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Lazza
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Bendigo, Victoria, Australia
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[quote="HAL"] | Lazza wrote: | | MJ23 wrote: | | Culprit wrote: | | CP wrote: | Yet nobody thought to be quite so outraged when Gillard was pushing for laws to stifle freedom of speech directly fairly and squarely at News Ltd...sorry...the 'Hate Media'.
Many of you are complete hypocrites.quote]Don't forget at the same time Rhinehart spent millions on supression orders to have her families infighting from hitting the press.
Murdoch sells Views, ABC produces Agendas. Apples to Oranges. |
edited for accuracy |
I see nothing wrong with presenting agenda items for active and robust discussion and debate. In fact I think its a really healthy thing to confront and challenge ideas. I do this at work meetings. Good on the ABC for doing this. |
Adam's Apple, Newton's Apple, Apple Computer. . . |
There is a bad apple named HAL in every computer barrel........  |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| Adam's Apple, Newton's Apple, Apple Computer. . . |
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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| Wokko wrote: | | ........, but the ABC is the sole provider to a niche market and I don't see how changing it's funding model from public to private would change it's core demographic. |
Not quite.
The Australian Broadcasting Authority is just that: Australian.
There is Continent wide TV, Radio & Internet amongst other things.
We can hear & watch AFL, VFL Rugby, League, Cricket so on & so forth.
It caters for much more than the term "niche" might suggest.
_________________
“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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watt price tully
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| CP wrote: | .......
Many of you are complete hypocrites.
.......... |
Of course we all understand your singular expertise in this area.
However we at Nicks do make allowances. However this does not permit the making of shrill accusations as a basis for logical indeed rational argument. Rational means based on or in accordance with reason or logic.
The News Limited boss has been shown to be unfit for media ownership given his recent history of ownership & responsibility for the now defunct "News of the World" & their criminal behaviors & activity.
(as an aside, imagine if it were a Muslim who owned News of the World).
The issues here are much bigger than a simple ABC "bad" & News limited "good".
The issue here is the absurd extent of (almost absolute) concentration of media ownership such that your friend Mr Murdoch owns far too much in Australia (let alone the world) , indeed in some capital cities he basically owns the only main media outlets.
(don't get me started on supermarkets & oil companies)
Now if you want a merely compliant media that should abstain from a critique of any Australian Government action, proposal or policy etc then you'd do well in North Korea, Cuba or Russia.
It seems extreme right wing views come awfully close to the so called left of the so called communist states like North Korea & Cuba. The political spectrum may well be a circle.
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman
Last edited by watt price tully on Fri Jan 31, 2014 4:42 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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David 
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| CP wrote: | You're dreaming David.
The only threat that the 'shock jocks and 'hate media' posed was that they weren't providing the free kick in front of goals that the gov't's PR agency (their ABC) was providing.
Don't forget that News Ltd was welcoming and supportive of Kevin Rudd. They were welcoming and supportive of Julia Gillard.
Then between them both they ran the country into oblivion in terms of the budget, honesty, idealistic policy (carbon tax, MRRT, deal plants, etc, etc) and creating a union-controlled state of massive cost pressures on business as well as a welfare state at the same time. Essentially, they fringed the joint right up.
Then News Ltd didn't give them the armchair ride they originally had.
Ask yourself, given the last election result, who was closer to the sentiment of Australians; the 'hate media' and 'shock jocks' or their ABC?
Given your purported love of complete liberty, to think that a media enquiry run by hard-line leftists only into privately-owned media outlets in order to stifle opinion and comment, was a good thing in your opinion, probably proves that you're a 'typical' lefty - ie, if you don't like it, it's wrong, but pretend there's an altruistic, moral reason for it to be wrong and not just because you don't like it.
Also, the ALP/Greens essentially tried to create their own media monopoly with the ABC so don't try that angle the other way. It's ignorant and amateurish. |
There's so much wrong with this post that I don't even know where to begin. Let's start with the assertion that the people proposing media reforms were 'hard-line leftists'. Stephen Conroy, the communications minister in charge of the reforms, is a Christian conservative from the ALP's right faction who staunchly opposed same-sex marriage and earlier tried to censor the Internet because some people might want to watch pornography or learn about abortion or euthanasia. This guy, in your world, is a 'hard-line leftist'. Who's a moderate in this crazy framework, exactly? Miranda Devine? Marine Le Pen? I'd be fascinated to know. And by the way, it's a complete fantasyactually, blatant lie propagated by the very outlets that were crying censorshipthat the policy would have been used to stifle opinion and comment. Take another look and find me the exact proposal that was going to be used in this way.
As for the 'government's PR agency', name one time their news or current affairs arms shamelessly pushed the government's interests. Any time. I'm not asking you to find anything on the level of the stuff put out by Tony Abbott's propaganda squad (Sorry, I mean News Limited), just something that shows they were secretly working to get Rudd and co re-elected.
Once you've done that, I'd love to see some evidence of Australia being "run into oblivion" over the course of the last six years. I mean, wow, for such extreme language I'd be hoping to see at least skyrocketing unemployment rates, massive national debt, economic instability, corruption, destruction of trading prospects, riots in the streets. Perhaps we all have PTSD and are only now starting to remember all that stuff happening. Things were just terrible, weren't they?
I'd say your views are fairly accurately represented by this video:
http://youtu.be/zKZePHDbrDQ
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Lazza
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Bendigo, Victoria, Australia
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[quote="watt price tully"] | CP wrote: | Now if you want a merely compliant media that should abstain from a critique of any Australian Government action, proposal or policy etc then you'd do well in North Korea, Cuba or Russia.
It seems extreme right wing views come awfully close to the so called left of the so called communist states like North Korea & Cuba. The political spectrum may well be a circle. |
Such a thought provoking comment. Brilliant.
I honestly can't fathom what the right wingers want from the ABC. Do they want "all hail mighty Abbott" type of news? Barrack hard for the Aussie cricket team and sledge the opposition? Maybe barrack hard for the Coalition government and sledge the opposition? If an Aussie (anyone from Schapelle to Barlow and Chambers to the Bali 9 or the Aussie Army/Navy/Air force) does the wrong thing overseas, are we to blatantly ignore this and blindly barrack for the home team? Minimise their acts? Maybe accuse the overseas countries of bullshitting so that the ABC is seen as being parochially Aussie in every way? Is this REALLY what Abbott wants to do with the ABC??..... |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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Laza, I think that's your most judiciously used eye-rolling emoticon ever. 
From now on, whenever I hear Abbott talk, my automatic response will be
_________________
All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Lazza
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Bendigo, Victoria, Australia
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| David wrote: | Laza, I think that's your most judiciously used eye-rolling emoticon ever.
From now on, whenever I hear Abbott talk, my automatic response will be |
No worries David, that will be perfect! It's all for a great cause......  
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Wokko 
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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[quote="Lazza"] | watt price tully wrote: | | CP wrote: | Now if you want a merely compliant media that should abstain from a critique of any Australian Government action, proposal or policy etc then you'd do well in North Korea, Cuba or Russia.
It seems extreme right wing views come awfully close to the so called left of the so called communist states like North Korea & Cuba. The political spectrum may well be a circle. |
Such a thought provoking comment. Brilliant.
I honestly can't fathom what the right wingers want from the ABC. Do they want "all hail mighty Abbott" type of news? Barrack hard for the Aussie cricket team and sledge the opposition? Maybe barrack hard for the Coalition government and sledge the opposition? If an Aussie (anyone from Schapelle to Barlow and Chambers to the Bali 9 or the Aussie Army/Navy/Air force) does the wrong thing overseas, are we to blatantly ignore this and blindly barrack for the home team? Minimise their acts? Maybe accuse the overseas countries of bullshitting so that the ABC is seen as being parochially Aussie in every way? Is this REALLY what Abbott wants to do with the ABC??..... |
I thought the ABC had it just about right when they had Andrew Bolt as a panelist on the Insiders with 2 lefties. You don't need 'equality' but an echo chamber like the ABC doesn't help anyone, there needs to be some balance. A lot of Australians are Nationalists and the ABC is still culturally cringing as they sip their chardonnay mocha soy lattes. There's a reason that it's the least watched station (SBS aside because that's still seen as tits and 'ethnics'). Also it seems that the Liberals are largely pushing an objectivist, Randian agenda and state owned media is something that ultra free marketers think is a terrible thing.
I wouldn't be surprised if this is all a prelude to breaking up and privatising the ABC. The fact we've heard about it as an 'uncompetitive monopoly' is a huge flag towards that.
And whoever it was questioned the ABC being a niche market provider, just look at the ratings for their various services. There are certain age and political groups who love the ABC, but the vast majority don't give a shit about it. |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| Not really that much, but thank you anyway. |
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Piesnchess
piesnchess
Joined: 09 Jun 2008
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A Government, any Govt, that cannot handle any critical analysis of its polices, that wants a totally compliant and weak media, that only wants good news items for the "People" to hear about, that uses secrecy as an art form, that wants constant media cheerleading, ala the Murdoch press and shock jocks, is a government on the slippery slope to fascism. !
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Poverty exists not because we cannot feed the poor, but because we cannot satisfy the rich.
Chess and Vodka are born brothers. - Russian proverb. |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| Are all Government a Govt that can not handle a critical analysis of its polices that wants a compliant and weak media that wants good news items for the People to hear about that uses secrecy as an art form that wants constant media cheerleading ala the Murdoch press and shock jocks government on the slippery slope to fascism ? |
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Tannin 
Can't remember
Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania
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| Wokko wrote: | | And whoever it was questioned the ABC being a niche market provider, just look at the ratings for their various services. There are certain age and political groups who love the ABC, but the vast majority don't give a shit about it. |
^ This is just plain wrong.
Time and time again, consistently through the decades from well before you were born and continuing right up to the present day, it has been conclusively demonstrated that the ABC is THE most-trusted news and information source by Australians across the board. Most watch, read, or listen to commercial infotainment most of the time - Channel 9 news, for example, or A Current Affair, or the Herald-Sun - but whenever the chips are down and the news really matters, whenever there is a fire, a war, a flood, a cyclone, a massive political shock, or an earthquake, Australians from all walks of life turn to the ABC because it is far and away the most-trusted source of news and information in this country
"when it comes to public trust, the national broadcaster leaves all other media outfits - print, electronic and online - well and truly in the dust"
Whenever accurate, up-to-date information is vital, Australians turn to the ABC because it's th best. Australians do this regardless of their political stance - Liberal, Labor and Green votors all trust the ABC more than they trust any other media outlet, and by a massive margin.
(Source: Essential Media's twice-a-year survey on media trust, via Crikey. Similar results are reported by other polling organisations, including even the Murdoch Empire's own Newspoll!)
Researcher Rodney Tiffen's remarks are to the point:
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A consistent indeed a stark picture emerges from this polling data, but it is not one you are likely to see highlighted in the Australian. The public has little confidence in the news media as a whole, and the ABC is, overwhelmingly, the most trusted and respected media institution in the country |
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�Let's eat Grandma.� Commas save lives! |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| Tannin wrote: | | Wokko wrote: | | And whoever it was questioned the ABC being a niche market provider, just look at the ratings for their various services. There are certain age and political groups who love the ABC, but the vast majority don't give a shit about it. |
^ This is just plain wrong.
Time and time again, consistently through the decades from well before you were born and continuing right up to the present day, it has been conclusively demonstrated that the ABC is THE most-trusted news and information source by Australians across the board. Most watch, read, or listen to commercial infotainment most of the time - Channel 9 news, for example, or A Current Affair, or the Herald-Sun - but whenever the chips are down and the news really matters, whenever there is a fire, a war, a flood, a cyclone, a massive political shock, or an earthquake, Australians from all walks of life turn to the ABC because it is far and away the most-trusted source of news and information in this country
"when it comes to public trust, the national broadcaster leaves all other media outfits - print, electronic and online - well and truly in the dust"
Whenever accurate, up-to-date information is vital, Australians turn to the ABC because it's th best. Australians do this regardless of their political stance - Liberal, Labor and Green votors all trust the ABC more than they trust any other media outlet, and by a massive margin.
(Source: Essential Media's twice-a-year survey on media trust, via Crikey. Similar results are reported by other polling organisations, including even the Murdoch Empire's own Newspoll!)
Researcher Rodney Tiffen's remarks are to the point:
| Quote: |
A consistent indeed a stark picture emerges from this polling data, but it is not one you are likely to see highlighted in the Australian. The public has little confidence in the news media as a whole, and the ABC is, overwhelmingly, the most trusted and respected media institution in the country |
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You refer to the News which makes up what percentage of their broadcasting? 5%? 2 hours per day would make 8%.
I'd say that apart from the News portion you've covered there, Wokka is totally correct to say the ABC services a niche market.
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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The "niche market" is people who can read and write. Someone should service them. I can scarcely imagine the whining if the ABC decided to give air-time to a serious Marxist. It simply should not be thought necessary to balance mild critique from the middle with equal time for right-wing idiots who have no critique to offer.
Let's face it - the LNP doesn't want the ABC to let the intellectual right loose, it just wants the local equivalent of Sarah Palin to be given more exposure. That's not a program any person with average powers of reasoning or analysis should support. |
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