Israeli/Palestinian conflict: will it ever end?

[regan is true fullback]

[David]

That may be true historically, RiTF, but Israel is there now and I think Israelis have as much claim to the land�their land, mind you, not that of Gaza or the West Bank�as the Palestinians have theirs.

For me and I think most others, the only reasonable solution to this issue is two independent states. Anybody standing in the way of that, in either Likud or Hamas, deserves the strongest possible condemnation.

[Pies4shaw]

On what basis could either side deserve "the strongest possible condemnation"? Isn't trying to put all of the neighbours in body bags just a local form of international diplomacy for both?

[watt price tully]

[regan is true fullback]

what i said is not bullshit

what is bullshit is zionists like you defending the terrorist state founded on terrorism and perpetuated by terrorism whatever it does. Maybe you would like to give Europe back to the Romans? About the time the Jewish state existed.

As I said you would save the American taxpayer billions if you all went back where you came from - America

The Dutch in Africa and the Jews in Palestine were allies during the apartheid regime

[watt price tully]

[regan is true fullback]

At the end of the day you have no argument, except force of arms. like the Chinese in Tibet, like the Indonesians in East Timor. So might is right.

And like most Zionists you chose verbal abuse as your stock in trade, as your mob usually does to silence dissent. Which is why I went off at you.

I choose to end this pointless tirade with each other as it's getting us no where. I am putting you on ignore like Hal.

however consider this, the state of Israel was set up as a land without people for a people without land. This is patently untrue. Yet another big lie.

I must be doing something right, the Catholic right in the Philippines calls me a communist and the Zionists call me a fascist

[watt price tully]

[Pies4shaw]

So I guess the answer to the question posed by the OP is a resounding "no", then?

[stui magpie]

[Wokko]

I'm no friend of Israel, but there are plenty of Jews there that don't like what's going on and just want to live in peace with their neighbours. To infer all Israelis or all Jews are Zionist, imperialist, genocidal maniacs isn't fair. Like any society there is quite the diverse mileau, so making Israelis out as a homogenous society in lockstep isn't right. Play the ball, not the man and don't confuse ethno-religious issues with the matter at hand. If you want to make a post about Jews in general maybe start another one. Not sure how that'd go down, but hey, it beats going off topic here.

[pietillidie]

Folks, do your best to hold the legitimate fears and grievances of all parties concerned in tension.

One of the weaknesses of the human brain is that it is naturally keen to define the black and white and take sides. But when groups of humans are concerned, that always means trampling on innocent bystanders. Even in the most insane of circumstances, for every dangerous fanatic there are dozens of people who just want to get on with life, and who themselves are pressured into taking an exaggerated stance against the other party.

To be sure, there is plenty to be repulsed about powerless folk becoming the "collateral damage" of more powerful forces, as with Gaza. At the same time, Israel remains in a state of permanent and perilous existential risk. Agree or not from afar, we're kidding ourselves if we think we wouldn't over-compensate in the same way Israel does and try to extend our security and negotiation buffer zone.

As a general point, in far too many places in the world, Jewish and Muslim groups alike face threat, as seen in Europe at the moment. It started with the racist bans on minarets in Switzerland and "conspicuous religious symbols" in France", while now it's the Jewish community's turn to bear the brunt of the mob.

Racist thugs are opportunistic feeders; they'll grab any news or issue laying around to arouse fear and loathing against any weaker group, and they'll always do their best to make you feel as if you have to go all in and support one group over another. Or, just as bad, treat both groups as lesser humans not worthy of concern at all.

[stui magpie]

[David]

I don't think it's true that there are only two extreme options (or, three, including perpetuation of the status quo). What if a reformist political force emerges in Gaza? What if moderates are elected in Israel? Extremists on both sides want us to believe that it's all or nothing, which is why moderates on both sides need to be given a much bigger voice.

[stui magpie]

What if an asteroid lands on the area? Not all that more unlikely.

What if a reformist political force emerges in ISIS?

Please find me some moderates on the Gaza side who are actually there, not on the outside throwing rocks, and I'll support them.