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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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American Gun culture is more than just movies. People grow up with it, that's what they're used to. Their laws enshrine the right to self defence. Here if someone is trespassing on your property and injures themselves they could sue you. Over there, you just shoot them. No issues.
I've been reading comments on twitter, they seriously don't get it. Some of them genuinely believe the only sensible solution is for more people to have guns. If the teachers had been armed this wouldn't have happened.  FFS.
To be fair, trying to roll back the gun culture over there would be bloody difficult, trying to somehow reduce the number of guns in public hands bloody near impossible.
Unlike Australia which is an island, they have land borders as well as sea borders. They have enough problem with border control stopping the Mexicans and drugs getting in, you reckon they'd have any better luck stopping gun trafficking?
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Skids 
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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| stui magpie wrote: |
I've been reading comments on twitter, they seriously don't get it. Some of them genuinely believe the only sensible solution is for more people to have guns. If the teachers had been armed this wouldn't have happened. FFS.
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What, you reckon if teachers were armed this clown would have shot as many as he did??
There would have been half the fatalities, surely a better option?
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Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| I hadn't thought of that. |
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David 
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| Skids wrote: | | stui magpie wrote: |
I've been reading comments on twitter, they seriously don't get it. Some of them genuinely believe the only sensible solution is for more people to have guns. If the teachers had been armed this wouldn't have happened. FFS.
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What, you reckon if teachers were armed this clown would have shot as many as he did??
There would have been half the fatalities, surely a better option? |
I think the 'eye-rolling' emoticon has never been more appropriate. Here are another few:
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Piethagoras' Theorem 
the hypotenuse, is always a cakewalk
Joined: 29 May 2006
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On a mass murder scale I'd bet the US would be right at the top. I'm also tipping that most of the top 10 countries' firearm related deaths were a result of a feud between 2 parties. Not as many if at all indiscriminate and inexplicable rampages which seem to be a regular occurrence in the States.
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Formally frankiboy and FrankieGoesToCollingwood. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| Skids wrote: | | stui magpie wrote: |
I've been reading comments on twitter, they seriously don't get it. Some of them genuinely believe the only sensible solution is for more people to have guns. If the teachers had been armed this wouldn't have happened. FFS.
|
What, you reckon if teachers were armed this clown would have shot as many as he did??
There would have been half the fatalities, surely a better option? |
Think about this.
Would you want your kids to go to a school where all the teachers carried firearms in case a loony burst in?
Would you be happy to go to the movies in a cinema where the ushers were all armed?
People kill people, guns are a very convenient tool to use for that. Takes no strength or special skill to pull a trigger, you don't have to get up close and personal like with a knife.
The more easily accessible and available firearms are, the more likely that people can do shit like this.
I've read people say that it was either a mental health issue and/or a cultural one and they're probably right. But how many people would he have killed if he walked in with a knife or a baseball bat?
I like guns, I used to own a fuckload of them. But the yanks have just got it wrong. They need to reduce firearms in the community, not arm fkn teachers and ushers and waiters.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Bruno
Joined: 19 Sep 2003
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Spot on Stui
Also, one interesting thing I came across today was the concept of "bullet control".
Not sure if or how it would work, but if a bullet cost $400 the number of guns in circulation wouldn't matter nearly as much.
It might also be worth introducing a requirement where every bullet issued has a registration number. The person buying the bullet would be registered as the owner of that bullet.
I admit, I haven't put much thought into this, but might be worth exploring.
UPDATE ...
Chris Rock agrees...!!! 
http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/98949-you-don-t-need-no-gun-control-you-know-what-you |
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Bruno
Joined: 19 Sep 2003
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| Bruno wrote: | Spot on Stui
Also, one interesting thing I came across today was the concept of "bullet control".
Not sure if or how it would work, but if a bullet cost $400 the number of guns in circulation wouldn't matter nearly as much.
It might also be worth introducing a requirement where every bullet issued has a registration number. The person buying the bullet would be registered as the owner of that bullet.
I admit, I haven't put much thought into this, but might be worth exploring.
UPDATE ...
Chris Rock agrees...!!!
http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/98949-you-don-t-need-no-gun-control-you-know-what-you |
Bullet control won't work that way.
back in the early 80's a mate of mine, who was 16 at the time, had all the equipment in his bedroom to reload his own bullets.
keep the shells, replace the primer, all you need then is gun powder and bullet/shot (if you're reloading shotgun shells)
You can make lead bullets with a mould like making sinkers if you can't buy them.
Absolutely restrict sales of ammunition to make it hard for people to accumulate a stockpile, but restricting gun ownership like Howard introduced here is the key, along with a massive buy back scheme.
Shit, what I handed in to the cops and got a few hundred dollars for was worth thousands to the right buyer, but I wasn't using them just keeping them so I gave them up 
Our gun laws now have worked, without keeping guns out of the hands of people who can substantiate a requirement.
The biggest difference is, we've NEVER had a hand gun culture, they have always been highly restricted.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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swoop42 
Whatcha gonna do when he comes for you?
Joined: 02 Aug 2008
Location: The 18
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So we arm the teachers.
What then happens when one of them goes mental and shoots all the kids in his/her class?.
I tell you what if Americans want guns give them all the right to bare arms that aren't semi/automatic pistols, rifles and shot guns.
Not ideal but it's a start.
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He's mad. He's bad. He's MaynHARD! |
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Dr Pie
Dr Pie
Joined: 08 Nov 2007
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Between 1987 and 1995 Australia had a series of mass shooting murders (Hoddle St., Queen St, Surry Hills[NSW], Strathfield, NSW Central Coast and finally Port Arthur). An attempt at National Gun Control after Hoddle St failed because the smaller states tried to pretend it was a Sydney/Melbourne problem. After Port Arthur all parties and all states supported gun control. In the last 17 years there have been no gun mass murders. The worst incident (Monash in 2002) killed two and injured five. There have been plenty of cases of criminals killing each other (e.g. Carl Williams and the Morans) but no-one ever thought that gun control would disarm the criminals. However it has stopped mass killings by disturbed people. Gun Control has clearly worked in Australia and it would work in America if it was allowed to.
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Born and raised in Black and White |
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3.14159
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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There is a problem with the mystique of the gun.
To an unhinged person, a powerful gun can give a feeling of strength and control over the hostile world around them.
What to do about it I don't know.
But more guns and less control them can only make things worse.
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If my teachers were armed I'd never have told them,
"the dog ate my homework."
Last edited by 3.14159 on Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:35 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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London Dave 
Ješte jedna pivo prosím
Joined: 16 Dec 1998
Location: Iceland on Thames
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| stui magpie wrote: | | Skids wrote: | | stui magpie wrote: |
I've been reading comments on twitter, they seriously don't get it. Some of them genuinely believe the only sensible solution is for more people to have guns. If the teachers had been armed this wouldn't have happened. FFS.
|
What, you reckon if teachers were armed this clown would have shot as many as he did??
There would have been half the fatalities, surely a better option? |
Think about this.
Would you want your kids to go to a school where all the teachers carried firearms in case a loony burst in?
Would you be happy to go to the movies in a cinema where the ushers were all armed?
People kill people, guns are a very convenient tool to use for that. Takes no strength or special skill to pull a trigger, you don't have to get up close and personal like with a knife.
The more easily accessible and available firearms are, the more likely that people can do shit like this.
I've read people say that it was either a mental health issue and/or a cultural one and they're probably right. But how many people would he have killed if he walked in with a knife or a baseball bat?
I like guns, I used to own a fuckload of them. But the yanks have just got it wrong. They need to reduce firearms in the community, not arm fkn teachers and ushers and waiters. |
Arming everyone would probably have the opposite effect to the intention.
I don't think arming everyone is the brightest of ideas.. when that Congresswoman in Arizona was shot (Gifford?) there were people in the crowd with guns, who shot at who they thought was the assailant, but had identified the wrong person. Fortunately, they missed.
From the time I spent in NYC, it was amazing how many locals I met would say to me things along the line of "Australia has pretty strict gun laws don't they?" to which I'd reply yup. They'd follow up with "I wish we had that here!". Conversely, my relatives out in Texas and Alaska had more guns than beers in the house. Just goes to show the contradictory nature of the US. Find a stereotype, and I'll find a case where the opposite is true.
At the end of the day, a lot of parents have lost their kids, and kids their parents. Just tragic. Hopefully some good will come out of this, but it's not the way I'd be betting. |
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Tannin 
Can't remember
Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Location: Huon Valley Tasmania
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WTF? Why do we have a 4 page thread about short-sleeved shirts?
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�Let's eat Grandma.� Commas save lives! |
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Jezza
2023 PREMIERS!
Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End
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| Dr Pie wrote: | | Between 1987 and 1995 Australia had a series of mass shooting murders (Hoddle St., Queen St, Surry Hills[NSW], Strathfield, NSW Central Coast and finally Port Arthur). An attempt at National Gun Control after Hoddle St failed because the smaller states tried to pretend it was a Sydney/Melbourne problem. After Port Arthur all parties and all states supported gun control. In the last 17 years there have been no gun mass murders. The worst incident (Monash in 2002) killed two and injured five. There have been plenty of cases of criminals killing each other (e.g. Carl Williams and the Morans) but no-one ever thought that gun control would disarm the criminals. However it has stopped mass killings by disturbed people. Gun Control has clearly worked in Australia and it would work in America if it was allowed to. |
Spot on Dr.Pie. I totally agree with everything you say. I think it's naive to think that having strict gun control means no guns would exist in the wider community, but it certainly reduces the number of mass murders that would occur in the United States or even in this case it's reduced that number in Australia by quite a substantial amount.
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Last edited by Jezza on Sat Dec 15, 2012 11:11 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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