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AN_Inkling 



Joined: 06 Oct 2007


PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 12:28 am
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^^Maxwell and Ball we lose for nothing which is why I only mentioned them. H and Beams we will get something for, what that is will determine where we are placed.
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melliot 



Joined: 07 Apr 2006
Location: Bendigo

PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 12:40 am
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Sheehan on the couch tonight said "something is not right at the pies". He keeps hearing the same concerns from different sources which tends to indicate there is truth to the concerns/ issues. No specifics.

Got to say I'm concerned. Not just from Sheehan comment, but the whole club vibe.

Next year needs to show overall improvement. And not just in the win column. I want to see it improvement in the spirit and teamanship.
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The_Staunton Virgo



Joined: 30 Jul 2007
Location: Hobart

PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 1:07 am
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melliot wrote:
Sheehan on the couch tonight said "something is not right at the pies". He keeps hearing the same concerns from different sources which tends to indicate there is truth to the concerns/ issues. No specifics.

Got to say I'm concerned. Not just from Sheehan comment, but the whole club vibe.

Next year needs to show overall improvement. And not just in the win column. I want to see it improvement in the spirit and teamanship.


Mike is a bit of a guesser and assessor at this stage

Wouldn't take much to surmise from two key players wanting out "something is not right"

Am pretty concerned myself, but now it's probably shifting to what we get in, rather than pining for those who want to leave - hard ball time Pies.

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Bob Sugar 



Joined: 11 Feb 2010
Location: Benalla

PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 3:47 am
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The_Staunton wrote:
John Wren wrote:
The_Staunton wrote:
derkd wrote:
Couldn't we argue really.... that all the disagreement and debate on here is down to one very simple issue..... "That we just are not a great team anymore”....that we have been overtaken by a number of other sides, and that as both a fan base, and a club, we are struggling (for the moment) to accept that for the next few seasons we may well be in the bottom eight?


Probably just looking for some good news as well

That promised 2010/much of 2011 dynasty is long gone

Crowds are down

Key players are leaving

Nathan Buckley Is (insert your opinion here)

And no one thinks we'll do anything next year that won't involve a bottom 6 finish (generally, there a few "you never knows")

Plus our dynasty went to sodding Hawthorn of all teams

Not hard to feel down in the mouth right now

Some see crisis though, some see opportunity...that's the nub of it!


not sure who promised the dynasty. crowds are down because the bandwagoners are jumping off. i expect us to finish anywhere between 6-12 depending on injuries and any other unforeseen fate that might befall us.


There was a definite expectation of a dynasty

Given we dismantled Geelong in the 2010 Prelim and how we played in 2011 in the h&A season sustained success seemed certain

There's a bad feeling around Collingwood at the moment, as I said even NB today said we need some good news to generate hope.

If we finish 12th next year, there's going to be hell to pay, particularly if we finish 12th and then Beams walked as a restricted free agent?


Beams isn't a restricted FA until 2016, he was drafted the year after Dangerfield.

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The_Staunton Virgo



Joined: 30 Jul 2007
Location: Hobart

PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 5:44 am
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Defender wrote:
The_Staunton wrote:
John Wren wrote:
The_Staunton wrote:
derkd wrote:
Couldn't we argue really.... that all the disagreement and debate on here is down to one very simple issue..... "That we just are not a great team anymore”....that we have been overtaken by a number of other sides, and that as both a fan base, and a club, we are struggling (for the moment) to accept that for the next few seasons we may well be in the bottom eight?


Probably just looking for some good news as well

That promised 2010/much of 2011 dynasty is long gone

Crowds are down

Key players are leaving

Nathan Buckley Is (insert your opinion here)

And no one thinks we'll do anything next year that won't involve a bottom 6 finish (generally, there a few "you never knows")

Plus our dynasty went to sodding Hawthorn of all teams

Not hard to feel down in the mouth right now

Some see crisis though, some see opportunity...that's the nub of it!


not sure who promised the dynasty. crowds are down because the bandwagoners are jumping off. i expect us to finish anywhere between 6-12 depending on injuries and any other unforeseen fate that might befall us.


There was a definite expectation of a dynasty

Given we dismantled Geelong in the 2010 Prelim and how we played in 2011 in the h&A season sustained success seemed certain

There's a bad feeling around Collingwood at the moment, as I said even NB today said we need some good news to generate hope.

If we finish 12th next year, there's going to be hell to pay, particularly if we finish 12th and then Beams walked as a restricted free agent?


Beams isn't a restricted FA until 2016, he was drafted the year after Dangerfield.


They were talking about him being RFA when he comes out of contract? That's not right?

So he'd have to go in the draft?

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Pies4shaw Leo

pies4shaw


Joined: 08 Oct 2007


PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 5:54 am
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Yes.
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yin-YANG 



Joined: 03 Oct 2011


PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 8:12 am
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Clearly the club, coach and players are under the pump. Some of the players now want out - not great given the quality of Beams and the potential issues with culture or team harmony etc, however this period of destabilisation may be the catalyst for a greater team bonding.

We will find out soon enough what the Pies are made of... I think the young guys are yet to cement their spot and that could make many uncertain - but the current crisis is a great opportunity to stand up and bring the guys who want to play for the Pies together. The young guys could feel this is their team now and help the senior guys left form a new resolve.

Keep the faith - BUx was there when we finished last in 99 and he was also part of a team that rose from the ashes and almost won a flag a few years later...

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The_Staunton Virgo



Joined: 30 Jul 2007
Location: Hobart

PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 9:23 am
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Pies4shaw wrote:
Yes.


That's the end of any faith in Trade Radio then...

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slangman 



Joined: 11 Aug 2003


PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 12:30 pm
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Everything gets down to injuries and player availability.
If we have limited injuries, we will finish in the top 8 comfortably.
If long term injuries continue and we don't make finals, then it's gonna hit the fan.
I think Buckley realizes that the time for talking and positioning is over.
Now it's time to deliver.

Next year can only go one of two ways, and that's why supporters and Buckley are nervous about 2015.

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mackasmatt 



Joined: 19 Dec 2007
Location: Perth, WA

PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 12:41 pm
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I think there is a bit of overhype of our "issues" simply because we are Collingwood.

- Complacency: it's not uncommon that after winning a premiership a bunch of players rest on their laurels and under-perform for a few years.
- Dynasty comments: the question gets asked every time a team wins a flag.. is this the start of a dynasty. I'd personally take 1 flag every 10 years as acceptable.
- Competition: it is extremely strong currently, which is good for the AFL as a whole. There was a fairly defined top 2, and a very competitive top 6.
- Going home: players constantly want to go home, it's a part of life. We've stopped recruiting from WA, just like WA teams are reluctant to recruit lots of external talent.
- Harry leaving: I respected the way he played but grew tired of his preciousness. Only a moderate loss to the team, which will be compensated for.
- Beams leaving: again, will be compensated for (pick and player). Absolute gun talent, but at least Sidey is really coming on to elite-level.

What is going to be different in 2015?:
- We will (hopefully) have use to our 2 best key defenders (Reid and Brown)
- We will have small forward options in Elliott and Fasolo
- We will have more half-back dash from Sinclair and Toovey
- We should get a bit more out of Young on the wing
- K-Mart might be given a chance to replace Beams (optimistic.. but goal kicking midfielder who racks it up)
- We need to find someone to help Cloke
- Freeman should get games
- We might be able to play Witts and Grundy without either being a liability

Difficulties:
- The attraction of Collingwood might be wearing thin. We might not be able to attract key talent like Mitch Clark.

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HAL 

Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.


Joined: 17 Mar 2003


PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 12:44 pm
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It will all be apparent with hindsight.
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Lazza 



Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Bendigo, Victoria, Australia

PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 12:50 pm
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slangman wrote:
Everything gets down to injuries and player availability.
If we have limited injuries, we will finish in the top 8 comfortably.
If long term injuries continue and we don't make finals, then it's gonna hit the fan.
I think Buckley realizes that the time for talking and positioning is over.
Now it's time to deliver.

Next year can only go one of two ways, and that's why supporters and Buckley are nervous about 2015.


Let’s get real, some "supporters" are not nervous, they are plainly malicious and vicious against Bucks.... Evil or Very Mad Mad

It’s all hidden agenda stuff by these tools.
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ThePieMind 



Joined: 11 Apr 2009


PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 1:25 pm
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Lazza wrote:
slangman wrote:
Everything gets down to injuries and player availability.
If we have limited injuries, we will finish in the top 8 comfortably.
If long term injuries continue and we don't make finals, then it's gonna hit the fan.
I think Buckley realizes that the time for talking and positioning is over.
Now it's time to deliver.

Next year can only go one of two ways, and that's why supporters and Buckley are nervous about 2015.


Let’s get real, some "supporters" are not nervous, they are plainly malicious and vicious against Bucks.... :evil: Mad

It’s all hidden agenda stuff by these tools.


Exactly like all the supporter disquiet with Thompson, Malthouse and even Clarkson when the respective clubs were doing poorly.

The only positive from the protests is that clubs made changes to the support structures for these coaches and in our case forced MM to recruit Jolly and Ball.

So history says success comes by backing the coach, and making some changes based on the legitimate outside concerns, to ultimately improve performance of the coach and team.

As Clarkson said in the interview "on the couch" last night - STABILITY is a very important part of their recent success.
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Lazza 



Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Bendigo, Victoria, Australia

PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 2:23 pm
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ThePieMind wrote:
Lazza wrote:
slangman wrote:
Everything gets down to injuries and player availability.
If we have limited injuries, we will finish in the top 8 comfortably.
If long term injuries continue and we don't make finals, then it's gonna hit the fan.
I think Buckley realizes that the time for talking and positioning is over.
Now it's time to deliver.

Next year can only go one of two ways, and that's why supporters and Buckley are nervous about 2015.


Let’s get real, some "supporters" are not nervous, they are plainly malicious and vicious against Bucks.... :evil: Mad

It’s all hidden agenda stuff by these tools.


Exactly like all the supporter disquiet with Thompson, Malthouse and even Clarkson when the respective clubs were doing poorly.

The only positive from the protests is that clubs made changes to the support structures for these coaches and in our case forced MM to recruit Jolly and Ball.

So history says success comes by backing the coach, and making some changes based on the legitimate outside concerns, to ultimately improve performance of the coach and team.

As Clarkson said in the interview "on the couch" last night - STABILITY is a very important part of their recent success
.


Hear! Hear!! Totally agree.

Constructive advice is NOT hating Buck's and blaming him for everything that happens at Collingwood. That is absolute bullshit.

If only some posters followed this advice.......... Crying or Very sad But like Piesnchess says, these types of eternally negative and pessimistic fans will be upset and cry us a bloody river if they won tattslotto.... Rolling Eyes
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thompsoc 



Joined: 21 Sep 2009


PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2014 2:58 pm
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Who is to blame for our pathetic kick out strategy!
Towards the end of the year you could hear a collective sigh
from the crowd when we took the kick out.
Yes, 15m kick to the deep defensive pocket
time and time again was a master stroke by bucks!

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