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Wokko 
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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You know WPT, I thought of that as soon as this issue came up and contemplated whether to post it or not, considering the sense of humour gene is decidedly lacking around here lately. Glad you did though  |
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| Look, I just don't think it's OK to make jokes like that in this day and age. Some of us are, after all, philosophers by training. |
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JC Hartley 
16 premierships now in the history books. Let's be the first club to 17 premierships.
Joined: 22 Dec 2008
Location: South Yarra
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Breadcrawl
Joined: 14 Oct 2007
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So should all Australians be offended by that or just gay people?
Is there anyone named Bruce in the room? Were you offended?
My name isn't Bruce but I am offended on behalf of people named Bruce. I am sure that I can imagine what it would be like to be called Bruce and watch that skit. I feel it is my civic duty to act as a white knight and selflessly defend the cause of Bruces everywhere. If not me then who?
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they can smell what we're cookin' |
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think positive 
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| Pies4shaw wrote: | | Look, I just don't think it's OK to make jokes like that in this day and age. Some of us are, after all, philosophers by training. |
"In" training, I think it's "in" training, or no coach to argue with
_________________
You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| All? |
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Redlight
Joined: 11 Jun 2009
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| JC Hartley wrote: | http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/heritier-lumumba-set-to-leave-collingwood-while-melbourne-forward-mitch-clark-eyes-magpies/story-fndv8g1a-1227060688975
I think this tells us that he has ceased as a player for our club. |
This really bothers me...
| Quote: | | The 27-year-old, with has played a remarkably durable 186 games in the past eight years, has promised to keep in check his renowned outbursts at a new home. |
Why not make the same commitment to the place that has bent over backwards to accommodate you?
Maybe parting ways is for the best. |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| Redlight wrote: | | JC Hartley wrote: | http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/heritier-lumumba-set-to-leave-collingwood-while-melbourne-forward-mitch-clark-eyes-magpies/story-fndv8g1a-1227060688975
I think this tells us that he has ceased as a player for our club. |
This really bothers me...
| Quote: | | The 27-year-old, with has played a remarkably durable 186 games in the past eight years, has promised to keep in check his renowned outbursts at a new home. |
Why not make the same commitment to the place that has bent over backwards to accommodate you?
Maybe parting ways is for the best. |
Simply because he knows that other clubs are unlikely to have him. Being high-maintenance is fine until you realise that no-one's prepared to pay the maintenance bill.
_________________
Two more flags before I die! |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| think positive wrote: | | nomadjack wrote: | | 1061 wrote: | | Mugwump wrote: | | One more perspective on this. For me, the real problem is that H is trying to impose his personal / political views on the club. Let's say that another player has strong political views opposed to immigration, or views Anzac Day as a militarist event. Would that player be justified in taking offence at fairly mild remarks made by those with different views, and threatening to resign? . |
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You're wrong
He was trying to insist professional Australian workplace practises be enforced! |
Agree completely. But there is also a professional and productive way to go about raising concerns. By most accounts, including his manager's H overstepped the mark and not for the first time. While H has every right to insist on a professional workplace and club culture the club has every right to insist its players meet expected standards of behaviour as well and to move players on that can't meet those standards. |
Well said, and can be applied to many other threads where player behaviour is discussed.
Respect is always a two way street. |
Technically that's true, but personally, I struggle to believe that this was motivated by H's concern for the workplace technicalities of the Equality Act (2010). I feel it's more likely that he was using a slightly mild case to make a political stand, and then made the case in a way that was ham-fisted and probably alienated the people he was trying to influence. Given the way he reportedly made that case, though, it seems more likely to me that it was about Heritier's sense of himself as a campaigner, rather than the intrinsic merits of the specific issue.
He's a good young man, and a premiership hero, and I'm sad to see him leave. However, when a player walks out twice in two years and it gets into the media, it suggests to me that he cannot figure out how to represent his views with reason, modesty, magnanimity and friendship, instead of hyperbolic accusations and threats of resignation. I think he'll learn, with time, that most people are far more moved by the former than the latter.
If he goes to Melbourne I'll wish him well, and feel that it's probably for the best in his life journey.
_________________
Two more flags before I die! |
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1061
Joined: 06 Sep 2013
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Lets face it his best years as an AFL player are behind him, he would probably be a good fit for say Geelong if they wanna top up for one last serious attack at a flag.
I'd like to think no one wishes H anything but good fortune unlike Thomas as although he caused a drama he isn't going for a BS reason. I don't like the fella and his form over the past couple of years have not warranted selection at times so I don't think we will miss him on or off the field. |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| Mugwump wrote: | | think positive wrote: | | nomadjack wrote: | | 1061 wrote: | | Mugwump wrote: | | One more perspective on this. For me, the real problem is that H is trying to impose his personal / political views on the club. Let's say that another player has strong political views opposed to immigration, or views Anzac Day as a militarist event. Would that player be justified in taking offence at fairly mild remarks made by those with different views, and threatening to resign? . |
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You're wrong
He was trying to insist professional Australian workplace practises be enforced! |
Agree completely. But there is also a professional and productive way to go about raising concerns. By most accounts, including his manager's H overstepped the mark and not for the first time. While H has every right to insist on a professional workplace and club culture the club has every right to insist its players meet expected standards of behaviour as well and to move players on that can't meet those standards. |
Well said, and can be applied to many other threads where player behaviour is discussed.
Respect is always a two way street. |
Technically that's true, but personally, I struggle to believe that this was motivated by H's concern for the workplace technicalities of the Equality Act (2010). I feel it's more likely that he was using a slightly mild case to make a political stand, and then made the case in a way that was ham-fisted and probably alienated the people he was trying to influence. Given the way he reportedly made that case, though, it seems more likely to me that it was about Heritier's sense of himself as a campaigner, rather than the intrinsic merits of the specific issue.
He's a good young man, and a premiership hero, and I'm sad to see him leave. However, when a player walks out twice in two years and it gets into the media, it suggests to me that he cannot figure out how to represent his views with reason, modesty, magnanimity and friendship, instead of hyperbolic accusations and threats of resignation. I think he'll learn, with time, that most people are far more moved by the former than the latter.
If he goes to Melbourne I'll wish him well, and feel that it's probably for the best in his life journey. |
Just like Heater and Dawes, I hope I never have reason to wish anything but the best for H. (Ya know like beating us off his own boot!).
Funny him going to the Demons, I reckon he needs to face his own demons too, and what about better the devil you know! He's been at the Pies a long time, he's going to miss his mates, surely.
Curtailing a behavioural trait just ain't that easy. I get a feeling retirement is what he needs. Or maybe I'm just being selfish and don't want to see him play against us.
I still think he has a lot to offer, he's not finished yet, but I'm wondering how much his issues have to do with.his performance. And I still think this year there were times we would have looked a damn sight worse without him.
_________________
You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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Pies4shaw
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| JC Hartley wrote: | http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/heritier-lumumba-set-to-leave-collingwood-while-melbourne-forward-mitch-clark-eyes-magpies/story-fndv8g1a-1227060688975
I think this tells us that he has ceased as a player for our club. |
The content of the "player review" put up on the Collingwood FC site is similarly interesting - it isn't like the Club is pretending it's a storm in a tea-cup and isn't worthy of comment. Selected (but not intentionally selective) quotes follow:
"Post-season speculation indicated he might seek to continue his career elsewhere in 2014."
"Lumumba has been remarkably consistent when it comes to winning the footy in recent years. He won 420 disposals in 2014. In 2013, he won 424, while in 2011 he won 420. In fact, he has won between 402 and 424 disposals in five of his past six seasons."
'They said it
"(We're) working through some situations to get the best opportunity for both club and player. There's no hatred, there's no friction, or anything else like that. There's different points of view, it's as simple as that. You never know, maybe we can get things sorted out,” – President Eddie McGuire, Friday 5 September.'
"What happens next?
While his playing future remains up in the air, Lumumba’s best football will always bring a smile to the Magpie Army’s face. His work on the wing was important in a young team in 2014 and he has lost none of the burst speed that helps turn defence into attack."
http://www.collingwoodfc.com.au/news/2014-09-16/player-review-no-8-heritier-lumumba |
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RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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| Mugwump wrote: | | think positive wrote: | | nomadjack wrote: | | 1061 wrote: | | Mugwump wrote: | | One more perspective on this. For me, the real problem is that H is trying to impose his personal / political views on the club. Let's say that another player has strong political views opposed to immigration, or views Anzac Day as a militarist event. Would that player be justified in taking offence at fairly mild remarks made by those with different views, and threatening to resign? . |
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You're wrong
He was trying to insist professional Australian workplace practises be enforced! |
Agree completely. But there is also a professional and productive way to go about raising concerns. By most accounts, including his manager's H overstepped the mark and not for the first time. While H has every right to insist on a professional workplace and club culture the club has every right to insist its players meet expected standards of behaviour as well and to move players on that can't meet those standards. |
Well said, and can be applied to many other threads where player behaviour is discussed.
Respect is always a two way street. |
Technically that's true, but personally, I struggle to believe that this was motivated by H's concern for the workplace technicalities of the Equality Act (2010). I feel it's more likely that he was using a slightly mild case to make a political stand, and then made the case in a way that was ham-fisted and probably alienated the people he was trying to influence. Given the way he reportedly made that case, though, it seems more likely to me that it was about Heritier's sense of himself as a campaigner, rather than the intrinsic merits of the specific issue.
He's a good young man, and a premiership hero, and I'm sad to see him leave. However, when a player walks out twice in two years and it gets into the media, it suggests to me that he cannot figure out how to represent his views with reason, modesty, magnanimity and friendship, instead of hyperbolic accusations and threats of resignation. I think he'll learn, with time, that most people are far more moved by the former than the latter.
If he goes to Melbourne I'll wish him well, and feel that it's probably for the best in his life journey. |
An excellent summation. |
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Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
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WHAT if H ends up at the desert wasteland that is the Deees, and someone makes a slight Gay gag about a fellow player, very innocuous, will he spit the dummy there too, and haul Roos over the coals for some perceived inaction ? Just saying.
_________________
Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
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The Prototype 
Paint my face with a good-for-nothin smile.
Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Location: Hobart, Tasmania
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