Nick's Collingwood Bulletin Board Forum Index
 The RulesThe Rules FAQFAQ
   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   CalendarCalendar   SearchSearch 
Log inLog in RegisterRegister
 
What made you happy today?

Users browsing this topic:0 Registered, 0 Hidden and 0 Guests
Registered Users: None

Post new topic   This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.    Nick's Collingwood Bulletin Board Forum Index -> Victoria Park Tavern
 
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 714, 715, 716 ... 864, 865, 866  Next
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 8:02 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

David wrote:
Not sure why you thought my head would explode! I watched the whole thing; it seems like a fairly standard explanation of marketing that is sometimes interesting and sometimes a bit dubious and oversimplified.

It's certainly true that we tend to be more inspired by 'visionary' figures than people going through the motions; but beyond that, I am sure that there are plenty of absolutely cynical, profit-oriented people who've done very well for themselves in business, and plenty of 'true believers' who have lacked the skills or resources to make a name for themselves. Placing the Wright brothers and Samuel Pierpont Langley on opposite sides of that spectrum and decreeing that their respective success or failure was a result of their motivations seems like a fairly eyebrow-raising post-hoc narrative.

I did find his bell-curve chart about the percentage of the population required to attain mass-market appeal interesting, though – that bit probably stands up.

What made you want to attend this leadership conference? I've never set foot inside one, but I have to say I'm a little sceptical of the benefits of such events and suspect they attract more than their fair share of snake oil salespeople.


I watched it but there was nothing about bell charts or marketing, so maybe we watched different things. Instead it was a talk about trust and leadership. I liked it, and he is an excellent speaker, with a good sense of timing, pace and rhythm. There was certainly much truth in what he said, though (a) it is only one part of the equation governing "would i like to work for this individual?" ... and (b) these things are inevitably a lot easier in a conference hall than they are in a bustling world of sharply competing priorities. Still, taken for what it is, it was good.

The best leadership talk I have ever been to was by a fellow called Stephen Bungay, who examined the first day of the Battle of the Somme, from multiple levels - the individual soldier's experience, the captain's tactical level, and the generals strategic view, both on the German and British sides. He showed how people made the decisions they did because of the forces that were operating on them at the time, and how they might have overcome these forces to make better decisions. He also showed how the Germans were so much more effective because they trusted their troops to make decisions at the right operational level. He then drew some striking and very practical lessons for business leadership from these three strands. It was amazing.

_________________
Two more flags before I die!
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 8:07 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

^

I thought David's head might explode because of the compliments paid to the armed forces in the first couple of minutes.

Glad you enjoyed it, I thought he was very good live.

_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down.
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 8:15 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

^ like most people I've worked for a few exceptionally good people and a few stinkers in my 33 years, and a lot who were ok. I still don't know if leadership training is much use, and I tend to file it under "can't hurt, and might help a bit". Amazing how many people make a living out of doing it.
_________________
Two more flags before I die!
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Dark Beanie Gemini



Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Location: A galaxy far, far away.

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 1:10 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

Morrigu wrote:
Got Midnight Oil at Hanging Rock tickets! Very Happy Very Happy


Just got tickets for the 2nd show in Melbourne on the 8 November.

_________________
If you are foolish enough to be contented, don't show it, but just grumble with the rest. - Jerome K Jerome
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail  
stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 6:30 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

^

Yeah, I'll pass on the 'training' but going to listen to a bloke speak at a conference and get a few ideas out of it I'll take.

Learned a few things, even that some of the things i do on a day to day basis are considered leadership (who knew? Shocked I just thought it was common courtesy )

Oh, and Jo, Shanks Pony is an old term for walking. Razz Wink

_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down.
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 8:48 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

stui magpie wrote:
^

Yeah, I'll pass on the 'training' but going to listen to a bloke speak at a conference and get a few ideas out of it I'll take.

Learned a few things, even that some of the things i do on a day to day basis are considered leadership (who knew? Shocked I just thought it was common courtesy )

Oh, and Jo, Shanks Pony is an old term for walking. Razz Wink


You wrote once before about how you approach managing people, and it sounded pretty spot-on to me. I've managed reasonably big departments of large corporates and my supposition is that people just want someone who (i) respects their professionalism ; (ii) is honest but tactful and basically on their side even when they need to be pulled up ; (iii) who's competent in his or her field, and (iv) who's positive about building a future they can believe in.

Very simple to write - quite hard to do all the time. The leadership conferences don't hurt, but they don't make it where it ain't.

_________________
Two more flags before I die!
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
think positive Libra

Side By Side


Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 9:25 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

stui magpie wrote:
^

Yeah, I'll pass on the 'training' but going to listen to a bloke speak at a conference and get a few ideas out of it I'll take.

Learned a few things, even that some of the things i do on a day to day basis are considered leadership (who knew? Shocked I just thought it was common courtesy )

Oh, and Jo, Shanks Pony is an old term for walking. Razz Wink


Oh, how the hell does that work!

_________________
You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either!
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 9:39 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

Mugwump wrote:
stui magpie wrote:
^

Yeah, I'll pass on the 'training' but going to listen to a bloke speak at a conference and get a few ideas out of it I'll take.

Learned a few things, even that some of the things i do on a day to day basis are considered leadership (who knew? Shocked I just thought it was common courtesy )

Oh, and Jo, Shanks Pony is an old term for walking. Razz Wink


You wrote once before about how you approach managing people, and it sounded pretty spot-on to me. I've managed reasonably big departments of large corporates and my supposition is that people just want someone who (i) respects their professionalism ; (ii) is honest but tactful and basically on their side even when they need to be pulled up ; (iii) who's competent in his or her field, and (iv) who's positive about building a future they can believe in.

Very simple to write - quite hard to do all the time. The leadership conferences don't hurt, but they don't make it where it ain't.


Cheers mate.

I got what i'll consider a top compliment last week. I was talking to a girl about some issues she was having, she's a direct report to one of my current direct reports (usually a peer)

Long story short, when the discussion turned to my acting role, I've been acting head of HR now since before Xmas, she commented that I hadn't changed. I'll take that.

_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down.
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 9:43 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

think positive wrote:
stui magpie wrote:
^

Yeah, I'll pass on the 'training' but going to listen to a bloke speak at a conference and get a few ideas out of it I'll take.

Learned a few things, even that some of the things i do on a day to day basis are considered leadership (who knew? Shocked I just thought it was common courtesy )

Oh, and Jo, Shanks Pony is an old term for walking. Razz Wink


Oh, how the hell does that work!


i dunno, blame the Scots apparently. Shank, leg.............

_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down.
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Pa Marmo 

Side by Side


Joined: 16 Jun 2003
Location: Nicks BB member #617

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 6:42 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

stui magpie wrote:
think positive wrote:
stui magpie wrote:
^

Yeah, I'll pass on the 'training' but going to listen to a bloke speak at a conference and get a few ideas out of it I'll take.

Learned a few things, even that some of the things i do on a day to day basis are considered leadership (who knew? Shocked I just thought it was common courtesy )

Oh, and Jo, Shanks Pony is an old term for walking. Razz Wink


Oh, how the hell does that work!


i dunno, blame the Scots apparently. Shank, leg.............


Shanks are your ankles and shins (like lamb shanks), your ankles and shins ride on your feet, hence your feet are shanks ponies.

_________________
Genesis 1:1
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
luvdids Sagittarius



Joined: 22 Mar 2008
Location: work

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:18 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

stui magpie wrote:
I've been acting head of HR now since before Xmas


Have to finally ask - what does a HR department actually do? I hear about HR all the time but what the actual role is? No clue. Other than arranging meetings to discuss workplace stuff I'm lost.

Re the seminar - I've been sent to so many of those (which, since they were at the Palazzo Versace on the Gold Coast over 4 days I convinced my boss that of course I would benefit from going! Wink). Yeah, I got inspired for a week or so. They had some amazing speakers with great stories. But oh my the spa in the room was awesome.
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 6:35 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

luvdids wrote:
stui magpie wrote:
I've been acting head of HR now since before Xmas


Have to finally ask - what does a HR department actually do? I hear about HR all the time but what the actual role is? No clue. Other than arranging meetings to discuss workplace stuff I'm lost.



hah

In a large organisation there's the day to day and the higher level stuff.

The day to day stuff includes payroll, recruitment, OH&S, policy queries and legislative compliance.

then you got supporting managers in dealing with misconduct, poor performance, Industrial relations, org change, grievances (eg bullying and/or harassment complaints)

The higher level stuff includes things like developing frameworks for performance appraisals, talent management and succession planning, coordinating employee surveys, analysing the data and developing interventions, developing and conducting management and leadership training, reward & recognition etc.

The idea is that organisations only achieve results through their employees. The role of HR is to support the organisation in achieving those goals. It's all people related which is why most places now are using the term "People and Culture" rather than HR

You can hire good people but if you've got shit managers and shit people management systems, you won't get results.

A small business doesn't need/can't justify a HR function but it's an essential part of any larger business.

_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down.
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:29 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

stui magpie wrote:
luvdids wrote:
stui magpie wrote:
I've been acting head of HR now since before Xmas


Have to finally ask - what does a HR department actually do? I hear about HR all the time but what the actual role is? No clue. Other than arranging meetings to discuss workplace stuff I'm lost.



hah

In a large organisation there's the day to day and the higher level stuff.

The day to day stuff includes payroll, recruitment, OH&S, policy queries and legislative compliance.

then you got supporting managers in dealing with misconduct, poor performance, Industrial relations, org change, grievances (eg bullying and/or harassment complaints)

The higher level stuff includes things like developing frameworks for performance appraisals, talent management and succession planning, coordinating employee surveys, analysing the data and developing interventions, developing and conducting management and leadership training, reward & recognition etc.

The idea is that organisations only achieve results through their employees. The role of HR is to support the organisation in achieving those goals. It's all people related which is why most places now are using the term "People and Culture" rather than HR

You can hire good people but if you've got shit managers and shit people management systems, you won't get results.

A small business doesn't need/can't justify a HR function but it's an essential part of any larger business.


^ What he said. HR, done well, is really important and very value-adding. The trouble is that it can become a donkey sanctuary because the rules and measures of HR are less clear than they are for other functions, so sometimes weaker performers gravitate to it. For sales and marketing, you measure product revenues ; in Finance, you have accounting. In manufacturing or operations, safety cost and reliability/quality. In HR it's much harder to decide whether they are doing a good job. But good HR people are bloody valuable precisely because the issues can be so ambiguous. In our business we mix HR career types with higher potentials fed through HR to test them, and it works well.

I think of HR as the organisation's custodian of people. We all work for managers - but line managers are often conflicted between their own interests and those of the business - "this one's good - I gotta keep her" ; "useless - pass them on to someone else" ; "not really cutting it but I like them too much to say so". Good HR people help the more mature managers to get this right, and push/drag the weaker managers to think of the bigger picture.

That's all in addition to the infrastructural stuff that Stui talked about : HR systems, equitable treatment, recruitment processes etc.

_________________
Two more flags before I die!
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
luvdids Sagittarius



Joined: 22 Mar 2008
Location: work

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:40 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

It's sort of what I was thinking. Although at my work pretty much all of that is done by our admin department. Thought there may have been something more specialised to it. But thanks for the clarification - one of those things I keep hearing but was never really defined. Smile
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:43 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

^ Closest analogy in football is the List Manager, plus the admin department that deals with the employment contracts, I guess.
_________________
Two more flags before I die!
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.    Nick's Collingwood Bulletin Board Forum Index -> Victoria Park Tavern All times are GMT + 11 Hours

Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 714, 715, 716 ... 864, 865, 866  Next
Page 715 of 866   

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum



Privacy Policy

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group