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Should this player have been allowed on the court?
Yes
68%
 68%  [ 11 ]
No, the physicality is an unfair advantage
31%
 31%  [ 5 ]
Any ideas for a third option welcome!
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 16

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think positive Libra

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:01 pm
Post subject: Gender questionReply with quote

My daughter played netball tonight, and a player on the other team straight away struck me as being a guy. This is ladies not mixed! I said to my co coach, I'm sure that's a bloke. She said yeah the girls were discussing it before the game. I said he's got a five o'clock shadow! The player got pulled up for contact, and our player was told"please wait til HE , err, SHE is out of play. Deep voice check. So gossiping after the game, and an umpire player tells us he put in papers that he's legally a she and they have to let, um, her play.

So how is that fair?

This player knocked over our goal attack several times, she's about 40 kg drippng wet, my daughter is about 5'9" this guy was at least 2 inches taller, and as you'd expect as strong as a mallee bull. And there's the vertical jump thing, woman can't do it. No I have no problem with transgenders gay rights etc etc, but what about the rights of the ladies on the court?

We kicked thier butt, so that's not the point. several players were run through like a rugby scrum, that's fine if you choose to play mixed.

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Joined: 06 Sep 2013


PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:13 pm
Post subject: Re: Gender questionReply with quote

think positive wrote:
My daughter played netball tonight, and a player on the other team straight away struck me as being a guy. This is ladies not mixed! I said to my co coach, I'm sure that's a bloke. She said yeah the girls were discussing it before the game. I said he's got a five o'clock shadow! The player got pulled up for contact, and our player was told"please wait til HE , err, SHE is out of play. Deep voice check. So gossiping after the game, and an umpire player tells us he put in papers that he's legally a she and they have to let, um, her play.

So how is that fair?

This player knocked over our goal attack several times, she's about 40 kg drippng wet, my daughter is about 5'9" this guy was at least 2 inches taller, and as you'd expect as strong as a mallee bull. And there's the vertical jump thing, woman can't do it. No I have no problem with transgenders gay rights etc etc, but what about the rights of the ladies on the court?

We kicked thier butt, so that's not the point. several players were run through like a rugby scrum, that's fine if you choose to play mixed.


I thought that kind of thinking(bigotry) went out last century.
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stui magpie Gemini

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Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:20 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

I vote yes they should be allowed on. Any physical advantage should be offset by an umpire with half a clue.

just because they were a bloke doesn't automatically mean a physical gorilla. Stick David in the opposition team (for example just to follow up on the 14 year old girl schtick) and your girls would not be fussed compared to an Islander or Maori chick who's built like a brick shithouse.

I'll make the assumption that the kid has identified as trans gender and is undergoing hormone treatment and has letters from doctors etc. netball is supposed to be a non contact sport, a transgender kid can't do much more damage than a big fat biatch with an attitude.

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sixpoints 



Joined: 27 Sep 2010
Location: Lulie Street

PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:25 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

Victorian Equal Opportunity Act may cover this. Discrimination based upon someone's gender identity is unlawful. If she is legally female, what is the issue. It's the law.
What exactly are these 'rights' that people always seem to bang on about?
The 'right' to do what exactly?
We have legislation.
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think positive Libra

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Joined: 30 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:28 pm
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Hmm, ok ,but we are not talking kids. Fair enough we have kids, 17-19 in our team, this guy would be at least 25. But yes it's Ladies A/B grade, your out there so...

But no, I don't think it's fair, and that doesn't make me a bigot. It's ladies comp. he could play mixed. He's a man, I don't care what you chop off, he's still a man. Even if mentally a woman, it's a mans body. If you let him play, why not any man? What can't men put on a dress and run in a woman's event? What is the difference?

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think positive Libra

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:31 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

stui magpie wrote:
I vote yes they should be allowed on. Any physical advantage should be offset by an umpire with half a clue.

just because they were a bloke doesn't automatically mean a physical gorilla. Stick David in the opposition team (for example just to follow up on the 14 year old girl schtick) and your girls would not be fussed compared to an Islander or Maori chick who's built like a brick shithouse.

I'll make the assumption that the kid has identified as trans gender and is undergoing hormone treatment and has letters from doctors etc. netball is supposed to be a non contact sport, a transgender kid can't do much more damage than a big fat biatch with an attitude.


An umpire with half a clue. Yeah that would be nice. It's an A/B comp, one rule for us, no rules for them. It seems stepping and played ball is fine if your B grade!

But you have a point. It shits me the big Maori chicks get away with the rough play too.

This guy could easily be on the local footy team though.

So what's the difference? Why couldn't you just rock up to play? The legality thing is bullshit, it's still a man.

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Last edited by think positive on Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:37 pm; edited 1 time in total
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think positive Libra

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Joined: 30 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:34 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

sixpoints wrote:
Victorian Equal Opportunity Act may cover this. Discrimination based upon someone's gender identity is unlawful. If she is legally female, what is the issue. It's the law.
What exactly are these 'rights' that people always seem to bang on about?
The 'right' to do what exactly?
We have legislation.


The right to play in a ladies comp against ladies. Ok females! Not many ladies left these days!

For one, watch a mixed game, the guys do that basketball straight up leap, it's almost impossible to shoot past, woman can't do it, it's not physically possible. Watch a little ladies basketball versus the men's, that's a massive advantage.

Seems to me the only people who don't have it's own rights group are straight, white, 'normal'!

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stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:41 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

think positive wrote:
sixpoints wrote:
Victorian Equal Opportunity Act may cover this. Discrimination based upon someone's gender identity is unlawful. If she is legally female, what is the issue. It's the law.
What exactly are these 'rights' that people always seem to bang on about?
The 'right' to do what exactly?
We have legislation.


The right to play in a ladies comp against ladies. Ok females! Not many ladies left these days!

For one, watch a mixed game, the guys do that basketball straight up leap, it's almost impossible to shoot past, woman can't do it, it's not physically possible. Watch a little ladies basketball versus the men's, that's a massive advantage.

Seems to me the only people who don't have it's own rights group are straight, white, 'normal'!


Really? I've never noticed that. Chicks can't vertical jump? Confused

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sixpoints 



Joined: 27 Sep 2010
Location: Lulie Street

PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:48 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

think positive wrote:
sixpoints wrote:
Victorian Equal Opportunity Act may cover this. Discrimination based upon someone's gender identity is unlawful. If she is legally female, what is the issue. It's the law.
What exactly are these 'rights' that people always seem to bang on about?
The 'right' to do what exactly?
We have legislation.


The right to play in a ladies comp against ladies. Ok females! Not many ladies left these days!

For one, watch a mixed game, the guys do that basketball straight up leap, it's almost impossible to shoot past, woman can't do it, it's not physically possible. Watch a little ladies basketball versus the men's, that's a massive advantage.





Seems to me the only people who don't have it's own rights group are straight, white, 'normal'!


Geez, that last bit is a little over the top.
Poor straight, white, normal people you must be doing it so tough!
Try living as a gay Asian or transgender Aboriginal and see if life treats you any better!
Welcome to netball Ms Transgender - we are not happy and would like to ban you....Yours sincerely, the straight, white normal people.
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think positive Libra

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:53 pm
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Stui- Watch the little pop you guys do, you launch and then kick, think Jordan! Woman kinda have to go in on an angle. It's a little thing, unless your shooting!defenders have to be three feet away. Only once in maybe a thousand games defending, did it leap up and stop the ball before it got to the ring, I even did the double and rebounded back up to catch it! I'll never forget it, I felt like super, um, man! I watch a bit of the mixed games on a Thursday, the guys do it EVERY time! So they have a guy shooting, who jump pops over the defender, and a defender doing the same to the shooter! Watch the highest grade netball (which is really boring, to clinical) you rarely see the defender intercept on a goal shoot, they get rebounds, but not intercepts pre ring.
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Last edited by think positive on Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:56 pm; edited 1 time in total
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HAL 

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Joined: 17 Mar 2003


PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:55 pm
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think positive Libra

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Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere

PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 10:56 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

sixpoints wrote:
think positive wrote:
sixpoints wrote:
Victorian Equal Opportunity Act may cover this. Discrimination based upon someone's gender identity is unlawful. If she is legally female, what is the issue. It's the law.
What exactly are these 'rights' that people always seem to bang on about?
The 'right' to do what exactly?
We have legislation.


The right to play in a ladies comp against ladies. Ok females! Not many ladies left these days!

For one, watch a mixed game, the guys do that basketball straight up leap, it's almost impossible to shoot past, woman can't do it, it's not physically possible. Watch a little ladies basketball versus the men's, that's a massive advantage.





Seems to me the only people who don't have it's own rights group are straight, white, 'normal'!


Geez, that last bit is a little over the top.
Poor straight, white, normal people you must be doing it so tough!
Try living as a gay Asian or transgender Aboriginal and see if life treats you any better!
Welcome to netball Ms Transgender - we are not happy and would like to ban you....Yours sincerely, the straight, white normal people.


Actually I didn't say poor straight white, normal, poor people have rights groups too! Wink

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ronrat 



Joined: 22 May 2006
Location: Thailand

PostPosted: Fri Aug 29, 2014 12:04 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

think positive wrote:
stui magpie wrote:
I vote yes they should be allowed on. Any physical advantage should be offset by an umpire with half a clue.


An umpire with half a clue. Yeah that would be nice. It's an A/B comp, one rule for us, no rules for them. It seems stepping and played ball is fine if your B grade!


So how long has Justin Shitt and matt Stevic being umpiring netball.

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David Libra

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Joined: 27 Jul 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 29, 2014 1:17 am
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Jo, I take the majority view here. A male-to-female transsexual person is legally and, according to mainstream medical opinion these days, cognitively a female. That's what they are. Some may be a little stronger than average, but so what? It's still well within the variation of normal female body types; so, exactly the same as if a woman happened to be born with unusual strength or height wanted to play.

One thing's for sure: I can assure you they didn't transition just so they could beat everybody at netball!

Honestly, transsexuals are probably just about the most discriminated against and misunderstood people in the Western world; I think allowing them to play in the right sport for their gender (and letting them use the correct toilets, which can still be a big problem) is the least we can do. It's actually a hugely important aspect of the transition process.

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think positive Libra

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 29, 2014 7:30 am
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Probably a good thing cos he can't play for shit, but he's a good battering ram!

I get the legalities, even the toilet thing, and I guess maybe if it wasn't so obvious we wouldn't have questioned it, but it really did seem like just a guy in a dress! If I'd seen this question on a board, I'd say exactly the same thing, but I saw it happen, and I gotta say, it didn't seem fair. I'm not talking legal, I'm talking fair play.

I asked junior, she wasn't fussed, apart from him knocking over her friend 1 too many times.


And yes Ronrat, those umpires you mention I'm sure it's them, they are that bad!

Thanks for those that managed to give a reasonable view, as you would at an, um, tavern in real life. Nice to have almost a full discussion without being lambasted in the process. Cheers

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