Welfare
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| Should all citizens be granted a minimum standard of living? |
| Yes, unconditionally. |
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43% |
[ 13 ] |
| Only if they are pulling their weight or are physically/mentally incapable of doing so. |
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53% |
[ 16 ] |
| No. We are not entitled to anything from our government. |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
| Other (please specify in post). |
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3% |
[ 1 ] |
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| Total Votes : 30 |
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The Prototype 
Paint my face with a good-for-nothin smile.
Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Location: Hobart, Tasmania
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As I posted in the Budget thread I am not against people getting welfare even if they are not wanting to work but I think there needs to be a limit on the resources that are available to them. Same goes for those who are single parents, etc. Think they deserve all the help they can get.
Maybe I am a tad biased with the job seeker thing but those that are trying hard to make a go of things need all the help they can get to get from the unemployment line to the jobs they're trying to get into so a little added help cannot hurt too much.
But do think everyone should have some sort of welfare, just the amount should vary.
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https://www.facebook.com/davehardingphotography
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David 
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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Well said, Proto. A little bit of help is always necessary.
PTID, that's also a really great point. One of my ex-housemates seems to be constantly looking for work—she generally gets by on temp jobs, but often goes weeks or months without anything—but also does heaps of volunteering and community projects. She arguably contributes much more to society than someone who packs shelves at Coles and gets a full-time wage. Yet, some would describe her as a 'dole bludger'. It's all a matter of perspective, isn't it?
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"Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence." – Julian Assange |
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1061
Joined: 06 Sep 2013
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| Dave The Man wrote: | | 1061 wrote: | | stui magpie wrote: | | Obviously people who live at home with mum and dad get less. |
Not if they're smart and get Mum and Dad to write out a rent receipt! |
What Happens if they help pay the Bills with there Pension or Wage? |
Doesn't affect their pension. |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| Dave The Man wrote: | | 1061 wrote: | | stui magpie wrote: | | Obviously people who live at home with mum and dad get less. |
Not if they're smart and get Mum and Dad to write out a rent receipt! |
What Happens if they help pay the Bills with there Pension or Wage? |
So they should Dave, that's what it's for, for living on,
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| The Prototype wrote: | As I posted in the Budget thread I am not against people getting welfare even if they are not wanting to work but I think there needs to be a limit on the resources that are available to them. Same goes for those who are single parents, etc. Think they deserve all the help they can get.
Maybe I am a tad biased with the job seeker thing but those that are trying hard to make a go of things need all the help they can get to get from the unemployment line to the jobs they're trying to get into so a little added help cannot hurt too much.
But do think everyone should have some sort of welfare, just the amount should vary. |
I don't.
If they just can't be fagged getting a job, don't even look, then no, they get no help. That's the idea of super. Of savings. You want a nice long holiday to sit on your arse and so nothing, (hey don't we all at times) then you get a job like the rest of us and save so you can afford it.
Anyone who is really trying, anyone with a disability, whether physical or mental, the. Yes, give them all the help they need.
As I've said before, if scumbags were not rorting the system, those who are really in need, would, or should, be much better looked after.
And those on a long term disability pension, is there anything to stop them doing a little community service to help out? It would surely help with intergrating into society.
Self responsibility, self respect, self help.
But you just want to sit home, watch telly, have a smoke and a drink and kick back, then no, absolutely not. Why does someone deserve a free ride like that?
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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Tannin 
Can't remember
Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania
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| think positive wrote: | | But you just want to sit home, watch telly, have a smoke and a drink and kick back, then no, absolutely not. Why does someone deserve a free ride like that? |
Do try to discover the real world one day, TP. No-one can sit around smoking, let alone drinking, on the pitifully small amount the unemployment benefit pays. Just smoking alone - and this is only at the normal rate most moderate smokers go at, we are not talking heavy smoking here - is 50% of the entire benefit. Yes, you read that right: the benefit is so low that, if you smoke, you have $125 per week left for every other expense put together. Good luck paying rent with that. And you can completely forget about eating.
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�Let's eat Grandma.� Commas save lives! |
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The Prototype
Paint my face with a good-for-nothin smile.
Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Location: Hobart, Tasmania
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| think positive wrote: | I don't.
If they just can't be fagged getting a job, don't even look, then no, they get no help. That's the idea of super. Of savings. You want a nice long holiday to sit on your arse and so nothing, (hey don't we all at times) then you get a job like the rest of us and save so you can afford it.
Anyone who is really trying, anyone with a disability, whether physical or mental, the. Yes, give them all the help they need.
As I've said before, if scumbags were not rorting the system, those who are really in need, would, or should, be much better looked after.
And those on a long term disability pension, is there anything to stop them doing a little community service to help out? It would surely help with intergrating into society.
Self responsibility, self respect, self help.
But you just want to sit home, watch telly, have a smoke and a drink and kick back, then no, absolutely not. Why does someone deserve a free ride like that? |
I get what you are saying, I suppose in my soft hearted nature I believe that everyone deserves some kind of standard of living even if they're lazy assclowns. And believe me I have met a lot of vermin where I live, but I'd choose them living off of something somewhere else and not doing my stuff any harm then them turning towards further crime and such.
Not to say all would, but a fair percentage here where I am would. But it's just my personal opinion.
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Ðavâgé
https://www.facebook.com/davehardingphotography
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| Tannin wrote: | | think positive wrote: | | But you just want to sit home, watch telly, have a smoke and a drink and kick back, then no, absolutely not. Why does someone deserve a free ride like that? |
Do try to discover the real world one day, TP. No-one can sit around smoking, let alone drinking, on the pitifully small amount the unemployment benefit pays. Just smoking alone - and this is only at the normal rate most moderate smokers go at, we are not talking heavy smoking here - is 50% of the entire benefit. Yes, you read that right: the benefit is so low that, if you smoke, you have $125 per week left for every other expense put together. Good luck paying rent with that. And you can completely forget about eating. |
^^^ Yes - I've been reading this thread trying to picture who it is that would actually prefer to live on "welfare" than work to earn a bearable living. For the most part, I assume that people who don't work for a living don't work for a living because they are unable to do so viably. I don't doubt that there are people who do "choose" to rely on welfare but (save for the criminal underclass, in respect of which the failure to do a day's work is the least of our collective problems) they must be very battered and tortured souls to have made that "choice". They wouldn't be living "high on the hog" on that sort of money and I assume they need compassion, sympathy and support, not their modest "life-line" cut-off. |
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1061
Joined: 06 Sep 2013
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| Tannin wrote: | | think positive wrote: | | But you just want to sit home, watch telly, have a smoke and a drink and kick back, then no, absolutely not. Why does someone deserve a free ride like that? |
Do try to discover the real world one day, TP. No-one can sit around smoking, let alone drinking, on the pitifully small amount the unemployment benefit pays. Just smoking alone - and this is only at the normal rate most moderate smokers go at, we are not talking heavy smoking here - is 50% of the entire benefit. Yes, you read that right: the benefit is so low that, if you smoke, you have $125 per week left for every other expense put together. Good luck paying rent with that. And you can completely forget about eating. |
But that's not what the media portray so it's not what a lot of people think! |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| Tannin wrote: | | think positive wrote: | | But you just want to sit home, watch telly, have a smoke and a drink and kick back, then no, absolutely not. Why does someone deserve a free ride like that? |
Do try to discover the real world one day, TP. No-one can sit around smoking, let alone drinking, on the pitifully small amount the unemployment benefit pays. Just smoking alone - and this is only at the normal rate most moderate smokers go at, we are not talking heavy smoking here - is 50% of the entire benefit. Yes, you read that right: the benefit is so low that, if you smoke, you have $125 per week left for every other expense put together. Good luck paying rent with that. And you can completely forget about eating. |
I've personally seen different. Smoking and drinking not so much, but smoking, eating junk food and the occasional hit of ice and a few drinks. Once you pool the dole across a few like minded souls it's amazing how far it goes. Take 3 blokes sharing a 3 bedroom house paying $100 per week each rent. Add in an unemployed GF who doesn't pay rent but basically lives there and chips in for food, booze, drugs and smokes and it's surprisingly achieveable.
And in regard to Ptiddy's reference to people who don't want to work having a form of mental illness, I wouldn't go that far. Maybe personality disorder but the ones I've seen up close all have in common that they want as much as they can have without having to do anything for it. The other things that had in common were blatant immaturity, self centredness and tickets on themself.
I get the pragmatic argument about paying a minimal payment to everyone, but I couldn't agree to it. I find the concept offensive.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Wokko 
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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| To each according to his need? I think not. |
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1061
Joined: 06 Sep 2013
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| stui magpie wrote: | | Tannin wrote: | | think positive wrote: | | But you just want to sit home, watch telly, have a smoke and a drink and kick back, then no, absolutely not. Why does someone deserve a free ride like that? |
Do try to discover the real world one day, TP. No-one can sit around smoking, let alone drinking, on the pitifully small amount the unemployment benefit pays. Just smoking alone - and this is only at the normal rate most moderate smokers go at, we are not talking heavy smoking here - is 50% of the entire benefit. Yes, you read that right: the benefit is so low that, if you smoke, you have $125 per week left for every other expense put together. Good luck paying rent with that. And you can completely forget about eating. |
I've personally seen different. Smoking and drinking not so much, but smoking, eating junk food and the occasional hit of ice and a few drinks. Once you pool the dole across a few like minded souls it's amazing how far it goes. Take 3 blokes sharing a 3 bedroom house paying $100 per week each rent. Add in an unemployed GF who doesn't pay rent but basically lives there and chips in for food, booze, drugs and smokes and it's surprisingly achieveable.
And in regard to Ptiddy's reference to people who don't want to work having a form of mental illness, I wouldn't go that far. Maybe personality disorder but the ones I've seen up close all have in common that they want as much as they can have without having to do anything for it. The other things that had in common were blatant immaturity, self centredness and tickets on themself.
I get the pragmatic argument about paying a minimal payment to everyone, but I couldn't agree to it. I find the concept offensive. |
But how many dole bludgers are this orgainised as no one shares drugs unless they are sharing bodily fluids as well. A few deals on tic and before you know it bludger 1, 2 or 3 has to use all his dole to repay the dealer and his share of the rent is blown. |
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Hurricane
Joined: 17 May 2001
Location: Melbourne, VIC, AUSTRALIA
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There needs to be some level of support for all but the distribution needs to be right. There was a girl on my Facebook and she bought VIP tickets to 2 concerts including one interstate on welfare. The total of the tickets was $1500. Now she's talking about going to London to see Robbie Williams. She is dead serious and already organized her passport. She's saving for this with her dole money what?? Nobody should be able to afford those kind of luxuries on the dole. Whilst I see others like pensioners struggling not being able to turn their heating on.
*dont have her on fb anymore. Too much whinging about not being able to afford a bus ticket. One of those poor me types. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| 1061 wrote: | | stui magpie wrote: | | Tannin wrote: | | think positive wrote: | | But you just want to sit home, watch telly, have a smoke and a drink and kick back, then no, absolutely not. Why does someone deserve a free ride like that? |
Do try to discover the real world one day, TP. No-one can sit around smoking, let alone drinking, on the pitifully small amount the unemployment benefit pays. Just smoking alone - and this is only at the normal rate most moderate smokers go at, we are not talking heavy smoking here - is 50% of the entire benefit. Yes, you read that right: the benefit is so low that, if you smoke, you have $125 per week left for every other expense put together. Good luck paying rent with that. And you can completely forget about eating. |
I've personally seen different. Smoking and drinking not so much, but smoking, eating junk food and the occasional hit of ice and a few drinks. Once you pool the dole across a few like minded souls it's amazing how far it goes. Take 3 blokes sharing a 3 bedroom house paying $100 per week each rent. Add in an unemployed GF who doesn't pay rent but basically lives there and chips in for food, booze, drugs and smokes and it's surprisingly achieveable.
And in regard to Ptiddy's reference to people who don't want to work having a form of mental illness, I wouldn't go that far. Maybe personality disorder but the ones I've seen up close all have in common that they want as much as they can have without having to do anything for it. The other things that had in common were blatant immaturity, self centredness and tickets on themself.
I get the pragmatic argument about paying a minimal payment to everyone, but I couldn't agree to it. I find the concept offensive. |
But how many dole bludgers are this orgainised as no one shares drugs unless they are sharing bodily fluids as well. A few deals on tic and before you know it bludger 1, 2 or 3 has to use all his dole to repay the dealer and his share of the rent is blown. |
Mate, I'm not saying there is a great heap of them out there and I'm certainly not trying to tar everyone on centrelink with the same brush. All I'm saying is I've seen this exact scenario and I know that it's more common than people think.
For mine centrelink exists as a safety net. For those people who choose not to work, my choice would be to pay them nothing. If they then face starvation etc, then sign on to look for a job and you get centrelink.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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think positive
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| Hurricane wrote: | There needs to be some level of support for all but the distribution needs to be right. There was a girl on my Facebook and she bought VIP tickets to 2 concerts including one interstate on welfare. The total of the tickets was $1500. Now she's talking about going to London to see Robbie Williams. She is dead serious and already organized her passport. She's saving for this with her dole money what?? Nobody should be able to afford those kind of luxuries on the dole. Whilst I see others like pensioners struggling not being able to turn their heating on.
*dont have her on fb anymore. Too much whinging about not being able to afford a bus ticket. One of those poor me types. |
Beat me too it!
Woman on Facebook,works part time, hubby is on benefits because he is legally blind. She gets a carers payment because he is legally blind. Their kids both went to private school, they have a lovely home round the corner from me, nice cars, just got back today from Thailand, they went on a cruise a couple of months back. Last year she went to Thailand and got a boob job.
Good luck to em hey?
Funny, the two payments for being legally blind, yet while she merchandises the city, he drives around waiting for her, so she doesn't have to park, and walk. I also see him driving around the streets. Does he have a licence? No idea. But he's driving down my street LEGALLY BLIND!! To blind to work at any job but not to drive. Well **** me drunk!
That's nor rorting the system?
_________________
You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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