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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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| ^ They want them to die without other humans being responsible for their deaths... just as I don't wish bad injuries on any AFL players, but if they happen I'd really like them to happen to key Tigers (R&R come to mind). |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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Just had the grandson, Sharknado, for bit over an hour. His mum has had a tanty and wants to hand the kid over by 6pm on Friday. Problem with that is my son often doesn't get home from work til after 7pm. She doesn't want him coming to her place and she won't drop the kid at his place with who might be there cos she doesn't like getting a lecture. So my place it was.
Kid was wound up like a chinese clock, I can only assume from his normal diet at his mums place of sugar, caffeine and preservatives. managed to settle him down, then he wanted a banana, so I gave him one. After he inhaled that he went into hyperdrive for about 10 minutes before I settled him down again.
Good kid, but geez he's a handful. I'd much rather have him during the day when I can take him outside and let him run amok, but 2 1/2 years old he's already addicted to screens.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| K wrote: | | ^ They want them to die without other humans being responsible for their deaths... just as I don't wish bad injuries on any AFL players, but if they happen I'd really like them to happen to key Tigers (R&R come to mind). |
Yes, I know the rationalization. But when you applaud a death because someone has committed an unspeakable act, you have bought into the concept of ultimate justice. However much I might like having lions on the earth, I consider them no more important than innocent humans.
In fact, having observed a group of lions very, very slowly gnaw a screaming wildebeest to death, including ripping off its genitals while it was fully alive, I think lions are a little romanticized. I dislike safari hunting for many reasons, but the level of sentimentality about animals seems to me to require a certain suspension of mind.
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Two more flags before I die! |
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think positive 
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| Mugwump wrote: | | K wrote: | | ^ They want them to die without other humans being responsible for their deaths... just as I don't wish bad injuries on any AFL players, but if they happen I'd really like them to happen to key Tigers (R&R come to mind). |
Yes, I know the rationalization. But when you applaud a death because someone has committed an unspeakable act, you have bought into the concept of ultimate justice. However much I might like having lions on the earth, I consider them no more important than innocent humans.
In fact, having observed a group of lions very, very slowly gnaw a screaming wildebeest to death, including ripping off its genitals while it was fully alive, I think lions are a little romanticized. I dislike safari hunting for many reasons, but the level of sentimentality about animals seems to me to require a certain suspension of mind. |
I have to say I can’t watch those national geographic shows. But they kill for food, not trophies and the odds are never in their favour.
**** em, just don’t kill the lions! I’m not applauding their death but I just don’t care.
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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K
Joined: 09 Sep 2011
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| Mugwump wrote: | ...
In fact, having observed a group of lions very, very slowly gnaw a screaming wildebeest to death, including ripping off its genitals while it was fully alive, I think lions are a little romanticized. I dislike safari hunting for many reasons, but the level of sentimentality about animals seems to me to require a certain suspension of mind. |
Why did they do that? I think domesticated cats are really evil, and had thought that the wild variety did not have that evil element. Is that wrong?
Part of the problem with domesticated cats is their owners, who seem to think it's fine for them to slaughter hundreds of thousands of birds a year (for example). |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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luvdids 
Joined: 22 Mar 2008
Location: work
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| Mugwump wrote: | | Like most people, I cheered this story, and then reflected that most of the people standing and applauding are against the death penalty for humans who willfully kill other humans. We are a strange species. |
Really? How many is "most", where did this stat come from?
I'm glad the lions killed them & am also in favour of the death penalty for humans who wilfully kill other humans.
Your post about watching a lion kill a wildebeest.... so? That's what they do, it's nature, kill or be killed. As unpleasant as it is to watch it's what happens in the wild.
Having armed poachers shooting animals that obviously can't defend themselves against manmade weapons is not a fair fight. Would you have preferred the scumbag poachers be killed by the armed rangers whose job it is to protect the animals that can't protect themselves?
As a post on facebook I saw said, it's just a shame the lions didn't stop for a selfie to post on social media like the disgusting cretins that trophy hunt animals do. Hopefully one of them kept a head to mount on their wall. |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| luvdids wrote: | | Mugwump wrote: | | Like most people, I cheered this story, and then reflected that most of the people standing and applauding are against the death penalty for humans who willfully kill other humans. We are a strange species. |
Really? How many is "most", where did this stat come from?
I'm glad the lions killed them & am also in favour of the death penalty for humans who wilfully kill other humans.
Your post about watching a lion kill a wildebeest.... so? That's what they do, it's nature, kill or be killed. As unpleasant as it is to watch it's what happens in the wild.
Having armed poachers shooting animals that obviously can't defend themselves against manmade weapons is not a fair fight. Would you have preferred the scumbag poachers be killed by the armed rangers whose job it is to protect the animals that can't protect themselves?
As a post on facebook I saw said, it's just a shame the lions didn't stop for a selfie to post on social media like the disgusting cretins that trophy hunt animals do. Hopefully one of them kept a head to mount on their wall. |
I’m delighted that you support the restoration of the death penalty. It’s loss has been a cornerstone of the historic surge in civil thuggery and murder which has been much discussed on here.
I also stated that I’m against safari hunting on many grounds, and I said that I cheered the fact that the hunter got his mortal comeuppance at the hands of this beast. You seem to imply that I am not. Sorry, but I can’t help you with that.
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Two more flags before I die! |
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luvdids
Joined: 22 Mar 2008
Location: work
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| Missed my point altogether, which I can't help you with. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| K wrote: | | Mugwump wrote: | ...
In fact, having observed a group of lions very, very slowly gnaw a screaming wildebeest to death, including ripping off its genitals while it was fully alive, I think lions are a little romanticized. I dislike safari hunting for many reasons, but the level of sentimentality about animals seems to me to require a certain suspension of mind. |
Why did they do that? I think domesticated cats are really evil, and had thought that the wild variety did not have that evil element. Is that wrong?
Part of the problem with domesticated cats is their owners, who seem to think it's fine for them to slaughter hundreds of thousands of birds a year (for example). |
The animals aren't evil, they just aren't humans and have none of our emotions, morals and hangups.
The lions would have chewed the wildebeests balls because they were tasty. They wouldn't care if it was still alive or not, it was just a meal.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| K wrote: | | Mugwump wrote: | ...
In fact, having observed a group of lions very, very slowly gnaw a screaming wildebeest to death, including ripping off its genitals while it was fully alive, I think lions are a little romanticized. I dislike safari hunting for many reasons, but the level of sentimentality about animals seems to me to require a certain suspension of mind. |
Why did they do that? I think domesticated cats are really evil, and had thought that the wild variety did not have that evil element. Is that wrong?
Part of the problem with domesticated cats is their owners, who seem to think it's fine for them to slaughter hundreds of thousands of birds a year (for example). |
Oh the lion was just doing what it is programmed to do with an identifiable piece of edible flesh that was exposed when two other lions held the wildebeest down. My only point was that nature is very cruel, and we are unwise to sentimentalise animals.
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Two more flags before I die! |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| luvdids wrote: | | Missed my point altogether, which I can't help you with. |
It seemed the least I could do, since you missed my original point by rather more.
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Two more flags before I die! |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| Mugwump wrote: | | Like most people, I cheered this story, and then reflected that most of the people standing and applauding are against the death penalty for humans who willfully kill other humans. We are a strange species. |
This is precisely why I don’t cheer stories like this. While some people might do so and still oppose capital punishment, I actually suspect that attitudes to stories like these would tend to correlate with attitudes to the death penalty. That’s because at the core of both is a belief in the value of human life (even for ‘bad’ people) vs an emotive desire to see bad guys get their comeuppance. So I don’t actually think there’s a great deal of cognitive dissonance here at all.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| David wrote: | | Mugwump wrote: | | Like most people, I cheered this story, and then reflected that most of the people standing and applauding are against the death penalty for humans who willfully kill other humans. We are a strange species. |
This is precisely why I don’t cheer stories like this. While some people might do so and still oppose capital punishment, I actually suspect that attitudes to stories like these would tend to correlate with attitudes to the death penalty. That’s because at the core of both is a belief in the value of human life (even for ‘bad’ people) vs an emotive desire to see bad guys get their comeuppance. So I don’t actually think there’s a great deal of cognitive dissonance here at all. |
There is, of course, a sensible middle ground. I don’t cheer for lions that kill people (although it’s hard not to be amused by the tables being turned) but I certainly think that people who go out on safari to kill things and then get killed doing it, even though the odds are so heavily stacked in their favour, probably don’t warrant particular concern. They’re an occasional consequence of stupidity, like people who fall off cliffs taking selfies, the difference being that people taking selfies aren’t doing anything intrinsically wicked (however much it makes us want to puke), whilst people who kill wild animals for fun are often doing active harm. |
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