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Wokko 
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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| 1061 wrote: | | Being that we are a democracy if the majority feel those stickers are correct shouldn't that be Federal Government Policy. |
There is a sizeable minority who feel that way but democracy is the "Tyranny of the majority". Even worse if it is a majority who have those views it doesn't matter, because neither political party will back them.
Immigration is a funny issue and feelings about it are based on tribalism instincts that still pervade the human psyche. Japan doesn't allow immigration of any sizeable level yet are still a respected international power, yet if Australia were to shut down immigration to a bare minimum we'd be calling ourselves racists even though most immigrants are saffies, kiwis and poms  . People who want to fire up the old white Australia policy are another matter altogether of course |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| watt price tully wrote: | I think it was Keating who said:
The ALP are builders & the Libs are wreckers.
1. Allow me to introduce one Christopher Pyne. We finally get a fairer national scheme where education (at least school) education was going to get some much needed funding (Australia is a poor funder of education relative to other developed countries), where the right to a decent education does not rely on parental income. |
Mate, you forget the fact that the bloke the scheme was named after, Gonski, disowned it once he saw what Labor had done to it. A key feature being the impose on universities.
When the libs say they'll scrap Gonski, I'll say fair enough and wait to see what they offer to replace it and cast judgement then.
Regarding education, don't forget that Labor had proposed to cap self education expenses as a tax deduction at $2k pa, the Libs have quashed that.
So under Labor if a Nurse wanted to further their study and do a post grad course or a masters, they would have to basically fund it themselves whereas they get much more tax relief under the previous and now Libs policy.
Judge on content, not on party lines. Just because Labor proposed something doesn't mean it has to be good and vice versa.
Edit, just spotted this.
| Quote: | Christopher Pyne will give the states and territories that did not sign up for Gonski school funding the money they would have received in 2014 if they had, but is not attaching any conditions to it.
The federal education minister has announced $230m in what he called “extra” school funding for the Gonski hold-out states Queensland, Northern Territory and Western Australia. |
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/27/gonski-hold-out-states-to-get-funding
So all the funding promised by Labor to those that signed up to Gonski stays, and those who didn't sign up get it anyway NSA. Downside would be?
Like I said above, lets see what their alternate proposal is before criticising.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Tannin 
Can't remember
Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania
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| Wokko wrote: | | It's a cycle, Labor/Left spends money on infrastructure and the money runs out, then Conservatives come in, stabilize the economy then don't know what to do with it, people then vote the left back in. Trouble is you now have Liberals throwing money around (paid parental leave) and Labor not really building anything of note while claiming to be good managers. It's a race to the middle, and in the middle nothing gets done except pork barrelling and tinkering at the edges of policy. |
Duh. The recent Labor government, as everybody in the country except you knows, were responsible for the biggest and most important infrastructure project seen in Australia since the Snowy Mountains Scheme. That is nation building. That is vision for the future.
PS: Abbott and his mob are busy wrecking it now, undoing all the good work and dooming us to significantly higher total costs once we factor in the inevitable replacement of Turnbull's low-rent, low-capability Fraudband network with a proper modern one that works - one like the one Abbottl is wrecking right now.
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�Let's eat Grandma.� Commas save lives! |
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Wokko
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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| Tannin wrote: | Duh. The recent Labor government, as everybody in the country except you knows, were responsible for the biggest and most important infrastructure project seen in Australia since the Snowy Mountains Scheme. That is nation building. That is vision for the future.
PS: Abbott and his mob are busy wrecking it now, undoing all the good work and dooming us to significantly higher total costs once we factor in the inevitable replacement of Turnbull's low-rent, low-capability Fraudband network with a proper modern one that works - one like the one Abbottl is wrecking right now. |
Labor aren't building it, they £$%$ed around and left it to the Liberals. They had 6 years to work on it and get it right or at least get it well under way, but by leaving it late we now get what we get. They could've at least made iron clad contracts so the Libs can't stop it. The NBN is a shambles, much like everything done under Rudd/Gillard. The idea was top notch, the execution abysmal.
No need to be combative though, I said Labor are the builders. Lets hope the next Labor government is far more competent.
(Also Snowy Mountain Scheme was almost built entirely under the Menzies Liberal government). |
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Culprit 
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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| Gillard a woman breaks a promise she is a liar. Abbott same thing it's just a back flip. |
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Wokko
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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| Culprit wrote: | | Gillard a woman breaks a promise she is a liar. Abbott same thing it's just a back flip. |
Depends which TV station or Newspaper you're consuming. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| Wokko wrote: | | Tannin wrote: | Duh. The recent Labor government, as everybody in the country except you knows, were responsible for the biggest and most important infrastructure project seen in Australia since the Snowy Mountains Scheme. That is nation building. That is vision for the future.
PS: Abbott and his mob are busy wrecking it now, undoing all the good work and dooming us to significantly higher total costs once we factor in the inevitable replacement of Turnbull's low-rent, low-capability Fraudband network with a proper modern one that works - one like the one Abbottl is wrecking right now. |
Labor aren't building it, they £$%$ed around and left it to the Liberals. They had 6 years to work on it and get it right or at least get it well under way, but by leaving it late we now get what we get. They could've at least made iron clad contracts so the Libs can't stop it. The NBN is a shambles, much like everything done under Rudd/Gillard. The idea was top notch, the execution abysmal.
No need to be combative though, I said Labor are the builders. Lets hope the next Labor government is far more competent.
(Also Snowy Mountain Scheme was almost built entirely under the Menzies Liberal government). |
Bolded for truth.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| Wokko wrote: | | Tannin wrote: | Duh. The recent Labor government, as everybody in the country except you knows, were responsible for the biggest and most important infrastructure project seen in Australia since the Snowy Mountains Scheme. That is nation building. That is vision for the future.
PS: Abbott and his mob are busy wrecking it now, undoing all the good work and dooming us to significantly higher total costs once we factor in the inevitable replacement of Turnbull's low-rent, low-capability Fraudband network with a proper modern one that works - one like the one Abbottl is wrecking right now. |
......
(Also Snowy Mountain Scheme was almost built entirely under the Menzies Liberal government). |
Bolded for being misleading: (source: SEN - sorry Wiki)
The SMS was developed in the late 40's (Chifley had won his second term as Leader, needed to pass complex laws, with state involvement & get the mammoth project started). A project doesn't just happen over night & commenced under Ben Chifley in October 1949. He launched the damn thing. Menzies assumed power in December the same year & furthered what was conceived, developed & started by the ALP. Menzies did a fine job too but he did not conceptualise or develop the idea or indeed commence the project.
Chifley also did the following:
Post-war immigration scheme,
The establishment of Australian citizenship,
The Snowy Mountains Scheme, (as noted)
Over-viewing the foundation of airlines Qantas and TAA,
Improvements in social services,
The creation of the Commonwealth Employment Service,
The introduction of federal funds to the States for public housing construction,
The establishment of a Universities Commission for the expansion of university education,
The introduction of a Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme (PBS)
Free hospital ward treatment,
The reorganisation and enlargement of the CSIRO,
The establishment of a civilian rehabilitation service,
The founding of the Australian Security Intelligence Organisation (ASIO), and the establishment of the Australian National University.
This is nation building stuff social fabric building. Which ones will go under the Libs?
Like I said earlier: ALP builders (most of the time) & provide for the majority of the population
Libs social fabric wreckers (most of the time) because they are so beholden to narrow sectional interests such as miners & other miners. 
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough†Kinky Friedman
Last edited by watt price tully on Fri Nov 29, 2013 12:31 am; edited 2 times in total |
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watt price tully
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| stui magpie wrote: | | Wokko wrote: | | Tannin wrote: | Duh. The recent Labor government, as everybody in the country except you knows, were responsible for the biggest and most important infrastructure project seen in Australia since the Snowy Mountains Scheme. That is nation building. That is vision for the future.
PS: Abbott and his mob are busy wrecking it now, undoing all the good work and dooming us to significantly higher total costs once we factor in the inevitable replacement of Turnbull's low-rent, low-capability Fraudband network with a proper modern one that works - one like the one Abbottl is wrecking right now. |
Labor aren't building it, they £$%$ed around and left it to the Liberals. They had 6 years to work on it and get it right or at least get it well under way, but by leaving it late we now get what we get. They could've at least made iron clad contracts so the Libs can't stop it. The NBN is a shambles, much like everything done under Rudd/Gillard. The idea was top notch, the execution abysmal.
No need to be combative though, I said Labor are the builders. Lets hope the next Labor government is far more competent.
(Also Snowy Mountain Scheme was almost built entirely under the Menzies Liberal government). |
Bolded for truth. |
Is it too much Joe McCarthy or Andrew Bolt you're reading? Certainly too much Terry McCrann 
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough†Kinky Friedman |
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Culprit
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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| I'm just loving all these back flips. I am waiting for the "Non-Core" Promise line to be spoken. |
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Morrigu
Joined: 11 Aug 2001
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| stui magpie wrote: | | Bolded for truth. |
More like bolded for bullshite!
They lied ( twice on one subject) simple fact!
"They said the schools were getting the funding they needed and as education spokesperson Christopher Pyne described it:
“... if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it”.
This made the Labor government’s school funding reforms, first discussed formally under the David Gonski review for schools funding, unnecessary. It was, they said, “all feathers and no meat”, “unworkable and grotesquely expensive.”
"But just a few days before the election the Coalition made a back-flip. Opposition leader Tony Abbott announced that he would guarantee the reforms for at least four years.
Before the election both Prime Minister Tony Abbott and Pyne trumpeted their “unity ticket” with Kevin Rudd on Gonski, with Pyne claiming:
“... you can vote Liberal or Labor and you’ll get exactly the same amount of funding for your school."
http://www.independentaustralia.net/politics/politics-display/another-broken-pledge-pyne-says-goodbye-to-gonski,5925
Or you can just be sucked in as you will be if you think abolishing the carbon tax is going to decrease your electricity bills that had massively increased long long before the carbon tax was implemented - enjoy the fools you voted for
_________________
“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.†|
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Wokko
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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| Morrigu wrote: | | stui magpie wrote: | | Bolded for truth. |
More like bolded for bullshite!
They lied ( twice on one subject) simple fact!
"They said the schools were getting the funding they needed and as education spokesperson Christopher Pyne described it:
“... if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it”.
This made the Labor government’s school funding reforms, first discussed formally under the David Gonski review for schools funding, unnecessary. It was, they said, “all feathers and no meat”, “unworkable and grotesquely expensive.”
"But just a few days before the election the Coalition made a back-flip. Opposition leader Tony Abbott announced that he would guarantee the reforms for at least four years.
Before the election both Prime Minister Tony Abbott and Pyne trumpeted their “unity ticket” with Kevin Rudd on Gonski, with Pyne claiming:
“... you can vote Liberal or Labor and you’ll get exactly the same amount of funding for your school."
http://www.independentaustralia.net/politics/politics-display/another-broken-pledge-pyne-says-goodbye-to-gonski,5925
Or you can just be sucked in as you will be if you think abolishing the carbon tax is going to decrease your electricity bills that had massively increased long long before the carbon tax was implemented - enjoy the fools you voted for
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Politicians lie to get elected. More news at 6. |
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1061
Joined: 06 Sep 2013
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| Move over Princess Liar(leah) and let us welcome Princess Pyne. |
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Tannin
Can't remember
Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania
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| Wokko wrote: | | Politicians lie to get elected. More news at 6. |
You are trying to pretend that both sides are the same. They are not the same: Gillard was forced to change her mind by circumstances. Abbott, Hockey, and Pyne deliberately lied to the Australian people just to get elected. They have no credibility now. None.
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�Let's eat Grandma.� Commas save lives! |
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3.14159 
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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| Culprit wrote: | | I'm just loving all these back flips. I am waiting for the "Non-Core" Promise line to be spoken. |
The Carbon Tax was a "core mandate", Gonski is a "non-core mandate". |
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