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think positive 
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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Well that was fast!
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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yin-YANG
Joined: 03 Oct 2011
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| Member 7167 wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | | John Wren wrote: | | Piesnchess wrote: | | John Wren wrote: | yep, the culture is so broken the players are leaving in their droves.
you are just as much a nong and clueless as spindog. perhaps you are the same person.  |
FWIW johnny, our jack is highly amused he now has so many "incarnations " on Nicks, we email each other re good whiskey buys, and he thinks its hilarious hes now collie and co. Mind you, jack could be negative yes, but these sods on here a whole new ball game now.  |
more fool you chessboy. |
Jack may be a lot of things JW, but an outright liar is not one of em, if he was collie etc, he would tell me privately by email, I assure you, to get me in on the gag too. He doesn't even have a dog, whereas Collie is a huge dog person, loves dogs. I am nobodys fool Johnny.  |
The sad thing is that Jack was a good contributor at time but dwelt too much on the negative. At the end of the day we are all a bit insular in our thoughts but some tend to be too much ying or too much yang. |
That would be too much yin or yang...
The extreme positions do seem to polarise and suggest a divide however both positions do help to define each other! Collingwood does seem to have this effect on supporters with most pie supporters considered one-eyed and many other footy followers hating the pies and all associated... including supporters and presidents!
Internally as our team drifts to the middle ranks of the competition the divide has become more apparent - we have to accept some supporters are weak and some hard - some are "perceptive fellow" looking to blame everyone and everything for not attaining premiership success and domination in every game and year and some will follow blindly all team decisions with eternal hope despite poor performances and decisions. It is life - but the thing to keep in mind is the dynamic - there is a flux and this change allows new perspectives - be open to it and rigid positions fall away and a broadening of life blossoms! Ahh Spring is in the air... 
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Love us or Hate us... we are Collingwood - you can't ignore the Mighty Magpies!!! |
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| think positive wrote: | | Well that was fast! |
Impressive wasn't it? Joined on Thursday, tanty and out Friday! Buckley's fault, of course. |
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yin-YANG
Joined: 03 Oct 2011
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The biggest brightest stars often burn out quickly...
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Love us or Hate us... we are Collingwood - you can't ignore the Mighty Magpies!!! |
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35forever
"I feel sick - dada dada dada da"
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Location: Physical=Sunshine Coast -- Mental=Vic Park
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| John Wren wrote: | | 35forever wrote: | Wow! The abuse has started, that's always a turning point. "Nong", "clueless" and "Sods" is the opening gambit, not strong, but it's a sign the rhetorically penniless are getting angry. I think they know the truth somewhere and lash out at those prodding them to look, after all, it's a sight no Collingwood supporter, however ambivalent, wants to see, "If only I can shove my fingers deep into my auditory canals and sing "La-La-La-La""
I think we should call those opposed to the '"perceptive fellow"', (as well as to truth and civility) the "Blind Freddies". Nathan's BF's. Won't be many of you left this time next year. I do hope they wait until the off -season begins, you don't get good replacement coaches mid-year. I guess Rocket would take over until season's end while we court what's left in the coaching pool. God I hope they don't get a "nearly got there" like Eade, Wallace, or Laidley. Much more likely is that they'll approach Lethal, and if that fails to bear fruit they'll look at the assistants who've done well. Generally these are fair to middling former players who've shown a bit in the job, preferably under one of the current competitors, but they mostly take a few years to show their best. I imagine Leigh Tudor would be near the top if he was still available.
Of course if we'd done it "back" in 2014, we could've had the most desirable option, a proven, successful coach. But Bomber certainly won't be available now, he's busy taking (insert club here - my guess is GCS) to the finals.
Naturally our new guy will likely only last a couple of seasons as too much damage was done by holding on another year. Now it has to be a major house cleaning with assistants flying thither and yon, and the President
retiring. I would have liked to keep Eddie, but he had to go down with the sinking SS Nathan.
talk about dja vu! I've seen all of this before, '76, '87, '99. Those who don't understand footy history are doomed to repeat it. |
who's getting angry? statement of fact, you along with spindog, are a nong.
i (and i suspect many others too) am getting bored and tired of the same old tripe you and the others peddle. it's ok to hold a position but to write the same dreary, ill informed rubbish post after post ruins the whole premise of the forum.
no one minds having a reasoned, thoughtful and meaningful debate on topics but it is difficult to do so with those that have little to no ability to broaden the scope of their arguments. |
Oh lord! Thats your idea of intelligent rhetoric? "You're a clueless nong and everything you say is wrong, you'd be much better if you just agreed with me"
Yeah, that's informed, reasonable, meaningful debate!
Sorry, but I state my case in an extremely well thought out and reasonable manner, but then you wouldnt know that would you? You claimed you don't bother reading my posts! What a hypocrite! All you do is attack me personally and then you have the unmitigated gall to claim that you are a fan of reasoned debate! My god there is no end to the mindless drones on here! And yes, of COURSE I repeat the main points of my thesis, its the only subject that matters at Collingwood right now, and the more I read endless personal attacks the more I will chuckle and do what I always do, talk about Collingwood Football Club and what is happening there. Fact is, the Blind Brigade just don't wanna talk about the facts, they want everyone too shut up so they can continue believing things they know are wrong. Buckley IS destroying our club. He doesn't have the players and both experienced players and vital staff are leaving at an unprecedented rate, to top that, and partly as a result of it, we are having the worst injury rate in the game's history, and it's just bad luck! Malthouse didnt have 3 years like the last three in his whole time at Collingwood, but it's just bad luck! They're getting experts in to look at why we get so many injuries, what are they gonna recommend d'ya think? Buy a rabbit's foot? Don't walk under ladders?
If you want my posts to end or to change tune then step up and respond to what I say, not how I say it. I assure you, if you can allay my fears about our direction I will not only shut up, I'll join you!
_________________
"If at first you dont succeed...
... oh who cares, we did it!!!!!"
-me, 2010
"The pies are going to the big dance!"-P.Daicos 2010
Visit My Website! |
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Breadcrawl
Joined: 14 Oct 2007
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His tanty was largely accurate
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they can smell what we're cookin' |
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Wokko 
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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If I hadn't been here for so long I'd probably join him. A once great community has become toxic and there certainly is an issue with overmoderation/merging/moving of threads.
This place hasn't been so bad since the Didak/Shaw civil war. |
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jackcass 
Joined: 01 Mar 2005
Location: Bendigo
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| Collingwood Crackerjack wrote: | | Who's record are you referring to? I may have lost track of the thread before posting |
Buckley's finals record. |
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ThePieMind
Joined: 11 Apr 2009
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| 35forever wrote: | [ more likely is that they'll approach Lethal, and if that fails to bear fruit they'll look at the assistants who've done well. Generally these are fair to middling former players who've shown a bit in the job, preferably under one of the current competitors, but they mostly take a few years to show
Oh lord! Thats your idea of intelligent rhetoric? "You're a clueless nong and everything you say is wrong, you'd be much better if you just agreed with me"
Yeah, that's informed, reasonable, meaningful debate!
Sorry, but I state my case in an extremely well thought out and reasonable manner, but then you wouldnt know that would you? You claimed you don't bother reading my posts! What a hypocrite! All you do is attack me personally and then you have the unmitigated gall to claim that you are a fan of reasoned debate! My god there is no end to the mindless drones on here! And yes, of COURSE I repeat the main points of my thesis, its the only subject that matters at Collingwood right now, and the more I read endless personal attacks the more I will chuckle and do what I always do, talk about Collingwood Football Club and what is happening there. Fact is, the Blind Brigade just don't wanna talk about the facts, they want everyone too shut up so they can continue believing things they know are wrong. Buckley IS destroying our club. He doesn't have the players and both experienced players and vital staff are leaving at an unprecedented rate, to top that, and partly as a result of it, we are having the worst injury rate in the game's history, and it's just bad luck! Malthouse didnt have 3 years like the last three in his whole time at Collingwood, but it's just bad luck! They're getting experts in to look at why we get so many injuries, what are they gonna recommend d'ya think? Buy a rabbit's foot? Don't walk under ladders?
If you want my posts to end or to change tune then step up and respond to what I say, not how I say it. I assure you, if you can allay my fears about our direction I will not only shut up, I'll join you! |
Sport you're the one that doesn't want to talk about the facts - you mistake vacuous rhetoric as compelling facts.
You have not been able to make any sensible or logical argument yet to support dumping Bucks - your falsehoods below are easily dismissed.
- players hate him - except that players are staying when its time to re-sign
- changing coach always works - except the opposite is true
- injuries are his fault - when Davoren is the problem
- H should stay - except you can't offer any insight on how his heightened sensitivities can be managed going forward.
Any reasonable on looker would simply conclude that your infatuation with the key board is more important than the quality of the out put. |
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tommo
Joined: 14 Aug 2007
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I don't think I've ever actually read a post by 35forever. It's not that I don't have the concentration, I just don't want to listen to someone who clearly thinks their opinion is solely what this forum is about, and that they are the only correct ones with all the answers. That's what writing a paragraph on every thread will do.
Just keep it simple, you've got too much time on your hands, do something productive.
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Black and White - Through and Through - Side by Side - Us against Them |
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John Wren 
"Look after the game. It means so much to so many."
Joined: 15 Jul 2007
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| Wokko wrote: | If I hadn't been here for so long I'd probably join him. A once great community has become toxic and there certainly is an issue with overmoderation/merging/moving of threads.
This place hasn't been so bad since the Didak/Shaw civil war. |
i thought the great big consolidated malthouse thread gave that civil war a good run for its money.
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Purveyor of sanctimonious twaddle. |
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John Wren
"Look after the game. It means so much to so many."
Joined: 15 Jul 2007
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| ThePieMind wrote: | | 35forever wrote: | [ more likely is that they'll approach Lethal, and if that fails to bear fruit they'll look at the assistants who've done well. Generally these are fair to middling former players who've shown a bit in the job, preferably under one of the current competitors, but they mostly take a few years to show
Oh lord! Thats your idea of intelligent rhetoric? "You're a clueless nong and everything you say is wrong, you'd be much better if you just agreed with me"
Yeah, that's informed, reasonable, meaningful debate!
Sorry, but I state my case in an extremely well thought out and reasonable manner, but then you wouldnt know that would you? You claimed you don't bother reading my posts! What a hypocrite! All you do is attack me personally and then you have the unmitigated gall to claim that you are a fan of reasoned debate! My god there is no end to the mindless drones on here! And yes, of COURSE I repeat the main points of my thesis, its the only subject that matters at Collingwood right now, and the more I read endless personal attacks the more I will chuckle and do what I always do, talk about Collingwood Football Club and what is happening there. Fact is, the Blind Brigade just don't wanna talk about the facts, they want everyone too shut up so they can continue believing things they know are wrong. Buckley IS destroying our club. He doesn't have the players and both experienced players and vital staff are leaving at an unprecedented rate, to top that, and partly as a result of it, we are having the worst injury rate in the game's history, and it's just bad luck! Malthouse didnt have 3 years like the last three in his whole time at Collingwood, but it's just bad luck! They're getting experts in to look at why we get so many injuries, what are they gonna recommend d'ya think? Buy a rabbit's foot? Don't walk under ladders?
If you want my posts to end or to change tune then step up and respond to what I say, not how I say it. I assure you, if you can allay my fears about our direction I will not only shut up, I'll join you! |
Sport you're the one that doesn't want to talk about the facts - you mistake vacuous rhetoric as compelling facts.
You have not been able to make any sensible or logical argument yet to support dumping Bucks - your falsehoods below are easily dismissed.
- players hate him - except that players are staying when its time to re-sign
- changing coach always works - except the opposite is true
- injuries are his fault - when Davoren is the problem
- H should stay - except you can't offer any insight on how his heightened sensitivities can be managed going forward.
Any reasonable on looker would simply conclude that your infatuation with the key board is more important than the quality of the out put. |
apparently buckley is destroying the club. there is not going to be much of it soon. everyone will have left before the start of next season. no wonder we have no hope next year ... according to some.
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Purveyor of sanctimonious twaddle. |
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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| think positive wrote: | | Well that was fast! |
The words no man likes to hear
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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E
Joined: 05 May 2010
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| Bucksbuild wrote: | Contending again by 2016 Jake
Williams Keeffe Langdon
Sinclair Brown Seedsman
Witts Pendlebury Thomas
Beams Sidebottom Adams
Reid Cloke Broomhead
Swan Clark Elliott
Toovey Goldsack Grundy Blair
Res
Marsh Frost Scharenberg
Ramsay Moore Armstrong
M Cox Macaffer Kennedy
Young Karnezis Freeman
Dwyer White Fasolo
Oxley Gault Martin |
i looked at your two teams. Not sure who would win that contest! we are certainly covered on the 15-22 quality player. we just need more of these guys to join Pendles, Beams, Sidey and Cloke as E-lite (Swan is also E-lite, but i dont think he will be by 2016)! Need 12 E-Lite players to win a flag!
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Ohhh, the Premiership's a cakewalk ....... |
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35forever
"I feel sick - dada dada dada da"
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Location: Physical=Sunshine Coast -- Mental=Vic Park
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I tend to agree with E, we need a dozen elite, or close to it to be competitive. Makes it all the sadder that we are losing elite players at the rate of 2-3 per year. Even so we have a fair list of younger players who could be elite, but their development has stalled. Why did Grundy fail to take the next step this season? Maybe it was the dreaded second year curse? I could believe that, seen it happen to too many kids to disregard it out of hand. It's the kind of thing that would be awfully difficult to find empirical proof for, how would you design an experiment? Still there's plenty of anecdotal evidence. On the other hand we have a slew of players who didnt take the big steps forward we expected in 2014. Jamie Elliot could be seen as an exception, and among the senior players Steelo certainly took a big step in most peoples judgement, but then he didn't play alongside Buckley, those who did struggled this year, either with injury or form.
| Quote: | Sport you're the one that doesn't want to talk about the facts - you mistake vacuous rhetoric as compelling facts.
You have not been able to make any sensible or logical argument yet to support dumping Bucks - your falsehoods below are easily dismissed.
- players hate him - except that players are staying when its time to re-sign
- changing coach always works - except the opposite is true
- injuries are his fault - when Davoren is the problem
- H should stay - except you can't offer any insight on how his heightened sensitivities can be managed going forward.
Any reasonable on looker would simply conclude that your infatuation with the key board is more important than the quality of the out put. |
Sport? Who says 'Sport'? Anyway you made a few points amongst the personal stuff - hey, I get it, you can't help yourself, but let's address those, despite their being wildly inaccurate, though I do wish you'd try to make it a bit harder:
1. Players Hate him (Bucks). Sorry, but when did I say that? Don't remember it! I don't believe anyone at Collingwood hates him, neither do I. He was my favourite player for a decade. But of course players don't need to hate the guy for their game to be affected, they just need to perceive that he isn't the coach his predecessor was. You can hardly "dismiss" my points if you don't know what they are. can you?
2. - changing coach always works Didn't say that either! Do you read my posts or not? my guess is that you skim through them looking for words which confirm your frankly childish prejudice. What I DID say is that each & every time we've gone outside the club to snag a big-name coach it's worked. Hafey, Matthews, Malthouse, the last two bought flags, the first brought 5 Grand Finals in 5 years, some call that failure, I don't. but that's just semantics. Changing coaches doesn't often work when you're struggling and bring in an untried, relatively unknown guy. My whole thesis in this area gained further proof this season as Roos made a huge change in the culture at Melbourne. They won twice as many games with a far better percentage, but that's really not what matters, everyone saw the improvement in morale and energy, they are obviously a side heading North, not South. Brisbane's stupid gamble, on the other hand, where they thought they were getting Roos and dumped a popular coach, but ended up having to use their own assistant, saw them take a nose-dive despite showing off a slew of potential new champions. I don't think that point is in any danger!
3. - injuries are his fault - when Davoren is the problem Okay at least this one I said, or at least implied, well done! And yes, this I believe though it's probably the number one bone of contention here because the BB (blind brigade) must necessarily base their entire case on this very shaky foundation: If Buckley or his staff changes were to blame for the unprecedented number of soft tissue injuries their entire argument (I.E: He deserves an injury-free season to show his wares) falls to little, itty-bitty, teensy-weensy bits & pieces. Sadly that's precisely what happens because of the simply unprecedented nature of those injuries, Three times I've asked the BB to provide another example of a side having 3 straight years of 'Bad Luck' beginning almost the day a new coach takes over. Their reply? absolutely zero. Buckley turned the fitness & development dept upside down and brought in his own guys. We had the best there was under Malthouse, with Butters and Al Richardson looking after fitness & development respectively, but Richardson has gone to StKilda and Butters to Carlton, obviously I don't blame Richardson's departure on Buckley, but Butters is another story, there have been rumours he was frustrated with Buckley's methods, and Buckley's silence in all the articles about Butters' departure is deafening, we just get Pert feeding us the old line about leaving with the best wishes of the club, yada yada yada. God, they have become politician-like in their ability to lie to the media and the fans.
4. - H should stay - except you can't offer any insight on how his heightened sensitivities can be managed going forward.
Wow! That's fully half your points based on things I actually said! Maybe there's hope for you yet!? Nah, just playin' widcha!
After all, the argument itself is fallacious, it's predicated on my knowledge of Hertier and his 'sensitivities' I've met the guy briefly but certainly gained no insight into his psychological make-up. The point, which you seem determined to miss, is that Hertier has already acknowledged that his attitude needs adjustment and he has given an undertaking to address it. He's also said he wants to stay. What more do you want? The man himself has provided the answer to your (sorta) question, making it rather pointless. Of course Heath Shaw gave the same undertaking last year, for all the good it did him. Hertier will probably take his skills, footy nous and 199 games of experience elsewhere as the club is determined to get rid of our experienced players. Hertier is one of the most popular players at Collingwood (which seems to make you a target for Buckley) and it would take very little for the players to forgive his over-reaction in this case and move on, but Collingwood wanted an excuse and Hertier handed them one. If he ends up leaving we'll have a pretty good idea who leaked this trivial matter.
To sum up; I have no dislike of any kind for Nathan Buckley and would be more than happy for him to stay if he gave any clue that he recognised that he'd made mistakes and was determined to address them, but no, all we hear is that he is perfect and it's the players who need to be 'more resilient'. In case any of you missed it I'll say it again: If you change nothing, then nothing changes. To suggest that I "only support Collingwood when it's winning" is utterly absurd. My love of Collingwood didn't waver during the dark days of the '70's, the wilderness years of the 80's, or the sudden and heartbreaking plummet into the abyss which made up most of the 90's. It certainly isn't going to flag now. There is a difference though, during most of those dark days we had an ordinary list, that is not the case here. Look at the finals we missed, of the four sides remaining we beat 3 this year. We also beat 5 of the 8 finalists. There is no reasonable excuse for such a team not being part of the September action as far as the list is concerned, so there is no alternative but to look at the coaching and fitness staff, Ockham's razor forces us to find that our methods, rather than 20 odd individual failures of body parts, are the reason for our debilitating 3rd straight year of injuries. And even without those injuries we had far too many players performing well below their best. So either Hertier, Marley, JT, Clokey, Ball, Seedy, Brodie, Swanny, and yes, even Pendles had years they would rather forget due to 9 separate problems or because they all had the same problem, which is more likely?
_________________
"If at first you dont succeed...
... oh who cares, we did it!!!!!"
-me, 2010
"The pies are going to the big dance!"-P.Daicos 2010
Visit My Website! |
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