was hoping the 'Pies would move him on from 2011 (feel free to check back over my posts, if you want). Why? Because he managed to join a long line of Collingwood players who weren't quite good enough to make a difference in a big final. The stats speak for themselves - even in 2012, he managed to kick 27 goals in 21 regular-season games and then just 1 in 3 finals. Since he was (and still is) a slow player who really didn't damage the opposition unless he hit the score-board, there is a message in that. Compare, for example, his 4 goal game during the season against Hawthorn with his display in the QF against them that year and note also the way that other players (notably Sidebottom) stepped up to the plate in that game. Some players step up consistently in finals all their careers. Some don't. Beams certainly looks to be one of the ones that doesn't. That's why the Bears are a good match for him - that particular fatal flaw isn't going to get exposed up there any time soon.
Consequently, I thought we "won" the trade when Beams left the Club. Getting pick 5 for him had me snging, well: "That ain't working, that's the way you do it, get your money for nothing ...." |
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Darkstranger
Joined: 06 Jun 2012
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| Pies4shaw wrote: | | themonk wrote: | Time will tell regarding Crisp & DeGoey, they have been at the club for 5 minutes.
As for Beams, he's a superstar, not was or will be but is.
No one wants their elite players leaving. |
I think the word "superstar" is somewhat devalued if you are willing to apply it to a player who wasn't in the best 5 players at your club (Pendlebury, Sidebottom, Swan, Cloke, Reid). In this case, he wasn't even the best player we took in that draft.
Collingwood supporters have always tended to over-rate their young players and make the "big call" about how great they are too early. I was hoping the 'Pies would move him on from 2011 (feel free to check back over my posts, if you want). Why? Because he managed to join a long line of Collingwood players who weren't quite good enough to make a difference in a big final. The stats speak for themselves - even in 2012, he managed to kick 27 goals in 21 regular-season games and then just 1 in 3 finals. Since he was (and still is) a slow player who really didn't damage the opposition unless he hit the score-board, there is a message in that. Compare, for example, his 4 goal game during the season against Hawthorn with his display in the QF against them that year and note also the way that other players (notably Sidebottom) stepped up to the plate in that game. Some players step up consistently in finals all their careers. Some don't. Beams certainly looks to be one of the ones that doesn't. That's why the Bears are a good match for him - that particular fatal flaw isn't going to get exposed up there any time soon.
Consequently, I thought we "won" the trade when Beams left the Club. Getting pick 5 for him had me snging, well: "That ain't working, that's the way you do it, get your money for nothing ...." |
Just Collingwood supporters overrate you reckon??? you must lead a sheltered life my friend!
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There is Collingwood and then the rest. |
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dave_swan
Joined: 10 Mar 2011
Location: London
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Everytime Brisbane lose I think back to Beams saying brisbane is closer to winning a flag with than collingwood.
He obviously didn't look at their forward line or backline before saying that! HA! |
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Geek
geek
Joined: 06 Apr 2006
Location: Jacana
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| Jezza wrote: | | Geek wrote: | | Wokko wrote: | Bit like Medhurst, the Steak Knives have proven themselves as valuable as the big name traded out, never mind the Big Ticket item that came with them (Ben Reid in that case).
Like the Tarrant trade which I believe is one of the biggest trade wins in history (Reid's injuries do sour it a bit), I believe this could be another one. We got some great years out of Beams, then traded him at his highest value for another 10 year+ player and a very capable sweetener.
So to Beams, I say THANKS!!
Beams vs Crisp this year.
http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?tid1=5&pid1=3738&tid2=20&pid2=3135&type=A&fid1=S&fid2=S |
Crisp an I have the same birthday. Though he's you know... a couple of years younger or so.... |
I just looked it up and realised you had the best birthday ever in 2010 if you have the same birthday date as Crisp. |
Might have missed a night or two of sleep, yeah  |
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RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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Beams is without doubt an A grade player.
However, I'm super confident that De Goey will become an even better player, because he plays much harder and he is a more all-rounded player, good on the inside and outside. Then there's Crisp, who is going from strength to strength. Then there's Greenwood, the equal 2nd best player at a top finals team from last season. Overall, we're already way in front with this deal, and it could prove to be the deal of the century. |
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September Zeros
Joined: 04 Oct 2012
Location: Behind you
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| RudeBoy wrote: | Beams is without doubt an A grade player.
However, I'm super confident that De Goey will become an even better player, because he plays much harder and he is a more all-rounded player, good on the inside and outside. Then there's Crisp, who is going from strength to strength. Then there's Greenwood, the equal 2nd best player at a top finals team from last season. Overall, we're already way in front with this deal, and it could prove to be the deal of the century. |
If your going to factor greenwood in as how well we have done in the beams trade then you have to include the loss of lumumba as well.
Really all we got for beams was 5 and crisp. If De Goey becomes an A grader and Crisp a consistent best 22 then we're ahead. That hasn't happened yet. Only time will tell.
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No Pressure, No Diamonds
They used to be a happy team at hawthorn.
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RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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| September Zeros wrote: | | RudeBoy wrote: | Beams is without doubt an A grade player.
However, I'm super confident that De Goey will become an even better player, because he plays much harder and he is a more all-rounded player, good on the inside and outside. Then there's Crisp, who is going from strength to strength. Then there's Greenwood, the equal 2nd best player at a top finals team from last season. Overall, we're already way in front with this deal, and it could prove to be the deal of the century. |
If your going to factor greenwood in as how well we have done in the beams trade then you have to include the loss of lumumba as well.
Really all we got for beams was 5 and crisp. If De Goey becomes an A grader and Crisp a consistent best 22 then we're ahead. That hasn't happened yet. Only time will tell. |
You're wrong. Lumumba was effectively traded for Varcoe. |
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Pies4shaw
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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Correct, RB. Collingwood traded Beams for picks 5 and 25 and Crisp and then on-traded pick 25 to North for Greenwood. The opening post in the following thread from the DTM forum spells out those trades (see items 10 and 11):
http://www.magpies.net/nick/bb/viewtopic.php?t=75416&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
In case anyone thinks there is room for further argument with you on this topic, as each deal was confirmed, I updated the OP and added a link explaining the content of each deal (except, as fate would have it, for the Collingwood deals which I thought, at the time, were so well known, no supporting link was required). In every case, my summary of the deal (or, in inter-linked cases, deals) was taken from the official source. |
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