A challenge for all sides of the argument

[collie dog]

NO. And we will need a new coach before we ever play in a grand final again.

[die4pies]

Yes.

[dalyc]

[winpies]

Yes!!!!

[piepower]

Yes

[piepower]

Yes

[PyreneesPie]

[CarringbushCigar]

I can't see us finishing above 13th

[blackandwhite4life]

No.

And this opinion doesn't make me a hater either. Why would I come to this site if i didn't love the Pies and want what's best for the club?

I just feel we're on the slide, we finished the year as a bottom 4 team on stats from our last 11 or so games.

I can see Carlton and Brisbane improving, probably also GWS and I don't see us jumping above anyone in either the top 8 or Suns, Eagles.

So below 11th, probably 13-15. Would love to be wrong though.

[Jezza]

It's a no for me.

I bleed for this club and will be a paid up Home and Away member again next year but unfortunately I think we're going to fall short again. The only way we'll play finals next year is if we have a great run on the injury front and we improve out of sight with our game plan and the youngsters take it to their next level and we see the likes of Karnezis, Freeman and Marsh emerge into genuine starters for the team.

Long-term we'll be in good stead as we turn over our list now, but in the short-term it's going to be a frustrating period for the club and I can see us being inconsistent again next year. The loss of Beams will hurt us especially in the short term, but I hope Levi Greenwood can fill this replacement adequately if he replicates his 2014 form from the Kangaroos and it should be remembered that three players in the top 5 for this year's Copeland Trophy won't be playing with us most likely as Beams and H are gone but Macaffer did his knee late in the season and while he's confident of a return by round 1 I don't want to see him rushed back in. I can't say I'm sold on the recruitment of Travis Varcoe but I hope he proves me wrong and young Jack Crisp is still a kid with just potential at the moment but I look forward to watching his development.

I have us finishing between 9th to 12th most likely and if everything goes our way with several factors such as injuries, game plan, form and improvement of players we might sneak a 7th or 8th spot. Finals would be a fantastic achievement for this side in my opinion next year.

I'll make a proper assessment of our potential position after the whole recruiting process is over in early December when the pre-season draft concludes.

[Magpietothemax]

I have listed the losses and gains for our list next year compared with our list this year:
Losses:

Beams
Harry
Ball
Maxwell
McAffer (very unlikely to play next year)
Gains for next year's list
Greenwood
Varcoe
Ben Reid (hardly played last year)
Karnezis (did not play seniors)
Crisp
Freeman (did not play seniors)'
Broomhead (only just started playing seniors this year)
Gault (played only one game of seniors last year)
Marsh (did not play seniors last year)

I think that Varcoe might just be what we need as a replacement for H. I know many have criticized him, but he has dynamic speed and if we play him as an outside player he might be just what we need for breaking the lines and dynamic instablity that H used to provide.
Ball of course is a loss for his leadership and example on the field, but I think the development of Adams will cover his loss in terms of the team structure.
Beams of course is a big loss. We have Greenwood who can find the ball like Beams and is an established player with alot of strength to partly but not fully compensate.
We have Broomhead in the midfield ready to go for his first full year. He will add a dynamic intensity to our midfield that we only just started to see at the end of this year.
We have an unknown quantity in Crisp also to come into our midfield with welcome height and strength. Late this year he apparently showed significant potential.
We have Ben Reid to return. He barely played last year. If he can get a really strong preseason and return fully fit next year, this would add a dimension of which we have only a dim memory. His presence will strengthen our back line, make up for loss of Maxwell to our defence, and perhaps release Marley Williams to play in the midfield at times.
We have Karnezis to come into our team possibly as a tall forward/tall midfielder with unknown possiblities.
We have Freeman, Marsh and Gault (one game this year) waiting in the wings with unknown possibilities.
However, we have no clear player to peform Caff's tagging role for next year.
How do the two lists compare?
The jury is out well and truly. Despite the loss of Beams, we have significant midfield talent entering our list. If Crisp turns out to be very good, I think we have the loss of Beams covered.
We have possiblities with Gault, and exciting prospects with Freeman's pace to enter the midfield. Marsh is another unknown talent that we will try next year.
The one player who I can't see covered at this point is McAffer.
My overall assessment is that it hangs in the balance, and we could actually be stronger next year, especially when we also consider that Grundy and Witts will be better than this year as well.
I am also assuming that we will have learned the lessons this year from a flawed training program and will not be suffering the same rate of injuries.
Overall, my answer is that yes, we will make the finals (either 8th or 7th)

[Magpietothemax]

I have listed the losses and gains for our list next year compared with our list this year:
Losses:

Beams
Harry
Ball
Maxwell
McAffer (very unlikely to play next year)
Gains for next year's list
Greenwood
Varcoe
Ben Reid (hardly played last year)
Karnezis (did not play seniors)
Crisp
Freeman (did not play seniors)'
Broomhead (only just started playing seniors this year)
Gault (played only one game of seniors last year)
Marsh (did not play seniors last year)

I think that Varcoe might just be what we need as a replacement for H. I know many have criticized him, but he has dynamic speed and if we play him as an outside player he might be just what we need for breaking the lines and dynamic instablity that H used to provide.
Ball of course is a loss for his leadership and example on the field, but I think the development of Adams will cover his loss in terms of the team structure.
Beams of course is a big loss. We have Greenwood who can find the ball like Beams and is an established player with alot of strength to partly but not fully compensate.
We have Broomhead in the midfield ready to go for his first full year. He will add a dynamic intensity to our midfield that we only just started to see at the end of this year.
We have an unknown quantity in Crisp also to come into our midfield with welcome height and strength. Late this year he apparently showed significant potential.
We have Ben Reid to return. He barely played last year. If he can get a really strong preseason and return fully fit next year, this would add a dimension of which we have only a dim memory. His presence will strengthen our back line, make up for loss of Maxwell to our defence, and perhaps release Marley Williams to play in the midfield at times.
We have Karnezis to come into our team possibly as a tall forward/tall midfielder with unknown possiblities.
We have Freeman, Marsh and Gault (one game this year) waiting in the wings with unknown possibilities.
However, we have no clear player to peform Caff's tagging role for next year.
How do the two lists compare?
The jury is out well and truly. Despite the loss of Beams, we have significant midfield talent entering our list. If Crisp turns out to be very good, I think we have the loss of Beams covered.
We have possiblities with Gault, and exciting prospects with Freeman's pace to enter the midfield. Marsh is another unknown talent that we will try next year.
The one player who I can't see covered at this point is McAffer.
My overall assessment is that it hangs in the balance, and we could actually be stronger next year, especially when we also consider that Grundy and Witts will be better than this year as well.
I am also assuming that we will have learned the lessons this year from a flawed training program and will not be suffering the same rate of injuries.
Overall, my answer is that yes, we will make the finals (either 8th or 7th)

[Larry]

Yes

[Neil Appleby]

[Piethagoras' Theorem]

Yes. Comfortably